CO2 Indicator - Some Quick Questions :) - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-13-2011, 11:14 PM Thread Starter
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Question CO2 Indicator - Some Quick Questions :)

Greetings Folks,

I have several basic questions about the Azoo CO2 Indicator:
  1. First, I was wondering whether I really fill it with aquarium water as instructed... or should I used distilled or pure water.
  2. Second, I assume when they say fill to rim of cap that they really mean to the rim of the fosted glass on the bottom of the inverted cap?
  3. Third, I am not sure where though I thought I remembered hearing that CO2 Indicators give accurate readings only when is within a certain range (i.e., if too high or low, the reading are skewed one way or the other and, therefore, inaccurate).
Thank-you, in advance, for your assistance,

~Tyger (Michael)~


~TYGER~

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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 03:55 AM
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You can't use tank water or tap water and get any result other than the pH of the tank water. If you use 4 dKH distilled water - distilled water with a tiny amount of bicarbonate of soda in it to raise the KH to 4 degrees - the color does indicate approximately how much CO2 is in the water. Green means something between about 20 and 40 ppm.

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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 11:19 AM Thread Starter
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Talking

Hoppy,

Thank-you, I really appreciate your confirming my concerns about tank and tap water and for your and for your advice. I guess I will get a small bottle of distilled water, adjust it to KH of 4, and just keep the bottle around to use for refills on it.

~Tyger (Michael)~

PS: I just wanted to take a moment to say an extra thank-you for the sage advice and research which you share so openly with everyone. We are fortunate to benefit from you knowledge and your kindness in sharing it with others. Thank-you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoppy View Post
You can't use tank water or tap water and get any result other than the pH of the tank water. If you use 4 dKH distilled water - distilled water with a tiny amount of bicarbonate of soda in it to raise the KH to 4 degrees - the color does indicate approximately how much CO2 is in the water. Green means something between about 20 and 40 ppm.

~TYGER~

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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 11:50 AM
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Might be easier and more accurate if you just buy some 4 dKH solution.

Steve


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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 01:34 PM Thread Starter
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Question

Steve,

I seem to be having a little trouble finding a source from which to purchase 4 dKH Solution. Suggestions?

~Tyger (Michael)~

Quote:
Originally Posted by audioaficionado View Post
Might be easier and more accurate if you just buy some 4 dKH solution.

~TYGER~

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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 01:40 PM
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Check SnS forum - I got my drop checker & 4dKH solution from AquariLiam.
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 01:50 PM
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i think there is a member in SNS selling 4dkh. aquarliam ( mordalphus) sells it, although im not sure if he sells it without a drop checker. i do know he sells drop checkers without the 4dkh.


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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyger View Post
Steve,

I seem to be having a little trouble finding a source from which to purchase 4 dKH Solution. Suggestions?

~Tyger (Michael)~
make it yourself: http://www.aquariumslife.com/aquasca...2/drop-checke/

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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-14-2011, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyger View Post
Steve,

I seem to be having a little trouble finding a source from which to purchase 4 dKH Solution. Suggestions?

~Tyger (Michael)~
http://www.sumoregulator.com/DropCheckerSolutions.html

DIY http://dropcheck.petalphile.com/

Steve


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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-15-2011, 04:24 PM Thread Starter
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Exclamation CO2 Drop Checker Stock Solution (Home Brewed)

