Green as grass(fert help) - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 12:19 AM Thread Starter
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Talking Green as grass(fert help)

so i went ahead and bought some ferts to get a schedule going. Atm I am very green to this whole "fertilization" thing but am hoping you guys can help me get started. I have Mono Potassium Phosphate(KH2Po4), Potassium Nitrate(Kno3), Potassium Sulfate(K2so4) and Seachem Flourish for traces. Its a 29 gallon and with the ferts I have, what would be the appropriate amount to dose in this tank via the EI system? Its considered a medium to high light at 2.4 wpg. The present bioload is coming from 10 neon tetras and a couple of cherry shrimp and a nerite snail. I have three 500ml bottles and would like to make a liquid concentration of each fert so that i can dose with a 10ml syringe.id prefer liquid rather a powder dosage but anything to get me started will help. Your help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you TpT!
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 12:37 AM
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Make sure you have CO2. EI is pretty useless without it.

I make 500ml of ferts at a time. I mix certain ferts together so I don't have to deal with 4-5 bottles. I mix K2SO4, trace, and Mg & Ca together. The KH2PO4, I just grab a pinch and throw in. Don't mix KH2PO4 together into the liquid mix. It turns into a gelatinous goop. Kinda cool actually.

I rarely dose KNO3 as the waste product from fish activities will provide enough, N.

You can use this handy calculator to see how much you should add to your 500ml.
http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_p...osage_calc.htm


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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 06:22 PM
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I dry dose into a pitcher and use the pitcher to "top-off" the tank every other day. If you pre make stuff in liquid form like Plantex CSM+B make sure to make it in RO/DI water. My tap water has phospates that made the solids drop out of solution.

Also, if you use tap water, check it. It turns out, in the summer the phospates in our tap go up to 1-2ppm! I normally don't dose with any phosphate or nitrate due to enough in the tank/tap but now with phopates climbing, I am considering a RO/DI kit because GDA is starting to show up on the glass and driftwood. Our tap also seem to have a lot of silicates because I get brown algae show even in high lit areas after a water change.
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmaaaaax View Post
I dry dose into a pitcher and use the pitcher to "top-off" the tank every other day. If you pre make stuff in liquid form like Plantex CSM+B make sure to make it in RO/DI water. My tap water has phospates that made the solids drop out of solution.
The only thing that is affected by the phosphates in a pre-mix is iron. If you pre-mix phosphates with a trace mix containing iron, the iron may combine with the phosphate to form an insoluble precipitate, which settles to the bottom of the bottle. RO/DI water isn't of any value in making a pre-mix unless you just want to be absolutely sure you know exactly what is in your mix, and that is really beyond our measuring capability anyway.
Quote:

Also, if you use tap water, check it. It turns out, in the summer the phospates in our tap go up to 1-2ppm! I normally don't dose with any phosphate or nitrate due to enough in the tank/tap but now with phopates climbing, I am considering a RO/DI kit because GDA is starting to show up on the glass and driftwood. Our tap also seem to have a lot of silicates because I get brown algae show even in high lit areas after a water change.
1-2 ppm of phosphates in the tap water is not a problem in a planted tank. Nor is any amount of nitrates that can legally be in tap water. Both are just fertilizers for the plants, soon consumed if you don't replenish them. GDA has not been shown to be related to phosphates, either high or low. GSA does seem to start up when phosphates are too low, not too high. Brown diatom algae doesn't seem to be related to silicates either. Most of us get that algae shortly after a new tank is set up, and never afterwards, even though we continue to use the same tap water for water changes. That is one of the algae that seems to remain a mystery, but since it goes away soon anyway, no one seems to care.

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 12:45 AM Thread Starter
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Hi guys thanks for the links and suggestions. With that calculator link I came up with the follwing calculations and was wondering if they look correct to you guys. If I dose 1ml of each 3x a week it suggests that I will be within the targeted ppm levels of each fert. The sulfate numbers to me dont add up as far as i know.

(Kno3)Potassium Nitrate- 9tbl per 500ml
1ml= 1.69ppm of nitrate per dosage with a suggested target level of 5ppm
3x weekly dosage will give me 5.07ppm.

Potassium Sulfate(K2so4) 45tbl per 500ml?(Doesnt sound right)
1ml=6.63ppm of sulfate per dosage with a suggested target level of 20ppm
3x weekly dosage will give me 19.89ppm

Mono Potassium Phosphate(Kh2po4) 1tbl per 500ml
1ml= 0.18ppm of phopshate per dosage with a suggested target level of .5-1ppm
3x weekly dosage will give me 0.54ppm

My dosing regime will be this

Monday:1ml of KNo3, K2so4, Kh2po4, 5ml of fluorish
Wednesday:1ml of KNo3, K2so4, Kh2po4, 5ml of fluorish
Friday:1ml of KNo3, K2so4, Kh2po4, 5ml of fluorish
Sunday:50% Water Change

Does this look correct to you guys? I want to make sure before I go throwing a bunch of too much into the tank! Thanks for the help fellas.
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 04:14 AM
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Why don't you want to dry dose? I both dry dose on my 10g and made mixes for my 2.5g and when I was keeping up with my liquid doses both tanks seemed to be about the same as far as growth and such.

As per the sticky in this forum:
50% H20 change-weekly
1/4 Tsp-KN03 3x a week
1/16 Tsp-KH2P04 3x aweek
5ml or 1/16Tsp-Trace 3x a week
Optional
1-2ml-Fe/Iron 3x a week

I personally just find this method easiest


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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 03:42 PM Thread Starter
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It just seemed easier to have a liquid to dose. I guess I will have to go out and buy the table spoons because I do not have a 1/16 tsp!
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 04:04 PM
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You can also just eye ball the 1/16 with an 1/8... it's really not that critical.
Critical are the 50% water changes at the end of the week and plenty of CO2...

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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dream2MkBlve View Post
It just seemed easier to have a liquid to dose. I guess I will have to go out and buy the table spoons because I do not have a 1/16 tsp!
You can go either way here, some find it easier, I do not like messy liquids dribbling everywhere, I can make a nice little rack on my tank for this etc, some use liquid dosers etc, there are certainly ways around that, then you can do this daily dose type of thing if that is an easier habit for you.

Some catch different things with a method that make sense to them, while others hone in on another aspect. We all learn differently.

PMDD +PO4 is the daily version. Most had issues and scared of ppm's and mls and gram scales etc, so teaspoons proved fairly easy and common device that did not scare folks.

Adding it dry instead of daily in liquids made things easier for some, but some have better habits dosing daily when they feed their fish daily. Others if they remember , 2-3x a week etc.

More a human issue than a plant/method dosing issue.
So whatever works and gets the job done.

I'd strongly focus on CO2, using the right amount of lighting etc.
After doing the ferts a couple of times, you'll realize they are pretty easy to deal with. CO2 and light will give you a lot more to work with and issues to modify to get better results/management later.

Regards,
Tom Barr




Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the info guys! I agree with you on the human issue part. I guess more so that it all relies on whats easier for us. Gotta love TpT.
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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-21-2009, 12:24 AM
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This chart may be helpful.



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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-21-2009, 03:29 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks left c! I will dry dose for the time being until I get experiences with ferts and consistent with schedule.
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