60" 120 high tech community planted tank journal - Page 14 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #196 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-30-2020, 09:34 PM
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NOW you're getting the right amount of plants in there, looks really nice. I figured you'd like the corkscrew Looking forward to seeing it all fill in.
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post #197 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 02:56 PM Thread Starter
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Got 7 rainbowfish from Imperial Tropicals yesterday. They were overnighted and arrived at 3:45. I was watching for them, but figured UPS would bring live fish! to my door. Sigh. They didn’t. As a result, they sat out in the mailbox for 6 hours! :-(. I got 2 Goyder River (M. Trifasciata), 2 Yellow Rainbow (M. Herbertaxelrodi), 2 Dorityi (G Dorityi), and 1 Maccullochi (M. Maccullochi). They are all looking fine, and in the quarantine tank. 0:-)
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post #198 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 04:44 PM Thread Starter
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Alrighty... now that I have plant mass, Iím back to noodling ferts. Iím looking at this chart, and looking at my EI ferts (which are getting low and Iíll need new ones in about a month or so anyways) and playing with Zorfox, and wondering... hmmm.



So, my EI ferts have things combined.



Using Zorfox, if I set, for instance, PO4 at 5 ppm, as you have it in the chart above, @Greggz, then my K is at 2.05 and change, and my P is at 1.6 and change...

I know from your tank journal, Gregg, that you mix your own doses... is that how you guys get to the numbers above... buy all the ingredients and mix your own?
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post #199 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 05:27 PM
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Using Zorfox, if I set, for instance, PO4 at 5 ppm, as you have it in the chart above, @Greggz, then my K is at 2.05 and change, and my P is at 1.6 and change...

I know from your tank journal, Gregg, that you mix your own doses... is that how you guys get to the numbers above... buy all the ingredients and mix your own?
Yep, you can hit any numbers you like with what you have.

Let's say we go with my current weekly dosing which is NO3:PO4:K 10:5:15.

With my 105G of water, I would do the following:

6.48gm KNO3 = 10 pmm NO3 + 6.3 K

2.85gm KH2PO4 = 5 PO4 + 2.05 K.

So add the 6.3 K plus the 2.05 K and you have 8.35 K. So I would dose another 6.65 K via K2SO4 to bring K dosing to 15.

5.89gm K2SO4 = 6.65 K.

Now that is weekly. So if dosing 3x per week, 1/3 of the above each time.

Hope that helps.
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post #200 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 05:54 PM Thread Starter
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Yep, you can hit any numbers you like with what you have.

Let's say we go with my current weekly dosing which is NO3:PO4:K 10:5:15.

With my 105G of water, I would do the following:

6.48gm KNO3 = 10 pmm NO3 + 6.3 K

2.85gm KH2PO4 = 5 PO4 + 2.05 K.

So add the 6.3 K plus the 2.05 K and you have 8.35 K. So I would dose another 6.65 K via K2SO4 to bring K dosing to 15.

5.89gm K2SO4 = 6.65 K.

Now that is weekly. So if dosing 3x per week, 1/3 of the above each time.

Hope that helps.
Super helpful... same idea with micros?

Also... that leaves some SO4 on the table, right? Do we need to follow sulfates?
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Last edited by Tanks!; 07-31-2020 at 07:09 PM. Reason: Added question about Sulfates
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post #201 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 07:42 PM
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Super helpful... same idea with micros?

Also... that leaves some SO4 on the table, right? Do we need to follow sulfates?
I would not worry about the SO4.

And yes, same idea with micros.

I dose daily 0.075 Fe from micros, or 0.525 per week. Could split into three or four doses as well. Whatever works best for you.
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post #202 of 251 (permalink) Old 07-31-2020, 08:32 PM
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Tanks,
Not sure if this will be of any help, or just more confusing :-)
Because each container of ferts can contain multiple chemicals and effect multiple quantities, I came up with the following:
As an example, I am using MgNO3 for my Nitrate now. It does not add any K but, it does add NO3, N, Mg and effects the dGH.
A little more confusing - My 55 gallon RO drum that holds at most 50 gallons of water gets 4.66 grams of K2CO3. This will add 13.93ppm of K to my tank so I have to keep track of that as well.
For reference, my weekly N/P/K would be 18/4/15.6
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- GreggZ Tank Parameters

Last edited by Immortal1; 07-31-2020 at 08:41 PM. Reason: <?>
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post #203 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-02-2020, 06:04 PM Thread Starter
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This ich is not going away... I got the Paraguard (which, by the way, is not save for invertebrates) and promptly started lowering the temps and it got worse. SO: Iím continuing to dose AND raising the temps again... but probably only to 83. SO glad that my new fish are in a separate QT tank.

