Do I need to dose MgSO4? - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-26-2016, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
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Do I need to dose MgSO4?

I just pulled out an old well water report I have, and I noticed it says my Mg levels are 36 mg/l. Any need for me to dose MgSO4? I do 50% weekly water changes.
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-26-2016, 09:49 PM
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Get a new well water report.

Filter the well water.

MgSo4 is part of GH booster. Add GH booster after a water change.

Cheers!

-PhilipS ><>

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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-26-2016, 10:07 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by webskipper View Post
Get a new well water report.
Why? They are expensive.


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Filter the well water.
If you mean RO, it's not happening. Way too much hassle. If you just mean large particle filtration, I already have that, but I don't see that impacting MgSO4 or any other nutrients.


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MgSo4 is part of GH booster. Add GH booster after a water change.
Ca is 60 mg/l. Hardness as CaCO3 is 300. Why should I be adding GH booster, unless you are suggesting use RO water and then add GH booster, which isn't gonna happen.

Bump: I should add that I already dose MgSO4 as part of my micros (I add epson salts) but was just wondering if I should leave the MgSO4 out for now on. And if you're concerned about lack of S as a result, I also dose K2SO4 for the K because I do not dose KNO3 (nitrates are about 40-50ppm out of the tap).
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-26-2016, 10:38 PM
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You don't see that impacting MgSO4 or any other nutrients?

Because your xray vision allows you to focus on individual molecules?

Interesting.
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Last edited by PhilipS; 01-28-2016 at 04:09 PM. Reason: sp
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-26-2016, 10:43 PM
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If you are keeping soft water fish the GH (Ca and Mg) are OK.

If you are seeing problems with the plants then you might dose a combination of Ca and Mg. GH booster is one way, or you can make your own blend with MgSO4 and one of the calcium materials such as calcium chloride.

I would not just dose magnesium.

... Ahh, missed the GH is already 300ppm. No need to add more.
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Last edited by Diana; 01-27-2016 at 02:16 AM. Reason: *
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 12:52 AM
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300 ppm (16.8 dGH) of general hardness made from 36 ppm Mg++ and 60ppm Ca++ is enough for even the most demanding hard water fish I would have thought.

I wouldn't bother dosing any hardness minerals, including MgSO4.

And yes you are right, particle filtration will not filter out dissolved minerals.
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 12:58 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Audionut View Post
300 ppm (16.8 dGH) of general hardness made from 36 ppm Mg++ and 60ppm Ca++ is enough for even the most demanding hard water fish I would have thought.

I wouldn't bother dosing any hardness minerals, including MgSO4.

And yes you are right, particle filtration will not filter out dissolved minerals.
Just to clarify, this is for plants, not to make the water more suitable for hard water fish. But yeah, probably no need to add more Mg. I also just looked at an EI dosing calculator, and it only doses 1ppm Mg per week. I think I got that covered already.
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 01:02 AM
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Full EI calls for 2 ppm Mg++ every day or 5 ppm Mg++ every other day.

You still have it covered.

Feel free to edit.
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 02:12 AM Thread Starter
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Full EI calls for 2 ppm Mg++ every day or 5 ppm Mg++ every other day.

You still have it covered.
Ok. I was using the following calculator, which told me 1ppm, but in any case, I don't need to add any.

https://www.thenutrientcompany.com/a...ei_calculator/
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 07:33 AM
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According to the data in Diana Walstad's book "Ecology of the Planted Aquarium" even the so-called "hard-water" plants should do more than fine with 3 ppm Ca and 1 ppm Mg. There's no physiological need for supplying more. The plants are not physiologically able to uptake more. Believe it or not, according to my experiments, plants under high light and high CO2 levels can uptake (consume) no more than 1 ppm Ca per week. Still, they can do fine even under much higher Ca/Mg concentrations (as is our experience), but that does not mean they have any further advantage from these elevated levels.

But you should be aware also, that too high Ca/Mg levels can work as "stoppers" that can block the uptake sites on plant leaves, thus blocking the entrance for other cations (mainly trace elements). So when you have high Ca/Mg levels in your water it may be wise to increase the trace elements dose a little, or use better chelating agents for iron (like Fe-DTPA).

PS: I don't know what EI people base their recommendations for such a high Ca/Mg concentrations on. They should explain it. Based on scientific data and my own experiments I doubt we need such a high levels, so I can't imagine any real-life scenario where there is any need to add more Ca or Mg into your tap water.
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-27-2016, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcel G View Post
According to the data in Diana Walstad's book "Ecology of the Planted Aquarium" even the so-called "hard-water" plants should do more than fine with 3 ppm Ca and 1 ppm Mg. There's no physiological need for supplying more. The plants are not physiologically able to uptake more. Believe it or not, according to my experiments, plants under high light and high CO2 levels can uptake (consume) no more than 1 ppm Ca per week. Still, they can do fine even under much higher Ca/Mg concentrations (as is our experience), but that does not mean they have any further advantage from these elevated levels.

But you should be aware also, that too high Ca/Mg levels can work as "stoppers" that can block the uptake sites on plant leaves, thus blocking the entrance for other cations (mainly trace elements). So when you have high Ca/Mg levels in your water it may be wise to increase the trace elements dose a little, or use better chelating agents for iron (like Fe-DTPA).

PS: I don't know what EI people base their recommendations for such a high Ca/Mg concentrations on. They should explain it. Based on scientific data and my own experiments I doubt we need such a high levels, so I can't imagine any real-life scenario where there is any need to add more Ca or Mg into your tap water.
i been saying for years that you can grow plants even at 2 ppm or less Calcium, but i have given more importance to the Mg because it help uptake Iron.

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