What to buy? new planted tank - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-17-2005, 04:43 PM Thread Starter
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Question What to buy? new planted tank

I am just trying to get everything together for my planted aquarium. I am really excited. I am putting together a list of the things I still need to buy, but since this is my first I am not sure what I need. The tank will have lots of shrimp and rummy nose tetras. Plant life will consist of: moss (java and xmas), Rotala wallichii, ricca fluitans, and maybe one or two rosette plants. What supplements will I need for a successful tank.
I was planning on getting.
Aquarium freshwater salt.
Kent ProPlant
Kent Black Water Expert
Kent Freshwater Plant Supplement
ProTech Coat ( I believe this is Kents version of the generic Stress Coat)
Iodine (very small amounts to help shrimp)

It will be expensive up front but should last me a long time. Anything you would or change?
I don't have any products that change or alter ph and I am lost there.
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-17-2005, 06:30 PM
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Hi syndi, just from my experience, I would buy nothing of what you mentioned.

The only "supplement" you need would be something to neutralize Chlorine/Chloramine which might be present in your tap water.

You will need fertilizers for your plants, both micros (which might be in your listing) and macros, and to adjust pH, you would add CO2.

I'd say spend your money on light and CO2 instead of "Black Water Expert" and "Pro-Tech Coat".


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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-17-2005, 06:41 PM
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Lets start with the basics:
What size tank do you have?
What kind of lighting are you using?
Are you injecting CO2?

For ferts assumeing that you have adiquite lighting and CO2 supplimentation I would reccomend gregwatson.com and get dry ferts. There are a lot of posts on how to dose and tools out there to help. Commercial ferts can get $$$$, I spent $80 with greg and have enough ferts for all my tanks for life.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-17-2005, 10:18 PM
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I agree with Wasser and diss. I once was like you and thought that all those fancy water additives like "black water extract" were essential --- these are not really needed and DEFINATELY don't add any of those "Ph down/up" additives as they contain phosphates and other things that will cause problems with your water condition --- I got green water from using this and I never used it again.
You need to start with the basic question: What do I need to grow plants? There are many, many threads/posts on this site and others that answer this in much more details than I'll get into, but your main concerns are:
1)light ----> I would recommend 2wpg (watts-per-gallon) at least, depending on what you're trying to grow.
2)CO2 ----> This helps tremendously. I know you're probably thinking "why?", "how", "is it expensive?" That's what I thought. To be honest, the best way(by far) is pressurized CO2, but if you're a first-timer and just experimenting, etc you'll probably be fine with the DIY CO2 (yeast method) which there is much discussion about if you do a search.
3)fertilizer (substrate & water column) ----> You'll need to fetilize the water column, but not too much. If you don't have test kits, you at least should have pH, KH, GH and Ammonia/nitrite/nitrate. If you don't want to buy these, then do *at least* 1 water change a week and you should be fine. As for gravel/substrate, you really should have a nutrient-rich substrate like eco-complete, fluorite, onyx or similar, but if you want to use the inert aquarium gravel, you can but you will need root tabs, laterite and/or other similar products as needed, especially for swords, crypts and other heavy root feeders.
Ok, I hope that gives you a good start. Good luck and don't be afraid to ask more Q's if you have 'em!

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-17-2005, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ringram
DEFINATELY don't add any of those "Ph down/up" additives as they contain phosphates and other things that will cause problems with your water condition --- I got green water from using this and I never used it again.
If you must adjust pH, use Seachem's Acid/Alkaline Buffers (NOT Regulators! Neutral, Acid, and Alkaline Regulators contain phosphates!). The Buffers are designed for planted tanks, and contain no phosphates.

As for everything else, I totally agree with the previous posters. I don't use salt in my tank because I read that cories dislike it. The Black Water stuff, I've never used, and have kept tetras quite successfully. I don't know what ProTech Coat is, but if it neutralizes chlorine/chloramine, then get it. If it doesn't, I recommend AmQuel Plus. I've never used Kent fertilizers, so I can't say anything about them.

