Help! Seachem Excel Dose Is Killing My Cichlids - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:15 AM Thread Starter
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Exclamation Help! Seachem Excel Dose Is Killing My Cichlids

About an hour ago I started using Excel for the first time. I've been using Flourish for about a year now 2x a week. I was told that it would help fight my BBA.

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29L About a year old with cichlids
lightly planted with gravel substrate
illuminated with 1 coralife T5NO 24"
Had a pressurized CO2 system up until 3 weeks ago when I switched it to tank 2
Dosing with Seachem Flourish 2x weekly and DIY osmocote root tabs as needed

I put in 2 light capfuls of Excel and a half of a capful of Flourish.

My fish are swiming upside down and sideways. The healthier looking ones are at the surface.

I got nervous and changed 5 gallons. I did not see results, so I changed 5 gallons again. I still did not see results so I changed 10 gallons. It was looking better for about 10 mins, but it's going down hill again.

Any ideas? I have a very large airstone running right now in case is an oxygen issue.
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:17 AM
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are you dosing according to the instructions on the bottle? if that's an overdose, excel can be pretty toxic.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:22 AM Thread Starter
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On initial use or after a major (> 40%) water change, use 1 capful (5 mL) for every 40 L (10 gallons*). Thereafter use 1 capful for every 200 L (50 gallons*) daily or every other day. Dosing may be slowly increased in high-growth aquariums. For smaller dosing please note that each cap thread is approximately 1 mL.

I split the difference between an initial use and daily dose thinking that I didn't want to overdo it.
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:23 AM Thread Starter
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Only my cichlids are affected. My other tank which is a 30L seems 100% fine. I've read that Excel can cause a tank to rapidly cycle, killing the bacteria and reducing the oxygen. I think this is what's happening, I just don't know what to do as I feel I've already done a significant water change.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:31 AM
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Most recommend sticking to 1ml/10 gal on excel, and skipping the "loading" dose. You just added 2 capfuls, which is 10ml, enough for a 100g tank.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:36 AM Thread Starter
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So why do they have the "loading dose" on the freakin label? Setting that aside, what do I do now to save my fish from dying? How much water change is too much? How come the same dosage didn't affect my 30 gallon in the same way?
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:48 AM
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Sorry to hear that. Is there anything else you put into that tank that you didn't put into the other? Maybe you could try adding an air pump to help reduce the lack of oxygen.


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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 03:55 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by LICfish View Post
Sorry to hear that. Is there anything else you put into that tank that you didn't put into the other? Maybe you could try adding an air pump to help reduce the lack of oxygen.
I have a 14" airstone and a round plug type going now.
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 04:18 AM
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as long as the bacteria is in your filter

you can change up to 90% of the water as long as the parameters are the same

I change 50% all the time on my saulosi tank
cichlids love water changes
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 04:22 AM
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Did you use Seachem Prime, or an equivalent dechlorinator, when you did the water changes?

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 04:27 AM Thread Starter
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I used Aqueon's water conditioner.

Is it possible to do to much of a water change?
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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 04:29 AM Thread Starter
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Also, I have a 2.5 gallon bucket that I fill. I put a 2.5 gallon dosage into the bucket and mix it up before dumping it in my tank. Is that how you guys do it as well?
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 05:33 AM
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Fill up a bucket with water, throw some dechlorinator in and get your fish into that bucket with an airstone. They will be all right overnight while you get your tank figured out. It's best to get them out of that environment.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 09:36 AM
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yes there is a chance that u could do to much of a wc at once, likely eh prob not. it all depends on the water thats in there tds and what your replacing it with it could put them into osmotic shock but ive seen some off the chart #'s back to super low without issues its all on how its done. think of it as the same way u acclimate a fish to your tank from a different water peramiter, if the tank was super bad and u put it into a prestine tank it very well could and has happend just not common.

the real thing that u need to do is test to see what it really is go step by step and eliminate possibilitys, if it was a o.d. on excel, osmoshock(not as likely), ammonia build up(possible with out knowing how your tank is stocked), or some unknown from the water, tempature shock? kinda hard to say without the right info... its kinda a guess crapshoot so take ur pick..
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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012, 12:15 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HypnoticAquatic View Post
the real thing that u need to do is test to see what it really is go step by step and eliminate possibilitys, if it was a o.d. on excel, osmoshock(not as likely), ammonia build up(possible with out knowing how your tank is stocked), or some unknown from the water, tempature shock? kinda hard to say without the right info... its kinda a guess crapshoot so take ur pick..
Definitely not ammonia, PH, or Nitrates. Those were the first things I tested.

Things seem to be stable again. I lost 3 fish in this ordeal.
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