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post #204 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-02-2020, 06:51 PM
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The "like" button just does not seem appropriate here. :-(


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- GreggZ Tank Parameters
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post #205 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-02-2020, 08:13 PM
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This ich is not going away... I got the Paraguard (which, by the way, is not save for invertebrates) and promptly started lowering the temps and it got worse. SO: Iím continuing to dose AND raising the temps again... but probably only to 83. SO glad that my new fish are in a separate QT tank.

If you have started paragaurd and you still see spots after a few (4-5) days, it may not be an active infection. I had a few spots on my bows that were not going away and further treatment did not remove the spots. Since the fish were acting as normal, I stopped treatment and just observed for any new spots. They eventually went away, think of them as a scab that just has to fall off on itís own. Now, if fish are acting off or you see more spots, then either continue treatment or try something else.

I did not lose any snails, have MTS, ramshorn and a Nerite. I did not notice anything different about them through treatment.

I did not raise temps. What I have read is increased temps make it easier for a bacterial infection to take hold and bacteria multiply much quicker in higher temps. The spots of Ich on the fish or gills create a possible entry point for bacteria. You may have to treat for a longer period of time at lower temps. I believe I treated for 1 week total with a large water change in the middle and at the end.

As for CO2, I would lower it, only to make the environment less stressful for the fish. More so just in case something goes wrong with your CO2 and you end up injecting more than you plan. I had a controller change the set point much lower than where I set it and it nearly gassed my fish. I would also recommend increasing aeration if you donít have enough already. Bows love extra O2 anyway!


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Fluval EDGE slightly modded, low tech
3+ gallon (40 x 16 x 20.5 cm) aquatic soil, low-tech
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post #206 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-03-2020, 01:23 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all that, @vvDO. I decided to raise the temp already, because they seemed better with it high and the plants didn’t seem to mind. I’m on my 3rd day of Paraguard. I did catch and remove all the snails I could nab before I started the Paraguard. I put them in the QT tank... hopefully NOT spreading ich to that tank... we’ll see.

Tonight, I managed to catch the four fish that had it worst (a miracle!) and treated them with a one-hour dip in Paraguard per the bottle. The two that had it worst are my remaining Bosemoni; the other two are female Kamakas. All four are 4+ years old. One of the Bosemonis, especially, lost color and was getting covered in spots. ANYways, I caught all four and dipped them for an hour in Paraguard. They seemed to have less ich after returning them to the tank. Also they seemed to feel better. We’ll see what the morning lights tell me.

My Denison barbs seem completely free from it, and my two remaining Melanotaenia praecox "Pagai" (which are also 4+ years old...) seem unaffected so far. :::crossing fingers:::

So. The dip seemed to help. I have reduced the CO2 using my flow meter to 20 ppm, and my drop checker says I’m still getting ample CO2 for the plants. They all look healthy and fine. I have increased aeration by lifting the spray bar from my canister filter. I’m planning on a large water change tomorrow... and possibly dipping those fish again if they look better but not happy, or worse.

Does anyone here use StressGuard WITH the Paraguard? I didn’t know if it might help or hurt (chemicals interacting... etc.?)

SIGH. This really IS a pain. I’m wondering if the ich came in on frozen brine shrimps I’ve been feeling lately as treats?

Bump:
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The "like" button just does not seem appropriate here. :-(
Decidedly not.
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post #207 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-03-2020, 11:09 AM Thread Starter
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As I wrote the above last night, I only then realized that I might have cross-infected my QT tank with those snails. Though there are no signs of ich, Iím going to treat the QT tank as well for the next week.

Question: Why donít people do this as a matter of course? Seems like this is why we QT, so why not proactively treat?

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post #208 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-03-2020, 01:53 PM Thread Starter
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JUST did a 50% water change... and re-dosed the Paraguard. The lights arenít on much, but it LOOKS like the 4 fish Ii dipped last night are almost all healed! THAT is awesome. I really thought Iíd lose one of the two Boesemanies. He had turned very pale, wasnít eating, hiding, and covered in ich. But this AM, heís colored up, hanging out in the strong current, and eating. Amazing!

When the lights come on, Iíll see if he (and the other three) are truly spotless. If not, Iíll try to dip them again today, I think.
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post #209 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-03-2020, 10:31 PM
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JUST did a 50% water change... and re-dosed the Paraguard. The lights arenít on much, but it LOOKS like the 4 fish Ii dipped last night are almost all healed! THAT is awesome. I really thought Iíd lose one of the two Boesemanies. He had turned very pale, wasnít eating, hiding, and covered in ich. But this AM, heís colored up, hanging out in the strong current, and eating. Amazing!
This is TERRIFIC! I'm so glad they are on the mend!

I have read about proactively dosing QT tanks when bringing home new fish. It seems like a great idea, but I haven't done it.
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post #210 of 251 (permalink) Old 08-04-2020, 02:43 AM Thread Starter
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Update: when the lights came on, the 4 were indeed better, but nothing like 100%. I tried to catch them for another dip, but they were feeling enough better that they avoided the net! Dosed the tank and went on with life.

Weíll see how they are in the AM.
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