Good luck with your plants!

Nolan


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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 02:04 AM Thread Starter
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Wow, it is funny how many different products are out there. It is easy to get confused on what you need if youre just starting. I took a trip to my lfs and they had an entire wall of stuff they recommended. I kind of stopped listen after the 7th bottle he picked up and said "and this will be a great product for you as well". I am a little afraid about mixing and dosing. Here is a little more information about my tank.
36 gallon hex, 4" bed of Flourite, Eheim 2026 canister with Eheim mech and substrate pro, 96watts 6700K (2.6wpg), and a huge Malaysian driftwood centerpiece. I am trying to get some picture on the web soon.
Full of water and just started cycling. Not a big deal if I need to stop the cycle b/c I am in no hurry, I want to make sure I am doing it right. But it is very hard to resist new tank envy. Gosh I want to go get something and put in there . I am still having a problems with a gray/brown tent to my water from the Flourite. I was hoping the filter would clear it up. But it might take one more drain and refill for it to look better. I looked into gregwatson.com. Very cool website, the PMDD-pre mix sounds good. But is that all I need ? No kind of stress coat trace elements or freshwater salt?
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 09:44 AM
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This is what you should buy:
Plantex CSM+B 1lb. Price: $8.59
KN03 Potassium Nitrate 1lb. Price: $2.17
KH2P04 Mono Potassium Phosphate 1lb. Price: $3.42
K2S04 Potassium Sulfate 1lb. Price: $2.17
Iron Chelate Price: $8.59
http://www.gregwatson.com/products.asp?cat=8

PMDD is ok for smaller 5gal maybe 10gal tank's, if you need to dose a certain ingredient because of an abundance of another, then PMDD does not allow you to do this!
Dosing individual fert's allow's for better control over what one is dosing.

PMDD contain's 1 part Potassium Nitrate, 1 part Potassium Sulfate, 1 part Magnesium Sulfate, 1 part Plantex CSM+B.

There is no Potassium Phoshate in PMDD which is much needed, these ingredient's are much better dosed on an individual basis for much better control.

Quote:
No kind of stress coat trace elements or freshwater salt?
No need.

Fill the tank up with plants and get these fert's... then we will see you again once you have that in order

Craig

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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 02:27 PM
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Plant heavy with fast growers, You will probably not keep most of the plants in this stage but it is essential in cycleing a new tank and will help prevent algae. I have always used: Wysteria, anarcharis, hygro d., and cambomba. There are a lot more fast growers out there to help break in a new tank.

They will use up excess neutriants and help out compeat algae for a nice start. No need to add fish for a week or two once ammonia levels are leveled off at 0. Then add some fish, not too many. I like to leave the fast growers in there for about 4weeks, then start adding other plants once I see a good ballance in the tank. It would be sad to see you spend a lot of money on nice plants and then have to pull them up becasue they are coated in BBA/String/Staghorn.




If someone has the link to rex greg's website for starting up a new planted tank plz post, I can't seem to find it in my bookmarks anymore.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dissident
If someone has the link to rex greg's website for starting up a new planted tank plz post
Link


Eheim Pimp #121

80 litre "Planted" tank
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WfxXx
This is what you should buy:
Plantex CSM+B 1lb. Price: $8.59
KN03 Potassium Nitrate 1lb. Price: $2.17
KH2P04 Mono Potassium Phosphate 1lb. Price: $3.42
K2S04 Potassium Sulfate 1lb. Price: $2.17
Iron Chelate Price: $8.59
http://www.gregwatson.com/products.asp?cat=8

PMDD is ok for smaller 5gal maybe 10gal tank's, if you need to dose a certain ingredient because of an abundance of another, then PMDD does not allow you to do this!
Dosing individual fert's allow's for better control over what one is dosing.

PMDD contain's 1 part Potassium Nitrate, 1 part Potassium Sulfate, 1 part Magnesium Sulfate, 1 part Plantex CSM+B.

