32 Gallon Semi-Dutch (resurrected) - Page 3 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #31 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-11-2016, 06:38 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PortalMasteryRy View Post
Those can be spilt just fine. I just split the last survivor of my E. Cinereum and some of the plants had like less than a dozen leaves LOL. I am to blame for not taking good care of them but I did manage to grow 8 little plants from 2 tiny growths. I waited until the 2 plants showed individual tiny plants then I split them. Most of them have roots now and they are on their way.

I'll grab a picture tomorrow and you can see how tiny they are.

What I would do is get the plant out of the water then use your a tweezer to very very slowly split the plant and trying to keep as much roots as you can have for each plant. Don't pull them by the leaves. Pull the individual plants by the crown and again do this very very slowly. It should split with no issues.

The common newbie thing to do is to pull too fast and losing all the roots from one good plant.
Thank you for the advice! The third erio, the one I split and moved, probably had a dozen or so leaves. Was a desperation move, and I didn't have high hopes for it. One of the halves is showing development of a new core though, so maybe it will pay off. I'll definitely go ahead and split the big ones too now. Just wanted to make sure it wasn't too early.

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Originally Posted by burr740 View Post
What he said^

Weird I started out with one and it never divided by itself, just kept getting bigger and bigger. Super nice plant. Finally it was about the size of a tennis ball, I split into four with a razor.

It took a while but three of them survived and took off. Now they all divide by themselves like in your pic. Sorta wish they didnt because so far none have been as pretty as the original, easy to split though. just be gentle and make sure to get some roots with each one.
I kind of figured it was the stress of hacking them up that caused them to split so early. They are not close to tennis ball size (I wish)! The Fissidens stone is tennis ball size for reference. The erios are more like golf ball size. Do you split using a razor, or do you simply pull them apart?
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post #32 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-11-2016, 07:35 AM
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When they are already dividing by themselves (like in your pic) I gently pull the plant apart, being careful to get roots on each piece. Similar to splitting a blyxa. But for a single plant need to use use a razor.


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post #33 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 04:34 AM Thread Starter
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Limnophila aromatica coloration

This is a strange plant to figure out when it comes to coloration. For the longest time I couldn't get any color out of it at all. For example, here's a picture from about three months ago where it was almost white.

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Now things are finally heading in the right direction, beginning to get some color. To be honest, I'm not sure why the improvement. I've increased iron dosing, but also switched from LED to T5 lighting. Could be either of these factors, both, or even some unknown. Here's a shot from tonight.

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But I still need more intense color out of it than this for it to be the focal point I want in this Dutch scape. Crazy part is, see below what it looks like in my Spec V, same approximate fert routine and CO2, but with inert gravel substrate instead of Aqua Soil. It turns this wild mix of bright orange and blood red that's tough for me to capture fully in pictures. THIS is what I need in the Dutch scape.

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Just not sure why there's such a big difference. PAR maybe? I know many people attribute this plant's coloration almost solely to intense light. In the 5 gallon it gets blasted with two 2700k 23-Watt CFLs. Light is cranked pretty high in the 32 gallon too though. Guess maybe it's time to break out the meter.
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post #34 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 04:48 AM
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I'm having the same issue with Aromatica, I just can't get any color and it grows slow.

Just a noob


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post #35 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 05:11 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Nlewis View Post
I'm having the same issue with Aromatica, I just can't get any color and it grows slow.
I remember you were having this problem too. Grows at a moderate pace in both my tanks, but in the 32-gallon definitely hasn't achieved the color it's capable of, which I think is a pretty common issue for people actually. For a while I was concerned maybe it was something in my tap, but clearly that's not the case. The fact that I'm getting such strong coloration in the five-gallon at least is giving me hope that I can figure out how to make it happen in the bigger tank.
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post #36 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 05:43 AM
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I almost feel like it's the fluorescent lighting that does the trick. Mines directly under an led fixture getting more than 100 par to the tops and it still struggles to gain color, while plants next to it turn dark red. Yours look really awesome and bushy in that smaller tank.

Just a noob


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post #37 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 05:54 AM
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Wow that is insane color in the 5 gal! The light looks really warm, might have something to do with it.

