Need Help with Ferts Please - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-11-2006, 01:47 AM Thread Starter
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Need Help with Ferts Please

I just received my Ferts order from Greg Watson, boy are they fast in shipping.
Correct me please if I am wrong!
I have a 29 gal with 2 watts of light with CO2.

KH2PO4 - mix 1 1/2 teaspoons with 250 mil water. Dose 1 mil to get .53ppm in 10 gal water. Target 1.0 - 2.0 ppm.

KNO3 - mix 3 treaspoons to 250 mil water. Dose 1 mil to get 1.08 to 10 gal of water. Target 10 - 20 ppm.

K2S04 - mix dry. 1/4 teaspoon to get 17.72 ppm in 10 gallon of water.
Whats my target?

CSM+B - Mix 3 teaspoons to 250 mil water. Dose 4 mil per 10 gal water 3 times a week.

Iron Chelate - Mix 3 teaspoons to 250 mil water. How much do I dose? . Target .1 -1.0 ppm.

Thank you in advance.
Joe

10 gallon hospital tank.
29 & 50 gallon - High Tech C02 enriched.
50 gallon Pond - Natural.
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 05:20 PM
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Funny you should ask, I'm trying to figure out the same.
Can anyone help?
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 06:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joetee
I just received my Ferts order from Greg Watson, boy are they fast in shipping.
Correct me please if I am wrong!
I have a 29 gal with 2 watts of light with CO2.

KH2PO4 - mix 1 1/2 teaspoons with 250 mil water. Dose 1 mil to get .53ppm in 10 gal water. Target 1.0 - 2.0 ppm.

KNO3 - mix 3 treaspoons to 250 mil water. Dose 1 mil to get 1.08 to 10 gal of water. Target 10 - 20 ppm.

K2S04 - mix dry. 1/4 teaspoon to get 17.72 ppm in 10 gallon of water.
Whats my target?

CSM+B - Mix 3 teaspoons to 250 mil water. Dose 4 mil per 10 gal water 3 times a week.

Iron Chelate - Mix 3 teaspoons to 250 mil water. How much do I dose? . Target .1 -1.0 ppm.

Thank you in advance.
Joe
I doubt you will need to use K2SO4 at all.

CSM+B is typically mixed 1 tablespoon to 250 ml water. See the sticky at the top of this forum.

I also don't know that you'll need iron chelate either but I'm no expert.

Most folks are fine with KNO3, KH2PO4, and traces. Some dose Flourish Iron.. something about ferric vs. ferrous iron.

for making solutions see Chuck Gadd's calculator.

http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_p...osage_calc.htm

Regards,
Barry
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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 07:31 PM
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It is much easier, and accurate enough to dose KNO3 and KH2PO4 as dry chemicals. Just dip the little spoon in the bag and dump it in the tank. The fish don't mind at all, and the plants certainly don't mind. EI is the best, in my opinion, way to dose the ferts too. The principle of EI is to dose enough of each fertilizer often enough that there is never a shortage of any of them. Then do a weekly 50% water change just in case you dosed too much. For my 29 gallon tank, with 110 watts of light, I dose 3/8 tsp KNO3 every other day, 1/16 tsp of KH2PO4 every other day, and CSM+B+extra iron mixed two tsp in 250 ml of water - about 15 ml on days I don't dose the macros. I also add 2 tsp of MgSO4 to the CSM+ solution to make sure I have enough magnesium.

Hoppy
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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoppy
It is much easier, and accurate enough to dose KNO3 and KH2PO4 as dry chemicals. Just dip the little spoon in the bag and dump it in the tank. The fish don't mind at all, and the plants certainly don't mind. EI is the best, in my opinion, way to dose the ferts too. The principle of EI is to dose enough of each fertilizer often enough that there is never a shortage of any of them. Then do a weekly 50% water change just in case you dosed too much. For my 29 gallon tank, with 110 watts of light, I dose 3/8 tsp KNO3 every other day, 1/16 tsp of KH2PO4 every other day, and CSM+B+extra iron mixed two tsp in 250 ml of water - about 15 ml on days I don't dose the macros. I also add 2 tsp of MgSO4 to the CSM+ solution to make sure I have enough magnesium.
I guess it's a personal perference but I found it a much bigger pain to pull out my bag of powders, get my scoop, dump it in the tank, zip up the bags, put them back in the closet and still not feel sure about accuracy, especially with the tiny amounts of PO4 I was dosing.

Now I keep a pre-mixed solution, draw 5 ml out with an oral syringe, squirt, and I'm done. Way easier, in my experience

Regards,
Barry
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 08:17 PM
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This will answer your questions Joe.

http://ca.geocities.com/[email protected]

It is from this article...

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...ew-tables.html

jB
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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 11:34 PM
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Ok, let's complicate things--Sorry, Joe....

Tom Barr's EI example is based on a 20gal with 5.5wpg.

Joe only has 2wpg. That is high-end--Low-Tech.

So, dosing by standard EI--Probably goes right out the window.....in both quantity and frequency.


Iron: on a 29gal tank 3tsp in 250ml--You will need to dose 1.52ml to =0.1ppm
10x that for 1.0ppm, 5x that for 0.5ppm, and so-on.....