There is no Potassium Phoshate in PMDD which is much needed, these ingredient's are much better dosed on an individual basis for much better control.


No need.

Fill the tank up with plants and get these fert's... then we will see you again once you have that in order

I disagree Wolf. I think that Syndicate should start off with a few flourish products to get the hang of ferts and dosing before going big time. I am new to the hobby, (nov 04) and have yet to buy fro Greg as I think that you need a bit of time to get a feel for what each fert does, and what signs of defiencies are. It really takes a month or 2 for a tank to start booming anyway. Plus, I do not think that we know the size tank here. Using the flourish line on 20 gallons or less really is not that expensive.

Syndicate: Here is my advise. I random order

1. Read, read, read. Read everything that you can on this forum, and check out some of its memeber's personal sites.

2 Don;t be a cheap skate. Don't skimp. Buy quality substrate. Get some nice lighting.

3. Dont get Jiggy. This means start simple and do not try to over compliate things before you are ready. Don't try to jump into compressed c02 unless you have a huge tank. 2 diy 2 liter bottles as doing fine on my 55gallon.

4. Don't be affraid to make mistakes. You are going to make them anyway. Plants will die, so will fish, shrimp will go missing.

5. Plant heavy. get lots of plants and shove them into your tank. Start with lot of stem plants like Anacharis to help suck up nutirents and keep algea at bay, Remember you are going to have a lot of light and algea will come for you if you are not prepared (hell, it will come for you anyway, but not as bad)

6. Don't get crazy with the fish. Keep it simple. Have a light bio-load. Don't try to keep hard to keep fish with plants, (yet). Do not have fish that are not proven to be plant friendly. Do not have fish that are going to make taking care of you tank harder than it already is.

7. Tinker. Invent creative solutions to small problems. Not all your answers are in the local fish store.

8. Patience: Let you plants grow. Do not move them everyday. Let the roots get established.

I'm out.
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 04:37 PM
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I agree with Wolf. Use Greg Watson products. Ask for some help from Wolf for a dosing regimen. He knows his stuff. As far as dosing with Watson products, it isn't all that complicated. Buying the commercial stuff is just going to use up your funds faster.

Thats just another opinion...take it as you will
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-18-2005, 04:40 PM
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That's cool Creedog, it's ok to disagree

For the record.


Quote:
Originally Posted by syndicate
Here is a little more information about my tank.
36 gallon hex, 4" bed of Flourite, Eheim 2026 canister with Eheim mech and substrate pro, 96watts 6700K (2.6wpg), and a huge Malaysian driftwood centerpiece.

Craig

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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-19-2005, 12:32 AM
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To be honest I found the Greg Watson dry ferts using the Barr method works great for me. Simple and you still have control to add more of a particular nutrient if it is needed. Chuck's calculator is a vital tool to determine proper dosing. A good digital scale can run you about $9 to $30 (i think i paid $12 for mine), it is much better then using fractions of a tbl spoon.

If you do plan on adding ferts CO2 will be a must unless you like algae. You have good enough lighting to go high-tech planted, but if you don't want to add CO2 you can still go low-tech on the tank. But with what you have started I would stay the route and go all the way.

For info on low-tech tanks:
http://aquabotanicwetthumb.infopop.c...m/f/4686048124
It is moderated by Diana Walstad who is extremely knowledgeable about the subject.

Most of the tanks you see on sites are high-tech, AGA tanks are going to be high-tech. It would be nice to see a category for low-tech, but thats another topic.

Stick with it, you will learn a lot and I personally find the hobby extremely rewarding, I am starting my 4th tank now (much to the wife's dismay) in 3yrs.
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-21-2005, 04:44 AM Thread Starter
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Btw: I got some pictures online if anyone is intresed. They are in a post about another proplem I am having oy -- but it will give you an idea of my setup. I like it and hope I can get everything working. Thanks for all the help

https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...8&page=2&pp=15
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