remineralise ro water is 0 kh ok with aquasoil? - Page 2 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #16 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 04:47 PM
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Here is some diy water stuff for you.

Diy Remineralizers
I use these for my non shrimp planted tanks as this is way cheaper than salty shrimp and works perfectly.


diy kh booster
1.12 grams baking soda
10 gallon tank by 1dkh
1tsp =4.5 grams
1 tsp raises 10G by 4.5 dkh

diy gh booster
This maintains the golden 3/1 mag/calcium ratio.
CaCl 6 grams
MgSo4 7 grams
1 gram of this mix raises gh of 10G water by 1dGH.


You will Need need a 0 to 200 g scale.
You can get Calcium chloride from marine aquarium stores
Magnesium sulfate (plain unscented epsom salts) from any pharmacy.
I bought a cheap coffee mill for grinding it up fine to dissolve easy for 10$.

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post #17 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 05:21 PM
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0kh plus co2 is bad news. IF soil is going to eat your buffer down to zero you need more kh.
I think that has been disproven at this point, with all the gorgeous tanks high tech using soils. @Greggz rainbow tank is getting better results with soil than when he was running some KH. His tank journal is really informative about switching over, and the plants are downright ridiculous.
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post #18 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 07:19 PM
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I think that has been disproven at this point, with all the gorgeous tanks high tech using soils. @Greggz rainbow tank is getting better results with soil than when he was running some KH. His tank journal is really informative about switching over, and the plants are downright ridiculous.
Yep problems with zero KH is pretty much an old wives tale at this point. As are pH crashes.

Excellent article about it here on Dennis Wong's site..........................https://www.2hraquarist.com/blogs/ph...jYIniT27bZ5CQg
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post #19 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 07:22 PM
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I use RO/DI because I bought my unit when I was into reef tanks. I've never heard not to use DI and am very curious as to any reason in the world they might have. I could see it being problematic if people were using it straight, but after remineralizing, I can't fathom there being much difference between two samples. But if there is science (or even compelling anecdotal evidence) I'd be happy to see if I could bypass my DI part of the unit. Just fewer cartridges to buy.
Using DI for planted aquariums is unnecessary. Organic impurities are removed by RO carbon pre-filter and minerals are 90 – 95% removed by the RO membrane. The remaining 5 – 10% of minerals is insignificant. However, when DI is used then these remaining minerals are exchanged with acids and bases, buffering each other to 7 pH when the DI cartridge is in perfect condition. But when it is not then it can shift pH to either side and that is not good at almost zero KH.

Aside from that, I’ve been promoting growing plants in zero KH water since year 2000. It wasn’t easy to accept for most because people were horrified and scared of “pH crash”. Today, after 20 years of explaining it, it slowly gains in popularity.
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post #20 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 08:20 PM
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Using DI for planted aquariums is unnecessary. Organic impurities are removed by RO carbon pre-filter and minerals are 90 – 95% removed by the RO membrane. The remaining 5 – 10% of minerals is insignificant.
I realize it's not necessary, my curiosity is more to know if there's any evidence of it making in any way inferior water to plain RO (for our purposes).
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However, when DI is used then these remaining minerals are exchanged with acids and bases, buffering each other to 7 pH when the DI cartridge is in perfect condition. But when it is not then it can shift pH to either side and that is not good at almost zero KH.
Even after remineralizing? Just trying to wrap my head around this.

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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 09:25 PM
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I realize it's not necessary, my curiosity is more to know if there's any evidence of it making in any way inferior water to plain RO (for our purposes).
High quality ion exchangers have separate containers for cation and anion resins. DI that comes with usual RO unit has them mixed into one container. This mix doesn’t guarantee high purity product like for laboratory use. However, when we talk planted aquariums then the impact is negligible when there is some kind of pH buffering such as substrate or added KH. But with inert substrate and low KH one might start wondering what is going on.

Carbon added to aquarium filters perform well at the beginning but later start releasing captured impurities back to water. Similar to DI, they perform well at the beginning but later can start swinging pH. And because DI is mostly not needed for planted aquarium then why bother using it at all. Though there might be some critical applications like high copper, lead or arsenic well water, then yes, DI is worth it.
Quote:
Even after remineralizing? Just trying to wrap my head around this.
It’s a matter of pH so if remineralization includes KH addition then the DI issue has negligible effect.


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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 09:38 PM
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In my case, it's aqua soil tanks and remineralizing with GH only (for Caridina shrimp). There is one variant in particular I'm having poor luck with and if this could even possibly be contributing, I'm all about bypassing the DI cartridge.

