Green Acres, 80 gal high tech - Page 22 - The Planted Tank Forum
 742Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #316 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-07-2019, 07:22 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
Added a Truelumen Flora bulb last night to see how it looks. 110 PAR at the substrate... I'll give that a go for a week to see how things react, but will probably end up raising the fixture. I'm not sure I want to deal with that much light.
Immortal1 likes this.
Phil Edwards is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #317 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 03:15 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
Date
06/08/19

Date Time pH NO3 PO4
6.8.19 09:54 7.01 45.0 0.10


NO3 and PO4 tests were done with Seachem NO2/NO3 and PO4 tests.


I added a fair amount of Osmocote+ (approx 1 pellet per plant with a full gelcap near large groups of plants) two days prior. Nothing else was added to the water at this time. What's interesting, but not terribly surprising is the amount of NO3. The pellets are 15-9-12 and NO3 isn't conserved well in soils so I expected some diffusion; just not 45ppm. 5 pellets had become exposed and were pushed back down into the substrate during the water change. Two or three pellets get exposed each day and get pushed back down to the glass. I don't know if this is due to bioturbation or the pellets getting pushed up when gas releases from the substrate.

Observations: Most of the stems are noticeably pale or fully chlorotic; the H. siamensis 53B has widespread pinholes (I added some K2SO4 gelcaps near it on the 6th), R. macrandra is significantly stunted from how it was a week ago, the Ammania (?) has curling around the leaf margins, R. mexicana (?) is barely getting by with tiny new growth at multiple nodes, R. H'ra seems to be doing alright but is a slow grower, Limnophila sp. 'Mini' (?), is in very bad shape, and the R. tulunadensis is scraping by with new growth being rotund and small, much like R. rotundifolia's emergent form. The H. corymbosa, L. repens and variants, Crypts, B. japonica, and H. 'Porto Velho' (?) are all happy. The remaining P. helferi and P. erectus stems are recovering nicely.

Time to do a 50% water change and add 1L of Pond Matrix to the sump.

Additions at WC: 1/2tsp Baking Soda and 3 tbsp of Florin Delta GH+, up from the regular 2. When looking more closely during the water change a number of plants were showing pinholes and some leaf tip curling. Now that the tank is full of high-demand stem plants and the light's higher than before it seems reasonable that the system would require more Ca, Mg, and K; especially given plant health observations. I still don't want to mess around with dosing single materials, but I may have to if things keep progressing like this.
Greggz and Maryland Guppy like this.

Last edited by Phil Edwards; 06-08-2019 at 04:30 PM. Reason: .
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #318 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-08-2019, 08:27 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
6.8.19, 15:20- Ran the NO3 test again post WC with the same color result. Either I'm contaminating the test somehow (better stop peeing on my hands!) or concentrations are above detection limits.

I added 1L Pond Matrix this morning post-WC and will add another liter daily going forward until there's a detectable drop in NO3.

Last edited by Phil Edwards; 06-08-2019 at 09:23 PM. Reason: .
Phil Edwards is offline  
 
post #319 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 03:09 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
6.10.19-

Added somewhere around 1.4ppm PO4 (approx 1/8 tsp in 90 gallons), according to rotalabutterfly. CO2 was good, but the plants have been suffering (some badly), there's been little pearling, and the prior reading of 0.1 ppm and all that NO3 finally added up. As anticipated, pearling went through the roof. I'm pretty sure there's plenty of P in the substrate; it may just take more time for the stems to build stronger root systems to access it. I realize adding the PO4 throws a wrench in the plan to not add N and P to the water, but I'm not willing to wipe out the tank quite yet for "science" as we're getting into the worst part of the year for shipping replacement plants to the Southeast. The 1L/day addition of Pond Matrix is still going forward and NO3 gets tested again today.

Some small bits of BBA and Staghorn have starting showing up with the affected leaves getting removed. A modest amount of Purigen was added directly under the drain into the sump two days ago. Hopefully that'll have some beneficial effect.

The animals are all perky and eating well. Small victories.
Immortal1 likes this.
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #320 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 08:26 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
6.10.19 Chemo Brain Strikes Again!

I'd forgotten all about rotalabutterfly until I wanted to check yesterday's PO4 dosing, DERP. I checked the GH booster I'm using, and at 3 tbsp K is approx. 27 mg/L! No wonder the plants are angry with me; especially with the extra K in the Osmocote. I did a 70% water change and added 1 tbsp GH booster (approx. 9 mg/L K, 3.8 mg/L Ca, and 1.10 mg/L Mg) then added 15 mg/L worth of Ca liquid and approx. 7 mg/L of Mg liquid. It also got the same dose of KH2PO4 (approx. 1.4 mg/L) and the usual dose of CSM+B. With all the fluctuation going on the "study" is going to have to be delayed until the supplementation schedule is figured out and the plants have a chance to recover. I did add the 1L of Pond Matrix to get it seeded. At some point in the near future I should be getting some USP grade CaCl2 and MgSO4 powders in the mail.

