Horrible plant growth - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 03:56 AM Thread Starter
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Horrible plant growth

I am about to throw the towel in for some reason I can not get my plants to grow don't know that I am doing wrong.
Tank Specs:
*125 gallon African Cichild tank
*Light:http://www.aquatraders.com/LED-Aquar...eamswork-Pent- HI-Lumen-p/56369.htm
* lights on for about 8-10 hours a day
* Dose 8 ml of metricide 28 daily
* 12 ml of macros 3 x a week made from this page :https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=647697
* heaping 1/4 tsp of micros 3 X a week

The plants seem to grow a little bit then start getting covered with some brown/black algae then begin to wither away....some don't even seem to grow. I have Java fern, hornwort, wisteria, jungle vals, and an amazon sword
Here are two pics so you can see what I am talking about:



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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 04:25 AM
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This could be rated as high light, correct?
If yes, you are asking your plants to grow fast, but somehow a nutrient they need is not available.
CO2?
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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 06:07 AM
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You have a couple things going on. First, it looks to me like classic Excel/metricide melting to me. Vals and certain crypt are especially sensitive to Excel although if you dose tiny amounts and slowly increase the dosage over time they can be acclimated to it and will grow fairly well/healthy after.

The other issue is that you have high light but not a lot of plants to soak up the light and nutrients which opens the door for algae. You need to plant it more heavily and back way off on the fertilizers until you get pressurized co2. The EI dosing is based on medium to high light and co2 so without co2 you should only be dosing micros and macros once a week, maybe once every 2 weeks until you get lots more plants.

If you still get some algae then shorten the time the lights are on.
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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keymastr View Post
You have a couple things going on. First, it looks to me like classic Excel/metricide melting to me. Vals and certain crypt are especially sensitive to Excel although if you dose tiny amounts and slowly increase the dosage over time they can be acclimated to it and will grow fairly well/healthy after.

The other issue is that you have high light but not a lot of plants to soak up the light and nutrients which opens the door for algae. You need to plant it more heavily and back way off on the fertilizers until you get pressurized co2. The EI dosing is based on medium to high light and co2 so without co2 you should only be dosing micros and macros once a week, maybe once every 2 weeks until you get lots more plants.

If you still get some algae then shorten the time the lights are on.

+1 to all of this

i Would suggest doing a large water change (50% in one run or do 20% for three straight days) to clear out and reset your water parmaters.
i would also reduce my lighting by half for a couple weeks to help reduce the algae a little faster.

and remember change takes time, you may notice any changes for a week or two..

Will
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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 04:00 PM
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I don't see any PAR information for that light, but it is designed for a reef tank, so it is very likely to be too much light for a planted tank, and the color temperature for the light is not the best for plants. Without knowing what approximate light intensity you have it is hard to do a good job recommending what you can do to improve the plant growth. One thing sure, if the light is giving you typical reef tank PAR amounts, you can't be successful using Metricide as the source of carbon for the plants. You will have to use pressurized CO2.

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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 05:28 PM Thread Starter
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Excel/metricide was slowly increased over a month and a half till I got to 8 ml.....I do large water changes every two weeks about 60% and the light as a dimmer so I guess I need to dim it a bit....as far as the ferts I am doing a little more than 1/3 of what is recommended thought that is what is dosed if you use Excel/metricide.....I do have a pressurized system but dont use it anymore since I switched back to African Cichlids since it lowers the pH.......I thought color temp didnt matter


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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 05:44 PM
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+1 for Hoppy
If you haven't had the fixture long you may be able to exchange it or get your money back and use it to get the one made for freshwater. The name escapes me at the moment but there is someone on here who can let you know which of those fixtures gives low/med PAR for your tank.
One other thing I noticed. You mentioned the fert list from Zorfox. This is for adding to 500ml of RO or distilled water and dosing the amount on the left side of the tank size.
But then you say heaping 1/4 tsp of micros. This is far less than the other concentrations of nutrients. Is there some reason you didn't go by the formula/w the micros ? The Macros and Micros should be in separate 500ml bottles of course.
The calculator(the one which no longer works) gave me 1/16 tsp of micros for my 10g tank. Sounds about like you are using the amount for an 80g tank.
On the light, I believe this to be the correct one from the same dealer.
Not knowing how much light in PAR it is, it would be better to get the hanging kit/w it so you can raise it up off the tank more if you need to.
http://www.aquatraders.com/LED-Aquar...n-p/56369p.htm

P.S. EI ferts require a 50% per week water change or they will build up too much.
P.P.S. In my 10g tank I use the correct level for a 10g tank according to that link you have, but using only Excel I only dose it once a week.

The shortest distance between any two points is a straight line...in the opposite direction...

Last edited by Raymond S.; 08-08-2015 at 05:51 PM. Reason: P.S.
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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 05:57 PM Thread Starter
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I got the fixture back in Feb, so I guess I am stuck with it.....it does have a dimmer so I can dim the lights....I am putting a heaping 1/4 tsp of micros because full dry dose is 3/4 a tsp for 125 gallon but since I am not using pressurized co2 was trying to dose 1/3 amount like the post suggests, I didnt make a solution for the micros just dosing dry. I have read were Tom Barr does water changes once a month on one of his tanks and just does 1/4 of the suggested EI dosing.....so I thought I may also get away with doing the w/c every two weeks


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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 06:10 PM
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If a tank has a large amount of plants in it they will use most of the nutrients.
By large amount I mean where you can hardly see the back of the tank because of
so many plants in it.
The amount of micros you are using is probably more than your tank needs/w the low number of plants.

The shortest distance between any two points is a straight line...in the opposite direction...
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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-09-2015, 12:59 AM
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I was not able to open the link on the light so was unable to see that it is for a reef set-up. Are the color temperatures adjustable? If not it may not ever provide the correct light. Plants use a pretty specific color temperature with peaks in the 5000 to 7000 kelvin range while reefs require color temps from 14,000 to 20,000. I had a reef light once and all it grew was algae.

Maybe you can trade for a plant specific light like a planted+ or give Beamswork a call and see what they can do for you. Maybe they have a solution for that.
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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-09-2015, 12:21 PM
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JL i see you are in south texas, there a few saltwater groups out there. you might be able to sell the light to someone in those groups and recoup most of your money.

Will
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-09-2015, 08:02 PM Thread Starter
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I thought and have read that you can grow plants with 10k bulbs and that is that I have.....

Edit: angelcraze has a very similar light and seems to be growing plants very well post #67
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...amswork&page=5


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Last edited by JL15219; 08-09-2015 at 08:16 PM. Reason: added link
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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 12:56 AM
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How much CO2 you need and how much fertilizers you need depends on how much light you have. The more light, the more fertilizers and the higher the concentration of CO2 you need. So, first you need to get a good feel for the amount of light you have. I'm pretty sure you can eventually find where someone measured the PAR from that light. Try google, or the search function here. With that value we can determine what your plants need.

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 01:55 AM Thread Starter
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okay so I can grow plants with 10K color temp then right? I actually did look for par values for this light before I bought it in Feb. but had not luck but it has been 6 months maybe I will have some luck this time...


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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 06:00 PM Thread Starter
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Well did some searching and no luck with par values........


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