They look very nice in that last pic of the Dutch. Whatever you're doing seems like you are on the right path.


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post #38 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 03:00 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nlewis View Post
I almost feel like it's the fluorescent lighting that does the trick. Mines directly under an led fixture getting more than 100 par to the tops and it still struggles to gain color, while plants next to it turn dark red. Yours look really awesome and bushy in that smaller tank.
You might be right. If you have an extra tank to experiment in it would be interesting to see if you get similar results under florescent.

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Originally Posted by burr740 View Post
Wow that is insane color in the 5 gal! The light looks really warm, might have something to do with it.

They look very nice in that last pic of the Dutch. Whatever you're doing seems like you are on the right path.
Thank you, does seem like the tank is on the right path of late. Now let me see if I can keep her there

Light on the 5-gallon is very warm: two 2700k bulbs. I do suspect this has something to do with it, both in the actual color of the growth, and in color rendering.
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post #39 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 08:06 AM Thread Starter
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Tank Update

It's been a long time since I've done an update on the overall status of the tank, so here it goes.

Equipment Changes
-Sold the Radions and bought an ATI dimmable fixture. This is my first experience with T5 lighting, and I'm very happy with it. Don't think I'd switch back to LED for doing a Dutch setup.
-Added a second canister, an Eheim 2273, to go alongside the 2073.
-Added a second Grigg reactor to go along with the new filter. Wanted to avoid the possibility of having discrepancies in CO2 across the tank, that might result from having two outflow points and only one carrying CO2 rich water. I'm sure this is overkill for this size tank, but it was low cost and gives me peace of mind.

Plants

-Following the advice of @PortalMasteryRy and @burr740, I split the two remaining Erio Polaris. Once the erios were out of the tank, I realized there were more separate cores growing than I originally thought. This made it awkward to pull them apart effectively, and I finally resorted to a razor blade. Ended up with 10 split plants, 5 of which were replanted in this tank, 5 of which were planted in a 5-gallon grow out tank. It was difficult keeping the split plants from floating out of the substrate, so eventually I staked them down with paper clips bent into upside down 'U's.
-Rotala rotundifolia is doing much better these days, but still some stunting here and there. Need to achieve consistently nice growth, then fatten up the group.
-Added a Hygrophila corymbosa 'Compact,' courtesy of Burr. Scape was in need of a green, large leaf plant. I'm liking this one a lot.
-Also added Blyxa Japonica.
-Bacopa australis street was in prime form about a month ago, but not so hot now, especially toward the back of the tank. Got super busy and missed trimming it when I should have. By the time I got to it the lower portions had starting dying off. It will likely have to be uprooted and re-planted.

Overall Thoughts
-Left side of the tank needs work in general: filling out the groups, shaping, maybe switching out some plants if it's still lacking after that.
-May be getting too crowded for a Dutch.
-Tough to get all the groups looking good and hitting the sweet spot at the same time.



A couple shots from tonight. Tank was badly in need of trim and maintenance, which it got afterward. Wanted to do pics before the water got mucked up.

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post #40 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 08:46 AM
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That's looking GREAT man, so clean...

Future plans sound spot on. I also struggle with having too many species, that's always kept mine from ever hitting a truly Dutch stride.

The street is really good, I can imagine it being at it's full potential. Continuing the Blyxa on to the right might be a good look, couple more plants to fill in that space.

I like the new thing in front right, nice contrast.

How's the moss wall working, any likes or dislikes about it? Thinking about one for the new tank.

Sweet light! What kind of bulbs?

When you split the CO2, did you get a 2nd needle valve or just use a T fitting? Been wondering how/if to do mine. Thinking a T might be fine with reactors, as compared to say diffusers where the resistance could be different. Not sure though


Also you need a bigger grow out tank! So nice being able to plug-n-play different species, grow things out, propagate, etc


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post #41 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 04:59 PM
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Very nice tank! What size is it? Also what is that long tall plant with the red coloration on the right?


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post #42 of 217 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 08:50 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burr740 View Post
That's looking GREAT man, so clean...

Future plans sound spot on. I also struggle with having too many species, that's always kept mine from ever hitting a truly Dutch stride.

