Water Heater Water with RO Unit...? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-21-2006, 05:31 PM Thread Starter
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Water Heater Water with RO Unit...?

Bought an RO Unit and waiting its arrival. Trying to sort everything out including its placement, and just overall setup.

I've read the threads about using warm water from the water heater to adjust the temps for WCs--some say "Don't", others say "I always have!" I'm of the school that always has.

From what I am reading the best temp for RO production is 77F. Its winter now and my cold water temps are way below that. So, I am wondering what the effect would be on waste water quantity and membrane life and efficiency of using warm water from the water heater to adjust the temps up into the +/-77F range? It wouldn't take much.

I already spent the extra for the Booster Pump, because I know my household water pressure is too low---what about mixing in warm water from the water heater?

TIA


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Last edited by Naja002; 11-28-2006 at 02:33 PM.
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 12:29 AM
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Hi Naja002
A Hydor ETH 300 In-Line Heater-300 W will safely heat your RO output water. It is controlled by a thermostat and can stay on all the time.



Hydor ETH 300 In-Line Heater-300 W at Big Al's Online
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 01:01 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Edward,

Thanx, but what I was looking for is heating the RO Input water to maximize efficiency of the RO unit......

I haven't quite decided how I am going to deal with the output water, but I have several options there......

Thanx!


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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 02:17 AM
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Why not use the Hydor for your input? an RO system doesn't have that great of a flow rate, right?

Tommy

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-27-2006, 04:31 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Tommy,

One reason would be another $50 plus shipping, but that's not really that big of a deal. I guess I would have to weigh potential waste water/time savings verses the cost.

Another question I would have would be the effect of the Hydor constantly kicking on and off at such a low flow rate. I know it wouldn't be running 24/7, but I would guess that it would be constantly clicking on/off, on/off at that low of a Flow rate with that wattage of heater.

My main question with the water heater water is added TDS from the water heating process. With the water heater water--all I have to do is turn a knob and adjust it to a good temp range. Nothing to buy or install, etc, etc, etc....


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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 12:15 PM
 
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If you want to hook the RO system up on the hot water side of your water heater go ahead.
Just remember that the manufacture probably said not to do it that way.

If I were you, I wouldn't be worried about running under optimal conditions. Those optimal conditions are bases for the manufactures to boost their GPD ratings and the life expectancy of the filter membranes.

Your best bet is to get a dual TDS monitor and watch the output ratings versus the input. Flush the membrane often if you have a high TDS input. When your output starts to show higher TDS readings despite flushing it's time to get a new one.
If you really want to heat the water before the RO system it would be better to plumb an inline heater right before the RO system then it would be to turn the hot water temperature down in your entire house. Especially if you have copper plumbing and are going to use the piercing saddle valve to tap in for the water supply. That's kind of a permanent change that you can't undo easily.
The heater they show above will hook up to the system the same way as the rest of the RO system but it is a different hose size. I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. It's not going to save you that much money in the long run. It would probably take a couple of years just to pay off the inline heater. But you may be buying a new RO system pretty soon if you plumb into your hot water.
Just my 2cents
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 01:46 PM
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Most all of the literature I've read from companies selling RO units and parts state to never put heated water through an RO unit, as it could damage the membrane.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 02:23 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
I wouldn't worry about it if I were you.
Believe me--I'm not. But I think everyone is seeing this differently then what I was getting at......

I'm not interested in running Hot water through the RO unit or turning the heater down to 77F. My question was simply about tapping into both the cold water and hot water supplies and then adjusting the water to a higher temp---just like doing a WC on an aquarium. That's all. Just tweak a little hot water into the mostly cold water. I was concerned more with adding a lot more TDS's from the Hot water supply and using up the filters faster--that's all. I had no thoughts of running 120F+ water through the system.

The Hydor would be way too much investment for this purpose. And as adamt said: it would take a couple of yrs to get that back from any "savings". Honestly: Probably 20yrs!

I am not really setup for a permanent solution (setup) with this whole RO thing. So, I am/was just considering how I can maximize production and minimize production-time and waste water without burning up the filters in the process.

The question revolves around simply tapping into both the hot and cold water supplies and mixing for a temp +/-77F and any disproportionate amounts of TDS's from the Hot water supply--that's all. Its about TDS's, not Temp: 77F is 77F.

Quote:
never put heated water through an RO unit, as it could damage the membrane.
I guess that's part of my question: Damage the membrane How? I assume they mean "Damage" from the heat. If so, that doesn't apply to what I'm getting at: 77F is 77F. If it was just the extra wear from more TDS's then I assume they would word it in a way that means: "Shorten the lifespan"

Thanx for the Input though!


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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 09:11 PM
 
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How are you thinking about tapping in for a supply line? Do you have copper plumbing?

I installed my system in the basement and ran a line up through the floor to the kitchen for a facet and I ran a second line over to my storage container. Then the storage container runs up, through the floor again, to my fish tank via mag drive 7.

I think you may be surprised by the pressure that your system will have.
I think you have a good idea about splitting two lines to get an ideal temperature. If you can tee off the main lines instead of tapping into one with a saddle valve you will be better off.

Again I wouldn't worry about the increased TDS from the Hot water heater. I would recomend a dual tds meter for your unit though. I think that is a better way to determine when you need to replace your membrane rather then saying every 6 months or whatever the manufacture recomends.

Also when you are installing the RO system make sure that you push the tubes into the connectors real hard. I didn't do that to all the connectors when I first set my system up and it sprung a lot of leaks. The tubes go about 1/2" in to the connectors
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-28-2006, 09:22 PM Thread Starter
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Thanx for the Input. Glad somebody finally understands what I was getting at......

The RO unit just arrived about an hr ago, so I've been putting it together, but not actually installing it yet!

I am already Tee-d into the cold water supply for a variation of Wasserpest's auto-WC system. It cost me about $12 to get the fitting to go from the standard house plumbing Compression fitting to NPT. All I need for cold water is another NPT Tee. But for the Hot water its another $12 for the fitting!

Then Tee both of those lines together with a small ball-valve on the hot side and it should be good to go.

I bought the Booster pump, so this system should be kicking at about 80psi. And it came with the Milwaukee TDS Meter (CD97) and PSI Gauge, so I'm pretty much good to go.

I won't be hooking up the Hot water supply any time soon--too many other things to sort out. But I may give it a whirl in the near future.

Thanx for following this through with me!

EDIT: I did TDS tests on my water supply: Cold 307ppm, Hot 258ppm!, Distilled 10ppm. The Hot actually reads Less!

EDIT2: Well, its not formally installed, but it is up and running. Luckily, I've been into enough stuff over the yrs that I had on hand the fittings and Icemaker tubing to connect up to the kitchen sink via the python faucet attachment. So, I am currently mixing Hot and Cold as is the topic of this thread. We'll see how it goes.......


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Last edited by Naja002; 11-28-2006 at 11:25 PM.
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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-29-2006, 03:05 AM
 
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That tubing is a woping 7cents a foot at lowes.

You have better water then I do. I average about 360 ppm tds.
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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 12-03-2006, 08:29 AM Thread Starter
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Worked fine mixing hot and cold from the sink. I don't have enough experience to really tell any increase in production. I ran it for about 12+hrs total with NPs......


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