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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-18-2006, 11:40 PM
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2 watts per gallon isn't really high light, but when I had only 1.75 watts per gallon from NO fluorescents I dosed almost as much as now and the plants did pretty well. As far as using dry vs. mixed with water, it really is just personal preference. Both methods work, so the best idea is to do what is most appealing to you - in my opinion. If the plants grow well and the algae doesn't, then your method must be a good one.

Hoppy
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-19-2006, 12:10 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks guys. I'll have to study this just a little bit more to really understand it all.

What I am really confused about is I see one place that 5ppm of Nitrate in normal and thin another place 20 ppm. I also read that as long as my Nitrate is less than 40 ppm, I should be fine. But since I just lost 7 fish, I don't think I will be dosing KN03 for a while since even after a water change my Nitrate is around 10 ppm. What do you all think?
Joe

10 gallon hospital tank.
29 & 50 gallon - High Tech C02 enriched.
50 gallon Pond - Natural.
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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-19-2006, 12:15 AM
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Currently, I'm not dosing any N03 or P04--the fish, etc take care of that for me....

All i'm dosing is: K, Fe, Mg and CSM+B. So far: it's working Great. For the short time that I tried EI--N03 and P04 wound up Off-the-Chart....

But this is the part where You have to sort out Your tank.....The other stuff is just guidelines....


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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-19-2006, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by banderbe
CSM+B is typically mixed 1 tablespoon to 250 ml water.
I prefer to mix up a weaker solution than this and then just dose a larger quantity (see http://www.GregWatson.com/HowToDosePlantex.htm ) ... i.e. 1 Tablespoons (big T) in 500 ml of water ...

A weaker solution tends to avoid what I call the "gunky" mess or "ring around the bottle" that looks lumpy or like scum ... all around, I think it just makes a more easily managed solution ...

<grin> ... but obvioiusly that is just my personal opinion ... I know one guy who swears he can mix in 4 tablespoons in 500 ml (not something I would recommend doing <grin>) ...

Greg


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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-20-2006, 03:59 AM Thread Starter
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julesann,

Have you figured out and received the answers to all your questions concerning dosing ferts?

I keep running into walls.

10 gallon hospital tank.
29 & 50 gallon - High Tech C02 enriched.
50 gallon Pond - Natural.
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-20-2006, 04:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joetee

I keep running into walls.
Joe,

That is because you aren't looking where you are going

You are over complicating it by wanting to mix all the fert's into diluted solution's.

You are trying to complicate the issue, I have all the information you most likely need in the sticky above,
Dosing a 29g tank that is moderately to heavy planted, dose dry powder, nothing is easier.

50%H20 change-weekly
+/-1/4Tsp-KN03 2x a week w/2wpg
+/-1/16Tsp-KH2P04 2x aweek w/2wpg
+/-1/16Tsp K2S04 2x a week w/2wpg
+/-5ml Trace 2x a week w/2wpg
Throw you're test kit's away, except for KH pH.

If the tank is broke in/matured you should have very little trouble, you just have to learn how to read the tank, if dosing as above and you are getting algae, then you either:

1) Insufficient C02
2) to much light for to long
3) Not enough plant mass
4) all the above.

You can mix the Plantex any way you chose, I personally like 1 Tablespoon to 250 ml, 1 capful=5ml, or in your case at this time, one capful=10ml.

Craig

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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-20-2006, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WfxXx
Joe,

That is because you aren't looking where you are going

You are over complicating it by wanting to mix all the fert's into diluted solution's.

You are trying to complicate the issue, I have all the information you most likely need in the sticky above,
Dosing a 29g tank that is moderately to heavy planted, dose dry powder, nothing is easier.

50%H20 change-weekly
+/-1/4Tsp-KN03 2x a week w/2wpg
+/-1/16Tsp-KH2P04 2x aweek w/2wpg
+/-1/16Tsp K2S04 2x a week w/2wpg
+/-5ml Trace 2x a week w/2wpg
Throw you're test kit's away, except for KH pH.

If the tank is broke in/matured you should have very little trouble, you just have to learn how to read the tank, if dosing as above and you are getting algae, then you either:

1) Insufficient C02
2) to much light for to long
3) Not enough plant mass
4) all the above.

You can mix the Plantex any way you chose, I personally like 1 Tablespoon to 250 ml, 1 capful=5ml, or in your case at this time, one capful=10ml.
I started using the above regime and found that my PO4 and NO3 levels were *way* too high.

Around 40 to 50 ppm NO3, 5 to 6 ppm PO4.

I cut those amounts in half, stopped dosing K2SO4, got rid of CSM+B and started dosing TMG, and my tank immediately started looking better.

Three months later and I know much closer what my tank likes, and so now I do mix a solution of KNO3 and KH2PO4 and it is far easier than messing with bags of powder.

Regards,
Barry
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-21-2006, 04:18 PM
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Can one buy ferts from local gardening store?

I know I can buy ferts from the net but, I was wondering can you purchase these from local stores such as Walmart, Meijer, or a local garden store? I will order some but I seem to need some right now. Or is there something I can purchase just to get me by until I order? I do have some leaf safe in liquid form that I use now. My plants seem to be doing good but want to add the proper ferts. One other thing I am short on substrate and wanted to know if it's alright to add more even though I have fish and water in it now. I would wait until I do a water change to do this. Thanks, any info will be greatly appreciated. Stretch
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