Planted Tank Enthusiast

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Another iron dosing question
I know I should be able to do this math, but for whatever reason, I just cannot figure out how to do it.
I want to dose EI in my 75 gallon. I am going to dose CSM+B and 10% DTPA Iron.
I found that the ratio is supposed to be 3 parts CSB to 2 parts DTPA.
I want to mix up a solution in a 500ml bottle and dose 20ml every other day.
Can someone help me figure out how much of each of these I need to add to make my solution?
My math came up with 32.6grams of CSM and 14.2 grams of DTPA.
Does this seem correct?
Does this amount of CSM+B give enough of the rest of the micros?
Ben
I want to dose EI in my 75 gallon. I am going to dose CSM+B and 10% DTPA Iron.
I found that the ratio is supposed to be 3 parts CSB to 2 parts DTPA.
I want to mix up a solution in a 500ml bottle and dose 20ml every other day.
Can someone help me figure out how much of each of these I need to add to make my solution?
My math came up with 32.6grams of CSM and 14.2 grams of DTPA.
Does this seem correct?
Does this amount of CSM+B give enough of the rest of the micros?
Ben
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Planted Tank Obsessed
The calculations you made were based on the following:
1) Reach the combined EI goal of .5ppm of Iron
2) Mix 60% of the iron from CSM+B (containing EDTA chelate)
3) Mix 40% of the iron from DTPA iron.
If this was your goal, your math is correct.
But the end result gives only 60% of the other micros in the CSM+B.
I would now assume that you are supplementing DTPA iron because you don't trust the uptake of the EDTA iron? Or perhaps you want more than .5ppm iron?
If this is true, then you should be dosing CSM+B at 100%, and adding the extra DTPA.
Do you think the 3:2 ratio is because about 40% of the EDTA iron is wasted? Without knowing why you are supplementing DTPA, it is hard to know how much of it to dose...
1) Reach the combined EI goal of .5ppm of Iron
2) Mix 60% of the iron from CSM+B (containing EDTA chelate)
3) Mix 40% of the iron from DTPA iron.
If this was your goal, your math is correct.
But the end result gives only 60% of the other micros in the CSM+B.
I would now assume that you are supplementing DTPA iron because you don't trust the uptake of the EDTA iron? Or perhaps you want more than .5ppm iron?
If this is true, then you should be dosing CSM+B at 100%, and adding the extra DTPA.
Do you think the 3:2 ratio is because about 40% of the EDTA iron is wasted? Without knowing why you are supplementing DTPA, it is hard to know how much of it to dose...
Planted Tank Enthusiast
It is based on a post here about needing additional iron than the csm provides at standard ei dosing. The recommendation was for a 3:2 csm:dtpa dosing.


Planted Tank Obsessed
It seems like the correct calculations are:
1) csm+b = 54.35g (this will give you the proper 100% of micros, and .5ppm of EDTA iron)
2) DPTA 10% iron = 23.625g (assumes a 3:2 ratio OF IRON, which is .333ppm of DPTA)
This yields a combined iron of .8333ppm.
But since I don't really understand the 3:2 ratio, please wait for someone to confirm this.
1) csm+b = 54.35g (this will give you the proper 100% of micros, and .5ppm of EDTA iron)
2) DPTA 10% iron = 23.625g (assumes a 3:2 ratio OF IRON, which is .333ppm of DPTA)
This yields a combined iron of .8333ppm.
But since I don't really understand the 3:2 ratio, please wait for someone to confirm this.
Planted Tank Enthusiast
I will try to find the post and link to it in case it helps.
Planted Tank Enthusiast
Here is the thread:
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...=dtpa+csm+iron
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...=dtpa+csm+iron
Planted Tank Obsessed
It is what I expected. The iron products in that post are being adjusted because of higher pH. EDTA does not hold up well in higher pH water.
What is your pH? Do you experience clouding when you dose csm+b?
If you do experience clouding, it suggests the EDTA chelate isn't working, and you need more DPTA, probably in the ratio of 3:2 as expected.
However if your pH is low, and the EDTA is staying chelated, then a 3:2 ratio would only overdose iron.
Thoughts?
What is your pH? Do you experience clouding when you dose csm+b?
If you do experience clouding, it suggests the EDTA chelate isn't working, and you need more DPTA, probably in the ratio of 3:2 as expected.
However if your pH is low, and the EDTA is staying chelated, then a 3:2 ratio would only overdose iron.
Thoughts?
Planted Tank Guru
3:2 ratio is a total of 5 parts
We need the percentage of each part...
3 / 5 = 0.6 (60%)
2 / 5 = 0.4 (40%)
So we need 60% and 40% of something.
In this case it's iron. We want a total of 0.5 ppm of Fe for EI.
60% of 0.5 ppm?
0.5 * 0.6 = 0.3 ppm
So we calculate a Plantex dose of 0.3 ppm
40% of 0.5 ppm?
0.5 * 0.4 = 0.2 ppm
So we calculate the DTPA 10% to 0.2 ppm
Plugging those numbers into a calculator using the solution variables we get
32.6 gm of Plantex CSM+B and 14.2 gm of DTPA Fe (10%)
Make sense?
We need the percentage of each part...
3 / 5 = 0.6 (60%)
2 / 5 = 0.4 (40%)
So we need 60% and 40% of something.
In this case it's iron. We want a total of 0.5 ppm of Fe for EI.
60% of 0.5 ppm?
0.5 * 0.6 = 0.3 ppm
So we calculate a Plantex dose of 0.3 ppm
40% of 0.5 ppm?
0.5 * 0.4 = 0.2 ppm
So we calculate the DTPA 10% to 0.2 ppm
Plugging those numbers into a calculator using the solution variables we get
32.6 gm of Plantex CSM+B and 14.2 gm of DTPA Fe (10%)
Make sense?
Planted Tank Enthusiast
I do have very high pH and very hard water. My pH is around 7.8.
Zorfox, do I need to worry about the rest of the csm traces being to low if I am only using 60% of the recommended dosage?
Zorfox, do I need to worry about the rest of the csm traces being to low if I am only using 60% of the recommended dosage?
Planted Tank Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by benealing
View Post
I do have very high pH and very hard water. My pH is around 7.8.
Zorfox, do I need to worry about the rest of the csm traces being to low if I am only using 60% of the recommended dosage?
Zorfox, do I need to worry about the rest of the csm traces being to low if I am only using 60% of the recommended dosage?
Adding the amounts below to 500ml and a 20ml dose will raise iron by 0.7ppm in 75 gallons.
54.3 gm (approximately 12 3/4 teaspoons) of Plantex  0.5ppm Fe
14.2 gm (approximately 3 1/4 teaspoons) of DTPA 10%  0.2 ppm Fe
Planted Tank Obsessed
What about the 3:2 ratio, which now that the pH is confirmed to be high, would be relevant?
Planted Tank Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by imcmaster
View Post
What about the 3:2 ratio, which now that the pH is confirmed to be high, would be relevant?
Is it a good idea to use DTPA with high PH? Yes.
I think three forms of Fe would be the ideal method, but that's just me. ie. Ferrous gluconate, EDTA and DTPA.
Planted Tank Obsessed
The OP has asked in this thread about a 3:2 ratio of csm+b and DTPA.
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