raising Gh, levels are at 6-7 Kh, 2Gh - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-25-2005, 11:26 PM Thread Starter
 
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raising Gh, levels are at 6-7 Kh, 2Gh

Hi next month Im moving, cant wait to move the 150g that will be fun . Where im moving to the tap water is from lake michigan and when I tested the tap it came out 6-7 KH , with 2Gh. Where I live now I have Rock hard water and have been diluting my tap with RO 1:4 to get it down to 3-4 KH with 11 Gh. So with the new water supply I think I should leave the Kh alone and Raise the GH, this is for a discus tank, any ideas what I should bring the gh up to and what would be a good thing to use for a well rounded Gh? Or is a Gh this low Ok?
Thanks
dan
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-25-2005, 11:43 PM
 
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I'd bring your GH up to around 8 to 10 or so using a combination of CaCl2 and MgSO4.
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-29-2005, 03:27 AM Thread Starter
 
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Is there a better blend for overall balance or is ca and mg fine by themselfs? Does anyone have a formula that shows how much ca mg to raise hardness a degree?
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-29-2005, 03:47 AM
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Mine is Gh is 0.0 and Kh is 6.8, I add some Equilibrium to bring the Gh up 5.0 if I don't you can see the plants start to curl/krinkle (very technical) from a lack of calcium. I never seen any problem as far as the fish go, they seem to be happy a 0 or 5, although I have never let it stay at zero very long. Why would you need as high as 8 or 10?


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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-29-2005, 04:41 PM
 
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At a GH of 5 I feel that I'm at the edge of not having enough Ca or Mg. At between 8 and 10 I'm *sure* that there is enough.

And I've never seen any harm from that level of GH, either for plants or fish. In fact, I have the impression things look healthier than at lower GH.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-29-2005, 05:27 PM
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OK, my plants seem to be curling a little bit, so I whent today and got some epsom salt, now that is Magnesium sulfate. Should I rather be adding calcium, what is a good source for calcium? Just eqilibrium og milk Unfortunately I´m not able to order from Greg Watson since he doesn´t ship overseas.

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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 02:03 AM
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Calcium Chloride is a great source of calcium. If you shop around some brands of ice melter are pure calcium chloride.

freeflyer. Is that water going though a water softener?

Also note that Seachem Equilibrium adds a ton of potassium to the water so if you are using it to raise gH you will not need to add additional potassium.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 03:56 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex Grigg
freeflyer. Is that water going though a water softener?
Technically yes but it appears to have been out of salt for an extended period so I think its not doing anything, the house I am buying has been neglected so Im assuming its been empty a long time. When I tested the water I was not suprised as I have heard the Milwaukee/ lake michigan water is very soft. Ill double check by bypassing the softener completely once I get back in there. I just wanted to be prepared as far as knowing I will need to do to add Gh, cause once those keys are mine I will be very busy for a month or so (puting in red birch flooring, plastering, painting....) and will have no time for surfing around for information.
So should I just use calcium chloride and Mag. sulf. then? I remember hearing a ratio of 1:4 is that 1 part mag to 4 part ca.?
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 06:28 AM
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Just wondering, since I know nothing on chemistry. Can the calcium also be derived from calcium carbonate sources - like seashells and oysters and the like? Or must it be in the calcium chloride form? And I also don't know the ratio of Mg to CaCl2 Thanks for this thread. I have near zero GH out of the tap and have often wondered if I have a calcium deficiency, though I haven't noticed leaf curl... bob





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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betowess
Can the calcium also be derived from calcium carbonate sources - like seashells and oysters and the like? Or must it be in the calcium chloride form?
Calcium Carbonate (CaCO3) can be used to raise General Hardness, but be aware that it will also raise you Carbonate Hardness (KH) at the same time. Some desire this, some don't.... it all depends on your GH/KH situation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betowess
..if I have a calcium deficiency, though I haven't noticed leaf curl...
A Calcium defficiency is shown by twisted, bent and deformed new leafs, which die off prematurely (sometimes with yellowish edges). Also death of shoot tips can occur.
A Magnesium defficiency differs by showing in the older leaves.... yellowing of the edges, spreading inwards whilst veins remain green..... similar to iron defficiency (but shown in old leaves).


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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 08:19 AM
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Thanks alot for the info, Stu. Do you know the ratio of MG to CaCl2?





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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 11:06 AM
 
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Two points:

Calcium Carbonate will also take forever to dissolve and have any impact on the tank.

Greg Watson *does* ship overseas. I've gotten ferts from him. Send him an email and he will set it up for you. The only thing he can't ship overseas is KNO3.
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 01:44 PM Thread Starter
 
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Ok I just found the tap report online heres the hardness Im not sure which is which or how to convert to degrees. these are the median levels
Alkalinity as CaCo3 99
harness, totall, as CaCo3 131
hardness,calcium, as CaCo3 105
hardness, mag, as CaCo3 29
totall dissolves solids 169

How are these levels for chlorine? Close to normal, should a normal dose of declor be enough?
chlorine free .06
chlorine total 1.32
Thanks everyone
dan
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-30-2005, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betowess
Thanks alot for the info, Stu. Do you know the ratio of MG to CaCl2?
Think most people use a 3:1 ratio of calcium to magnesium.

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeflyer
Ok I just found the tap report online heres the hardness Im not sure which is which or how to convert to degrees. these are the median levels
Alkalinity as CaCo3 99
harness, totall, as CaCo3 131
hardness,calcium, as CaCo3 105
hardness, mag, as CaCo3 29
totall dissolves solids 169

How are these levels for chlorine? Close to normal, should a normal dose of declor be enough?
chlorine free .06
chlorine total 1.32
Well, I don't know any scientific data of what levels of choline are considered relatively "safe" for fish, but I would put in an educated guess that a dechlorinator has to contain enough Sodium Thiosulphate in the recommended dose to neutralise what could possibly be the top end limit of chlorine levels for human consumption in the tap supply, just to be sure. If there's more than this level in the supply, the water company gets busted.
i.e, I wouldn't worry about chlorine removal. The issue would only arise if you wanted to reduce the amount you add and fine tune to try and conserve your supply, but this could get risky if you take it too far.

Just for reference, here's my chlorine from water report...
Free Chlorine = 0.13
Total Chlorine = 0.17
Strange how the two values in your supply are widely different and mine are relatively close.

Now, to the hardness...
To obtain degrees of hardness from ppm (mg/l), you need to multiply by 0.056.
Therefore...
GH (total hardness) is 7.336 (131ppm x 0.056)
KH (alkalinity) is 5.544 (99ppm x 0.056)
Ignore total dissolved solids (TDS) as this isn't useful for a tank situation.
Calcium and Magnesium is nice to know if you want to fiddle and fine tune you fert (Ca & Mg) dosing regime.


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