The new plan is to let the plants recover, grow everything out to the point where the tank can be properly aquascaped, get the filter media switched out to only the matrix, then restart the lean water column regimen. I've got to say, the initial reactions have been interesting and I look forward to seeing how things recover. I've long suspected that high K concentrations cause stems; particularly most Rotala, to lean rather than grow upright. While not a sure confirmation, it seems to be the case for the most part.
Greggz likes this.

Last edited by Phil Edwards; 06-10-2019 at 08:34 PM. Reason: .
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #321 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 09:00 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
Pictures! I'm still not sure what all everyone sent, so if you see something you know, please ID it for me. Nearly all of the gifted plants came in bags of multiple species with the contents on the outside of the bag, or weren't labeled at all, and most species/variants are new to me so it's been difficult to ID them. @burr740, @vvDO, @Maryland Guppy, @Immortal1, @Saxa Tilly. Sorry for the shoddy pictures, even on sport mode the camera sometimes has a hard time dealing with my shaky hands.

1. C. willisi


2. Unknown L. repens variant


3. Store-bought H. pinnatifida


4. H. siamensis 53B


5. A. crassicaulis?


6. P. stellata (either regular or Kimberly, I'm not sure. I got both in the same bag and can't tell the difference)


7. Unknown


8. Green Limnophila? Unsure


9. P. erectus


10. Donated and store-bought L. cardinalis (donated on left)


11. H. araguaia?


12. L. repens 'Super Red'?


13. L, inclinata 'Pantanal'


14. P. sampsonii?


15. B. japonica


16. Unknown


17. Store-bought M. pteropus


18. Rotala 'Vietnam/H'ra'?


19. Rotala 'Mexicana'?


20. R. tulunadensis


21. C. wendtii 'Tropica'


22. L. repens, variant unknown


23. Unknown; some sort of Ludwigia?


24. Unknown


25. B. australis or L. rotundifolia?


26. Donated and store-bought H. corymbosa 'Kompact'




Thanks!
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #322 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-10-2019, 10:12 PM
Captain
 
Immortal1's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Edwards View Post
Pictures! I'm still not sure what all everyone sent, so if you see something you know, please ID it for me.

6. P. stellata Kimberly - I sent you 2 of these



12. L. repens 'Super Red' - I sent you 4-5 stems of these


22. L. sp Atlantis - I sent you 1 or 2 stems. Leaves will have more of an orange appearance with veins


23. L. Arcuata - think I sent you a few stems of this. In my tank it grows very fast with long internodes. Skinnier orangeish leaves.


26. H. corymbosa 'Kompact' - I sent you 5-6 of these


Thanks!

Selected and noted what I could remember from 05-11-2019 message.
Greggz likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Immortal1 is online now  
post #323 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-11-2019, 07:20 AM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
Thanks Linn! With so many people keeping the same plants these days I got a few doubles, but being from different tanks, they looked different and got planted separately. It's good to know what's what, and I don't want to be sending out misidentified cuttings when the time comes.
Immortal1 likes this.
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #324 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 02:35 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
Heh, just found an old podcast I did back in 2013. If you've got a few hours to listen to me babble about planted tanks, or need something to help you sleep, click below.

The Planted Aquarium - Setting Up a Planted Tank Part 1 02/26 by Pet World Radio | Hobbies
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #325 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 02:40 PM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Maryland
Posts: 804
I thought 16 might be l. arcuata and 23 arcuata x repens but I could be wrong could both be arcuata or I could be totally wrong about 16
Wobblebonk is offline  
post #326 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 02:59 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,675
23 looks like L.brevipes

Ammannia is senegalensis.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.
Maryland Guppy is online now  
post #327 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 04:30 PM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Maryland
Posts: 804
Well I'm gonna stand by 16 looks like arcuata to me...
Wobblebonk is offline  
post #328 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-23-2019, 01:06 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
Phil Edwards's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 1,657
6.23.19- Forum titles and Impostor Syndrome

Hello friends, it's time for Waxing Philosophical with Phil!

This isn't a pity-party post asking for reassurance. Rather, it's something I'm going through at the moment, think it's something we all go through at times, and want to talk about. So often we focus on the technical and artistic aspects of our joint hobby here but rarely about the social and emotional aspects that go with anything having creative and educational elements. Call it being someone who's heavily influenced by feelings (Meyers-Briggs INFP) or the ups and downs of bipolar, or whatever else it may be, but at least for me, this hobby has a significant emotional component to it and that's something we don't talk about much. With little to mention about the tank right now, I thought this would be a good time and place to have a discussion of the more philosophical sides of our hobby and community.

