Coagulants, Flocculants and Some Deep Purple, Just Cause I Like Deep Purple - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 4 (permalink) Old 11-25-2014, 07:20 AM Thread Starter
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Smile Coagulants, Flocculants and Some Deep Purple, Just Cause I Like Deep Purple

Hi,

Kinda smoke in the water, but since I like KMnO4 I’ll go with Smoke On the Water.


A word or two about coagulants/flocculants. A while back, a question about haze in the aquarium came up. Of course the easy answer is shouted down.


While the words coagulant and flocculent are often used interchangeably, they actually have different meanings and I tend to say flocculent when I mean coagulant, my apologies , I will try to get it right from here on…

In this thread, I am referring to aluminum or iron metal salt coagulants to form floc to remove colloidal particulates from the water column by sedimentation or mechanical filtration. Clay based flocculants with a possible mention of possible algae fighting.



Then of course, my favorite, definitely neither coagulant nor flocculent, but a favorite of mine, and a best-selling aquarium water clarifier of course with an unnamed ingredient that is okay until I post, suggesting the use of the ingredient, by name.

I get that the retailers and manufacturers know the idea of neutralizing colloidal material so they stick together requires a level of thought.


It is therefore; easy to develop dogma asserting that since colloidal particles have a negative charge and since fish gills, have a negative charge any attempt to neutralize colloidal particles must damage the fish gills.



Gurus and cut-and-paste-types will repeat the dogma that only expensive devices can safely clear the haze.



The limiting factor in most coagulants is pH change, beyond pH change, too much coagulant could form gels that could clog gills, but by then the pH change would do the damage.

Worst of all, like me these methods are cheap and easy and as long as you pay attention, safe.

As a bonus to those interested, I will provide a sophisticated approach utilizing a (common) hydrated metal and the mystery ingredient.


Respectfully,
Joe
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If your Guru tells you otherwise and you are true believer that is okay I will not argue the point.
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Last edited by JoeRoun; 11-25-2014 at 07:22 AM. Reason: t not y
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post #2 of 4 (permalink) Old 11-25-2014, 11:38 AM
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My own thought's regarding so called beneficial oils such as tea tree oil ,and or aloe vera, such as found in some products like Stress coat,melafix,pima fix, is that oil does not adhere well to anything in water.(is why oil slicks float)
Furthermore, anything that claims to coat the fishes skin or scales if one believes the claim,must then also coat the fishes gill's ,thereby making it unnecessarily more difficult for the fish to respire.
Healthy fishes need no help producing slime coat or protecting same.
The use of these products and many flocculant's in my experiences over a few year's, only serves to clog filter material prematurely.
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post #3 of 4 (permalink) Old 11-25-2014, 04:31 PM Thread Starter
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Smile No Oils

Hi roadmaster, All,

‘Tis true, coagulants and flocculants can indeed increase the efficiency of mechanical filtration to a point that it can be a pain dealing with all the stuff in the water.



I dose minimal amounts coagulants at least twice a year in tanks that do not appear to need them and still remove amazing amounts of stuff.

I agree I do not like or use Stress coat, Melafix or Pimafix (Tea tree oil (TTO), or melaleuca oil from Melaleuca alternifolia leaves). I do occasionally use Aloe Vera in dips or baths for injured fish, but I don’t think I have ever dosed a tank with it.



No none of this stuff is the mystery ingredient.


More in a bit...


Respectfully,
Joe
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post #4 of 4 (permalink) Old 11-25-2014, 06:49 PM Thread Starter
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Smile Potassium aluminum sulfate dodecahydrate

Hi,

Most of the coagulants are hydrolyzed metal ions for my purposes Aluminum and Iron are of interest.

Over the years I have only used (best of my feeble memory) Alum, specifically, Potassium aluminum sulfate dodecahydrate and Ammonium aluminum sulfate dodecahydrate.



I prefer and recommend Potassium aluminum sulfate dodecahydrate. I simply do not like the ammonium since I do not know the circumstances (pH, temperature and so forth) it may be used.

The Alum sold in supermarkets tend to be Ammonium aluminum sulfate, McCormick’s Alum for example.

  • Most Chinese and/or Asian markets in the US carry “real” Alum, Potassium aluminum sulfate dodecahydrate. I steal mine from my significant other, an artist, who uses Alum as a mordant. The stuff is cheap.

A couple of dangers in using Alum it lowers the pH, I recommend at least 2-dKH, though it is unlikely you will ever consume more than 1.5-ppm KH as CaCO3. So if a religious leader says only 1-dKH is ever required, no drama.


I use a 4% solution, I know that is weak compared to commercial concoctions.

  • 40-grams Alum in 950-ml of distilled water,
    • mix until thoroughly dissolved,
    • this may take a couple of minutes;
  • add enough distilled water to make 1000-ml (liter) of solution.
  • This can also be used as dips or bathes,
    • not my favorite, but many use it.

Generally, I recommend dosing 1-ml per 10-liters of aquarium water. (A good rule of thumb is to subtract 15% of the tank volume to calculate water volume.)

  • Drizzle or spritz the Alum solution around the tank.
  • The water will likely become cloudier, sort of like smoke in the water.

1-ml of 4% Alum per 10-liters of water will lower pH 0.04, based on KH buffering. You should be able to dose 5-times higher (1-ml 4% Alum per 2-liters aquarium water) without much risk. Even, if other buffers are in control the effect on KH still exists, so do not exceed 1-ml 4% Alum per 2-liters aquarium water.

More to come.

Respectfully,
Joe
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If your Guru tells you otherwise and you are true believer that is okay I will not argue the point.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


I pretty much limit what I say to things that anyone can easily verify from recognized references or by direct observation. If it is my opinion I say so.

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clarifier, clay flocculants, coagulant, flocculent, kmno4

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