Greetings Folks,



Well, I think that one of the advantages to doing things yourself is that you end-up learning a lot. So, I went to Target and purchased Distilled Water (1 gallon) and A&H Baking Soda (NaHCO3-) and went to town. In the course of this project, I discovered that there is a lot of inaccurate information on the matter. Fortunately, I came-up on the low side... so I was able to continue to add small measured amounts of stock solution to the reference solution to obtain an approximate Reference Solution (≈4 dKH). Of course, I was left to wonder what went wrong. So, I made an effort to better understand things and here is what I found:
  • First, Baking Soda (NaHCO3-) is reactive with atmospheric moisture and the manufacturing process for consumer grade is not exacting and the soda contains imperfections.
  • Second, Baking Soda (NaHCO3-) can be heated though this alters the chemical composition as some part of the sodium bicarbonate would change into into sodium carbonate (changing the weights).
  • Third, CO3 is 71.44% of the mass in NaHCO3-
  • Fourth, in absence of precise lab grade measures and scales, one should use a digital scale accurate to at least two decimal places.
  • Fifth, KH Test Kits available to the consumer are not lab quality, which means the readings are not 100% spot-on. If the test kit works with 5ml (such as API), 10 ml allows KH to be measured in increments of 0.5 dKH rather than 1 dKH.
  • Sixth, unless one has access to the appropriate laboratory and equipment, Drop Check CO2 Reference Solutions are going to be approximations no matter what... which means, while we should seek to reduce factors contributing to error in every reasonable manner, the result is merely a close approximation.
  • [Edit] Seventh, as suggested herein, "... never trust the vendor when it comes to making water for you."
With that said, I wanted to run my formula for my future home brews by the resident experts for a peer review of sorts:
  • Drop Checker Stock Solution (≈40 dKH):
    • Material & Ingredients
      • Distilled Water (1 Gallon) [purchased at Target]
      • Arm & Hammer Baking Soda [purchased at Target]
      • Digital Scale (MH-200 Professional Digital Pocket Scale)
      • Graduated Cycler or Measuring Cup (500 ml with 100 ml increments)
      • 2-3 Bottles [1 liter]
    • Prepare Equipment & Place:
      • Clean Equipment: use a bit of the Distilled Water to risen the bottles, graduated cyclinders, etc.,.
    • Cautionary Note:
      • Baking Soda (NaHCO3-) use a new box to minimize time of exposure to atmosphere (moisture), but do not heat.
    • Mixing Stock Solution (Bottle #1)
      • Bottle #1 (1-liter/1000 ml): Fill bottle with 1000 mls of distilled water.
      • Baking Soda (NaHCO3-): measure 1.00 gram of baking soda using appropriate digital scale.
      • Add 1.00 gram of Baking Soda to the liter of distilled water in Bottle #1.
      • Stock Solution (39.940 dKH or 713.335 ppm): mixture yields 1-liter of stock solution (Additional Note: CO3, remember, makes-up 71.44% of mass weight in Baking Soda (NaHCO3-) [cf., CNYKOI input 0.265 gallons and 1.000 grams]).
  • Drop Checker Reference Solution (≈4 dKH):
    • Mixing Drop Checker Reference Solution (≈4 dKH)
      • Bottle #1 (1-liter/1000 ml): fill bottle with 900 mls of distilled water.
      • Add 100 ml of Stock Solution in Bottle #1 to Bottle #2
      • CO2 Drop Checker Reference Solution (3.994 dKH or 71.334 ppm): mixture yields 1-liter of reference solution which is pretty close to 4 dKH for home brew.
    • Option #1 (2 Reference Solution & 0 Stock Solution)
      • Graduated Cyclinder/Measuring Cup: fill with 100 ml of Stock Solution from Bottle #1.
      • Bottle #1 - empty the bottle, risen throughly with tap water, then risen with distilled water (remember to leave at least 1-liter distilled water in gallon jub).
      • Bottle #1 (1-liter) fill with 100 ml of stock solution that was poured into cup.
      • Add 900 ml of distilled water to Bottle #1
      • CO2 Drop Checker Reference Solution (3.994 dKH or 71.334 ppm): mixture, again yields 1-liter of CO2 Drop-Check Solution (3.994 dKH or 71.334 ppm) which is pretty close for home brew.
    • Option #2 (3 Bottles: 1 Stock & 2 Reference Solutions)
      • 1 Gallon contains 3.79 liters. If you clean and risen efficiently though not sparingly, you have 3-liters with which to work.
      • Consequently, if you have 3 1-liter bottles, you can make 2 1-liter bottles of reference solution (4 dKH) and keep a 1-liter bottle of stock solution (40 dKH) which should have enough stock solution left after making 2 1-liter bottles for an additional 8-liter bottles in the future.
    • Option #3 (2 Bottles: 1 1-liter stock & 1 2-liter reference)
      • Although I have limited cabinet space and prefer to smaller bottles, CO2 Drop Check Reference Solution can be mixed in a 2-liter bottle, in which case the numbers must be doubled (i.e., fill with 1800 ml of distilled water, add 200 ml of stock solution, and get 2-liters of CO2 Reference Solution (3.994 dKH or 71.334 ppm).
Well, I think that works out right... comments, corrections, and thoughts?

~Tyger (Michael)~

~TYGER~

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Last edited by Tyger; 05-15-2011 at 11:41 PM.
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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-15-2011, 08:43 PM
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Wow! I like your initiative Michael.

Steve


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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 05-15-2011, 09:12 PM
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There is a "7th", which is "never trust the vendor when it comes to making water for you"

One of the easiest ways to check is with a conductivity meter.
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