The street is really good, I can imagine it being at it's full potential. Continuing the Blyxa on to the right might be a good look, couple more plants to fill in that space.

I like the new thing in front right, nice contrast.

How's the moss wall working, any likes or dislikes about it? Thinking about one for the new tank.

Sweet light! What kind of bulbs?

When you split the CO2, did you get a 2nd needle valve or just use a T fitting? Been wondering how/if to do mine. Thinking a T might be fine with reactors, as compared to say diffusers where the resistance could be different. Not sure though


Also you need a bigger grow out tank! So nice being able to plug-n-play different species, grow things out, propagate, etc
Burr - Thanks! I agree about the Blyxa. Might be tough to tell there in the pic, but there are four Blyxa plants trailing back toward the Rotala in the left corner. Want to let them fill out a bit more and maybe tier them, then go from there.

In the front right, that's Leopard Val from @Bartohog that I swapped in for the Italian Val, because there was too much green over there before. Incredible plant, with lots of red and metallic sheen. I am very satisfied with it being one of the front corner plants. Jury is still out on the Hydrocotyle leucocephala in the front left corner. Very common in true Dutch tanks, but without mossed side walls it's tough to get it to trail up the front corner. Gets pushed by the current and wants to sprawl; just not room for that in this size tank.

The moss wall is doing really well. Has become very full and is a great dark backdrop. What is also nice is that once the moss is established, it can be planted on. You can see in the photo the Hydrocotyle Japan growing across the top, providing a top border to frame the layout. My only regret is that I never went back and covered the wall with plastic netting as I had planned; it just started filling in too nicely to mess with. But it's very thick now, and at some point in the near future I will probably be forced to remove it and start from square one again. This time, I will lay the moss out the same way I did initially, but I'll cover the moss by tying fine plastic netting to the face of the SS mesh. I think this will make 2.0 even nicer, and maybe possible to maintain by thinning in the long run, as opposed to having to start over. It has caused little if any increase to short term maintenance/weekly routine. Using a moss that's not 'sticky,' like the mini Christmas, I think was key.

It's a six-bulb fixture. Back to front I've got: Giesemann Aquaflora, Giesemann Midday, Wave Point Ultra Growth wave, Wave Point Ultra Growth wave, ATI Aquablue Special, Giesemann Aquaflora.

For the second reactor, I went with another needle valve. I have four needle valves on this regulator: two for the Dutch; and two for the five-gallon grow out tanks. I thought about the T, but like you, I wasn't sure how well this would work. The filters have different flow rates, which I am sure would be the case even if they were the exact same type of filter. On top of that, one of the filters has an inline heater hooked up. Not sure what, if any, effect these factors have on diffusion. I have eye balled the needle valves to the same approximate rate of injection for both reactors.

Would be sweet to have a bigger growout! Unfortunately, time and space basically only allow the current setup. At least I have two 5-gallons though! In the long term, my hope is that the 32-gallon becomes the growout.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PortalMasteryRy View Post
Very nice tank! What size is it? Also what is that long tall plant with the red coloration on the right?
PortalMasteryRy - Thank you! This is a 32-gallon (roughly) 24x18x18 in. Mr. Aqua. That red plant in the front right is Vallisneria spiralis 'Leopard' (see response to Burr above). Excellent plant that I picked up from Bartohog.
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post #43 of 217 (permalink) Old 11-06-2016, 08:48 PM Thread Starter
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Top of the moss wall is going nuts! Probably hack this way back tonight.

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Mowed it down.

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Last edited by LRJ; 11-07-2016 at 07:29 AM. Reason: add trim photo
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post #44 of 217 (permalink) Old 11-07-2016, 05:40 PM
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Aw man, I thought it looked great before the trim! Blocking too much light?


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post #45 of 217 (permalink) Old 11-07-2016, 06:22 PM Thread Starter
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Aw man, I thought it looked great before the trim! Blocking too much light?
Just a management strategy, like how we'd mow a Glosso carpet. If you let it continue to pile up, eventually the bottom layers get choked out. Then you've got rotting plants in the tank and everything has to be gutted anyway. This is the first time I've taken it down to the bone, but I am betting within a few weeks it will be back, and fuller than before.
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