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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-14-2020, 10:00 PM
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I should add that DI have two resins, cation and anion. When cation is exhausted first then water just passes through. But when anion is exhausted first then small amount of acid is produced. When both are exhausted then it has no effect on water parameters. So in essence, partly exhausted DI can slightly acidify water.
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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 01:01 AM
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Aside from that, I’ve been promoting growing plants in zero KH water since year 2000. It wasn’t easy to accept for most because people were horrified and scared of “pH crash”. Today, after 20 years of explaining it, it slowly gains in popularity.
Sorry but the reason there are more aquarists running zero KH is because of the popularity of aquasoils started mainly by ADA.
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 01:22 AM
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Sorry but the reason there are more aquarists running zero KH is because of the popularity of aquasoils started mainly by ADA.
LOL yeah you know who had 0.00% influence when it comes to going to soil.

For me, it was seeing Burr set up some tanks with it. I tend to give credence to those who demonstrate success.
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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 01:59 AM
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LOL yeah you know who had 0.00% influence when it comes to going to soil.

For me, it was seeing Burr set up some tanks with it. I tend to give credence to those who demonstrate success.
Yep, generally something you can "touch or feel" or at least See has the greatest impact. There are thousands of tanks now with active granular soils that you can follow online and one can see what can be accomplished.
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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 05:41 PM
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Yep problems with zero KH is pretty much an old wives tale at this point. As are pH crashes.

Excellent article about it here on Dennis Wong's site..........................https://www.2hraquarist.com/blogs/ph...jYIniT27bZ5CQg
Respectfully Greggs Ph Crashes are not old wives tales. I've seen it and at one point lost a lot of $$ worth of livestock. Obviously aqua soil have some magic going on...

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
I think that has been disproven at this point, with all the gorgeous tanks high tech using soils. @Greggz rainbow tank is getting better results with soil than when he was running some KH. His tank journal is really informative about switching over, and the plants are downright ridiculous.
Disproven ??? Chemistry is chemistry . If you add an acid to water with no KH ph drops period , there is no way to argue that. Aquasoil may do some strange things , I don't use it. There has to be trapped KH in the soil so it is not measurable in the water column. However PH crashes are real and can be caused by digging up anoxic pockets in substrate , dead fish , too much feeding etc. Unless aqua soil can fix all that..

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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 06:25 PM
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I'm happy I stumbled on this thread.
I have one tank (out of three) that always has me nervous as kh is always less than 1, but the fish are doing better in this tank than any of my others.
I used RO water and equilibrium brought up to 6gh with ecocomplete substrate with a ph that's around 6.6-6.8.
I've been nervous about the reported "ph crashes" but the success of the bolivian rams, wild caught neon tetras and otocinclus have prevented me from changing any of my routine up.

My other two tanks must have substrate that's leaching something in the water as my ph on both of those tanks is 7.6-7.9 with a kh of 4+. My fish don't thrive nearly as well as those tanks and the plants do about the same in all of the tanks. It had been puzzling me with a slight bit of worry about the PH crashes, but after reading this I'm going to redo my other two tanks so that I can get more similar parameters across them all.

A buffering substrate like aquasoil is interesting, but it sounds like you would need to replace the substrate every so often (every 1-2 years) if you notice your PH starting to raise and that doesn't sound fun to me.
I'm pretty new to this stuff (only one year in) so am happy to read any corrections to my assumptions.


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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 06:34 PM
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Disproven ??? Chemistry is chemistry . If you add an acid to water with no KH ph drops period , there is no way to argue that. Aquasoil may do some strange things , I don't use it. There has to be trapped KH in the soil so it is not measurable in the water column. However PH crashes are real and can be caused by digging up anoxic pockets in substrate , dead fish , too much feeding etc. Unless aqua soil can fix all that..
If you have anoxic pockets in substrate, dead fish, too much feeding then you have other problems. It's not the low KH, it's everything else. Talking about two entirely different things there.
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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 11-15-2020, 09:51 PM
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If you have anoxic pockets in substrate, dead fish, too much feeding then you have other problems. It's not the low KH, it's everything else. Talking about two entirely different things there.
Kinda reminds me of many things in the hobby where a certain measurement or level is not the problem. The real problem is what got it there. If no active soil then more likely a water quality issue that lowered PH and released toxins. Similar to NO3, where it's not the level but how it got there.

To me there, are too many well kept tanks with extremely low PH/no kh that are healthy long-term for fish/plants.
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Last edited by Asteroid; 11-15-2020 at 09:57 PM. Reason: .
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