I was just reading current posts on the beginner's AMA thread and noticed my forum title is "Wannabe Guru". Normally I don't put stock in things like that (post count FTW), but for some reason it struck me as being true this morning. After all the years of keeping plants and working as an aquatics professional I can't count the times I've given people advice on how to start out or improve things in this hobby, yet I still have (sometimes significant) difficulties doing the things I'm supposed to be well qualified to do. How can I give advice to folks when I can't reliably/repeatedly do it myself? I've had enough people tell me over the years how my advice has helped them solve problems or improve how they keep planted tanks to know, on an intellectual level, that I know what I'm talking about. However, the reality of my own tanks doesn't always support it. So many of you Usual Suspects who regularly contribute to this thread are pushing our understanding of the hobby to new and interesting places and here I am struggling to keep simple and easy plants happy and healthy. How can I rightly give advise people when I can't seem to do it myself at times? Wannabe seems a fitting moniker these days.

Have you ever felt this way? If so, why and for what specific reasons? How have you dealt with it/are dealing with it?
Phil Edwards is offline  
post #329 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-23-2019, 02:49 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
ipkiss's Avatar
 
PTrader: (3/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 1,278
I'd like to think what you are describing as doubt might just be the beginning of wisdom.

But, that would be a very prideful thing to say and wisdom is not prideful.

We all aspire to be more wise in our lives but does recognizing that aspiration, then becomes pride too?

I'm not wise enough to know that one. Perhaps it's this very doubt that keeps wisdom humble.

Live wisely, but one should be wise enough to not acknowledge it as such. Otherwise, we may stop aspiring to do so.

I will, one day, many years from now, hope to be and hope all of you who read this and many others to be healthy enough and sound of mind enough to see this very post of mine and wonder what ailed me to say such things. To doubt myself. To berate my younger self for being prideful enough to even try to describe wisdom.

Edit:
Augh, did I go off the deep end? Perhaps it's not anything that transcendent. Look, I think, let's approach this from a stewardship angle. It's our responsibility to the hobby to at least hold the hands of those who seemingly need help. You guys have all taught me that in your postings. Whether the advice is spot on or not, the service of providing the advice is enough sometimes. It has to be. By giving an answer, you've given a person who doesn't know the way forward a path. Your path. The one @Phil Edwards is actually qualified to give because @Phil Edwards traveled it. And possibly a much better paved one than most. That alone is more gracious than not giving it. It's now up to the person to travel it, someone else's, or go home.

Even more edits:
How about from the "Total Perspective Vortex" angle?

Relax, at least you're not telling people how to raise their children.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by ipkiss; 06-23-2019 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Added edit: and even more edits:
ipkiss is offline  
post #330 of 363 (permalink) Old 06-23-2019, 04:26 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,675
@Phil Edwards don't mind the little things, when one's self is aged over 50 who cares!


Enough joking:

My title says "Planted Tank Guru" which I feel should say "Novice Grower" or "LED Pirate" or "Basement Chemist" or "Really BAD Arduino Programmer".

We can only provide advice on our experiences that have provided success and steer people away from things that have provided trouble or failure.

If it were a perfect world and everyone started with RODI water with a TDS of "0" a more level playing field would exist for better advice.
That is not the case @ all. Most everyone's water is very different.


Advice Giving:

Ever had that thread from hell where you ask a troubled individual a million questions trying to help them?
The post count gets over 60 and all of a sudden the path of enlightenment is found!
Some very important detail in the beginning was a typo, testing the wrong water, spilled whiskey in the tank, and so on.


Following:

My philosophy, do as I say not as I do.
I test many theories, measurements, dosing, etc...
Always feared someone will follow the path I'm posting about, trash everything in their tank and bash me for the next 6 months.
Not that I would really care and I seriously doubt my feelings would be hurt but still.
It's not like I told them to do it, they made a choice, full consent of their own free will.


Our own Tanks:

We will all have ups and downs.
My third algae bonanza in my 80G tank since the substrate change.
Am I trying "new" stuff to fix it, heck no.
Back to basics, changing more water, extra trimming, swapping Poret foam more frequently, removing some of the density for better flow etc...
Thing are coming around, not as fast as I'd like but Rome was not built in a day!


Really Growing Plants (not phish)

Tough road, too many species, water quality, fert recipes, lighting (PAR), trimming, alkalinity, hardness, substrate.
There is a lot to balance here.

Just some of my thoughts to share!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.
Maryland Guppy is online now  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome