ei question - The Planted Tank Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 09:17 PM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
ei question

Here is my dosing schedule

Dosing Schedule
Sun - No dosing
mon - 50% water change - 1/4 tsb K2SO4, 1/2 tsp GH booster, 1/4 tsb of KN03, 1/16 tsp KH2P04
tue - 1/16 tsb trace (kent, tropica, etc)
wed - 1/4 tsb of KN03, 1/16 tsp KH2P04
thur - 1/16 tsb trace (kent, tropica, etc)
fri - 1/4 tsb of KN03, 1/16 tsp KH2P04
sat -1/16 tsb trace (kent, tropica, etc)

As you can see I only dose KS204 on Monday's after my water change. I have read that people dose it 3x a week. Meaning I should also dose it on days I do my macro's. What do you guys guys think?

What would happen if I didn't have enough k2so4 in my tank? How do I know if I have enough, and what is it used for?

Any suggestions on my dosing?
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 09:32 PM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I have done some more reading, and it looks like I'm not getting enough "K'. What do you think?
post #3 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 09:54 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
PTrader: (11/100%)
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 1,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick4him View Post
I have done some more reading, and it looks like I'm not getting enough "K'.
Not getting enough based on what? Do your plants have deficiencies related to lack of K? A lot of people don't dose any extra K, they rely on the traces found in KNO3. It doesn't hurt to add extra K but may not be needed, only your plants can tell you if they need more. Dose it 3x a week if you are worried that you are not adding enough, it can't hurt and your water will get reset when you do your 50% change each week. You are over thinking stuff. You have only recently started EI dosing and need to give it a few weeks and observe your tank to determine if the levels need adjusting. Select a plan and give it at least a few weeks before making changes.
captain_bu is offline  
 
post #4 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 10:00 PM
Planted Member
 
crisrisl's Avatar
 
PTrader: (22/100%)
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 189
Send a message via MSN to crisrisl
Give it time, watch your plants.

EI is about estimating and...watch and see if they show any signs of needing something.

Has your EI changed from the last thread you started about it?

72g bowfront: 7 x angelfish, 3 x albino bushynose plecos, 2 x otos, 2 x botia striata, 1 x school rummynose, 1 x school cardinals, 1 x male betta named Patata
92g corner: 4 x peppered cories, 2 x lonely discus, 1 x school rummynoses, 1 x school cardinals.
Also..shrimp, discus, angelfish, and now a Tanganyikan cichlid tank.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

crisrisl is offline  
post #5 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 10:14 PM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Well I was doing the math, and I'm I'm doing my math right, I'm adding only 8.25 "k" into my tank once a week. (via K2SO4) Plus I am getting a very small amount of "K' from my KNO3. So if I am doing my math right, there is no way I am any where around the recommended level of 20ppm, thus meaning my plants aren't getting enough "k".

Also it looks like I am adding WAY to much kh2p04 into my tank. (IF I am doing the math right) it looks like I'm adding around 10-13 ppm of phosphate to my tank, when the suggested level is around 1.0 ppm.
which would cause issues in my tank.

thoughts?
post #6 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-04-2008, 11:30 PM
Children Boogie
 
mistergreen's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 16,743
I'd shoot for 4ppm of PO4.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
mistergreen is offline  
post #7 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-05-2008, 12:09 AM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistergreen View Post
I'd shoot for 4ppm of PO4.

really?
That's not bad ?

Also it doesn't look like I"m getting enough "K". I'm supposed to be at 20ppm, but if I do the math it looks i"m not adding near that amount.

Thoughts? Is my math wrong somewhere?
post #8 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-10-2008, 01:51 AM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PRESTON4479's Avatar
 
PTrader: (63/100%)
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Newark, DE
Posts: 879
Send a message via MSN to PRESTON4479
It looks like a 1/4tsp might be fine considering your getting "k" from other things you are dosing. I'm not sure how accurate this is but it may be worth playing around with.
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...fertilator.php

Brian

Equipment: 55g, 3x 9watt tt uv, 2-xp3's, pressurized co2, inline co2 reactor, 216 watt catalina t5 fixture, milwaukee ph controller, 300 watt hydor inline heater, aqua soil
Filstar Pimp #100
PRESTON4479 is offline  
post #9 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-10-2008, 01:54 AM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRESTON4479 View Post
It looks like a 1/4tsp might be fine considering your getting "k" from other things you are dosing. I'm not sure how accurate this is but it may be worth playing around with.
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...fertilator.php
Hey thanks - this looks like a really cool tool.
post #10 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 05:36 AM
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (9/100%)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Broadview Hts, OHIO
Posts: 125
Why do you claim you only get a "small" amount of K from KNO3? You are dosing the stuff 3x a week. That is way more than you are dosing from K2SO4.
Mishmosh is offline  
post #11 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 05:53 AM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mishmosh View Post
Why do you claim you only get a "small" amount of K from KNO3? You are dosing the stuff 3x a week. That is way more than you are dosing from K2SO4.
So what do you mean?
post #12 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 05:45 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
plantbrain's Avatar
 
PTrader: (267/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The swamp
Posts: 13,609
He means relative to Nitrogen you have about 4X more if you dose KNO3 before you become K+ limiting.

Typical N to K+ ratios are about 1-1.5 to 1.
Since NO3 also has a lot of Oxygens, that reduces the ratio down to about 4:1 N:K.

Also, KH2PO4 adds a little, GH booster/SeaChem Eq is about 30-50% K2SO4.

So you really do not need to add it from other sources.
However, doing so will not help either.

There were a bunch of folks in the early 2000's that claimed excess K+ caused problems, but I argued it was something else, not K+ and demonstrated it specifically. Still, they where unconvinced but never supported their reasons. But if it was true, we'd seen and heard more about it, but that's not been the case.

Folks go from one nutrient to the next blaming it for this or that, this comes up and makes a few rounds every few months or years.

If the nutrient is non limiting, then you can move on and look for another reason.

But you have to know what non limiting is for the system and perhaps a good idea to know what the upper bounds are as well.

But I do not know what the upper bounds for K+ and PO4 really are.
Well over 100ppm for both.
Non limiting about 15-20ppm for K+, likely less, and PO4 as long as some is present at 0.2ppm or higher as SRP.

So it really is a huge wide range, which given the wide range of environment conditions plants deal with, something we'd predict.

Still, some think there's some narrow precise range the nutrients must be maintained at, which flies in the face of logic, plant science and observations.

There are much bigger fish to fry here.

Light(Virtually never measured, unlike NO3 etc) and CO2(very poorly measured), general care/cleaning/filter cleaning/good gardening/fish loads, feeding, consideration of the light to CO2 to nutrient load.

These things can do far more damage or help to a planted tank than nutrients, but few bother to really go after and measure them.

Getting decent nutrients and keeping within a pre set range(you chose whatever that might be) is really pretty easy.

Very critical measurement of CO2 without interference, or light measurement are much tougher. And these are what drives a tank, nutrients are downstream of these, but still critical.

If you cannot compare light to a different tank, or CO2, that obviously will cause changes to any conclusions about the nutrients. Still, even with this glaring hole, many still try

Some do account for light to some degree, or have decent CO2. Some know what good CO2 looks like because the nutrients and and the light are fixed variables. The they adjust the CO2 to an optimal level using the fish and plants and they also have good current, prune routinely, good flow, some surface movement etc.

CO2 has a number of issues. It's not so simple as some suggest.

Regards,
Tom Barr

Regards,
Tom Barr




Regards,
Tom Barr
plantbrain is offline  
post #13 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 09:24 PM
rick4him
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Tom -
Thanks so much for your input. The dosing I listed at the very top, do they look ok for my tank? (you can click on my profile picture to see how many plants I have if you need to.)

From what I understand I won't be "over" dosing if I stick to the schedule above, correct?
post #14 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 10:08 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
plantbrain's Avatar
 
PTrader: (267/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The swamp
Posts: 13,609
No, that's not over dosing, it's certainly non limiting, but it's not over dosing which implies a negative response to plants, fish , general maintenance etc.

You have ADA AS also, so that's "over dosing" as well if you compare it like folks seem to enjoy comparing water column dosing.

I'm curious why more are not interested in lean sediments
Plants have access and are exposed the same way in either case.

Seems that having rich nutrients in both locations would yield the best response. If you forget to dose the water column, you have a back up, if you dose the water column also: you have less drain on the sediment making it last longer.



Regards,
Tom Barr




Regards,
Tom Barr
plantbrain is offline  
post #15 of 36 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 10:20 PM
Algae Grower
 
mooner's Avatar
 
PTrader: (4/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Colorado
Posts: 130
Rick, Are you not reading what people are saying?? You have all the answers in front of you!! It is close to the same advice you were given at the Barr Report. Not sure why you won't take the advise given, you say you want help

The last post from Tom talked about lighting!!! And someone told you that EI is a starting point. You must wait and observe your plants. I run 30 gal(s) with only 55W CF and in a month the tanks are near grown in. Keep your EI schedule stable and don't make sudden changes!! Cut your light in half. As Tom has said this will give you more wiggle room and less chance for error. Once you get a handle on what your take requires, then you can up your light knowing what it needed at lower light.

Please go back and re-read the advice that all have given. The advice is sound.
mooner is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome