Deficiency Althernanthera Reineckii mini - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2020, 03:15 PM Thread Starter
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Hello everybody,

I have been visiting this website for quite some time already. Reading all I possibly can.

After struggeling for many years, going through all possible algae outbreaks, I feel like I am finally on the right track.

Let me start by supplying you guys with all the neccesary tank parameters.

Volume: 60 liters 60x30x36cm

Substrate: 2 years old ADA Amazonia, 3, 4 cm thick

Filtration: Eheim pro 4 250t, Eheim skim 350

Media: 2 liter Eheim substrat pro, purigen, filterpads

Lighting: GHL Mitras lightbar 2, 8 hours a day with ramp up ramp down, 90-110 par at substrate.

CO2: Pressurized

Temp: 24C
pH: 6.60 (when lights on) 7.90 (24 hr degassed)
KH: 8
NO3: 15 ppm weekly
PO4: 1 ppm weekly
Mg: 10 ppm weekly
Micro: 2 ml Tropica specialised a day

I add the macro's a few hours before the lights turn on. 1/7 part of the weekly ppm a day.
I add the micro's right before the lights turn on, so pH is low.

I do a 50 percent waterchange every sunday with straight tapwater matching the temperature of the tank. Parameters of tap are as followed:

Calcium: 41 mg/l
HCO3: 178 mg/l
Mg: 9 mg/l
NO3: 4.96 mg/l
Sulfate: 44 mg/l
pH: 8.1
dGH: 7.72

I hope you guys can give me some advice on how to improve general plant health.

Also the pogostemon helferi is not growing well. Sometimes growing allright. Sometimes the leaves are turning translucent.

Thanks!
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2020, 04:56 PM
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I would suggest to increase your PO4 to 3mg/l a week. All your other parameters look fine.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2020, 06:38 PM
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How much K do you add weekly, and whats your estimated par at substrate?
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2020, 06:53 PM
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How much K do you add weekly, and whats your estimated par at substrate?
Quote:
Originally Posted by diederik_creutzburg View Post
Hello everybody,

I have been visiting this website for quite some time already. Reading all I possibly can.

After struggeling for many years, going through all possible algae outbreaks, I feel like I am finally on the right track.

Let me start by supplying you guys with all the neccesary tank parameters.

Volume: 60 liters 60x30x36cm

Substrate: 2 years old ADA Amazonia, 3, 4 cm thick

Filtration: Eheim pro 4 250t, Eheim skim 350

Media: 2 liter Eheim substrat pro, purigen, filterpads

Lighting: GHL Mitras lightbar 2, 8 hours a day with ramp up ramp down, 90-110 par at substrate.

CO2: Pressurized

Temp: 24C
pH: 6.60 (when lights on) 7.90 (24 hr degassed)
KH: 8
NO3: 15 ppm weekly
PO4: 1 ppm weekly
Mg: 10 ppm weekly
Micro: 2 ml Tropica specialised a day

I add the macro's a few hours before the lights turn on. 1/7 part of the weekly ppm a day.
I add the micro's right before the lights turn on, so pH is low.

I do a 50 percent waterchange every sunday with straight tapwater matching the temperature of the tank. Parameters of tap are as followed:

Calcium: 41 mg/l
HCO3: 178 mg/l
Mg: 9 mg/l
NO3: 4.96 mg/l
Sulfate: 44 mg/l
pH: 8.1
dGH: 7.72

I hope you guys can give me some advice on how to improve general plant health.

Also the pogostemon helferi is not growing well. Sometimes growing allright. Sometimes the leaves are turning translucent.

Thanks!
PAR is in red

I would assume the only potassium is from the N and P dosing so 9.86mg/l. With tap water and the high calcium and sulfate there is bound to be some K in there as well.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2020, 07:37 PM
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Bump PO4 up to 3-5ppm per week, and bump K up to 15-17ppm per week.

Might be worth adding an extra 5ppm of Mg, and using some DTPA 11% Iron at your given pH.

Higher kH is likely not playing in your favor...

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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-28-2020, 10:48 PM Thread Starter
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Par is 90-110 at substrate level. Measured with a Seneye reef par meter. Seems accurate enough from what I have seen in reviews.

I don't add any extra K. The potassium is indeed only from dosing N and P. So I should start dosing 5-7 ppm extra coming from KSO4?

I will up the PO4 and Mg.

I have a bottle of Seachem Flourish Iron. I read this is ferrousgluconate and isn't affected that much by pH. It only needs to be added daily. I can do that, but how much should I add? I realize this can get expensive fast, but since I have quite a small aquarium I am willing to go this route. Ferrousgluconate in powder form isn't easy to come by here in the Netherlands.

As for my high KH, I can buy a RO/DI filter and use half tap half RO/DI water. Don't know if this will make a big enough difference, since there is quite some extra work involved.

I was also wondering about the amount of CO2 I have to add for a pH drop of 1.3. I add around 4 bps, seems quite a lot for a 60 liter aquarium. Maybe this has something to do with the high KH. I have a CO2 regulator and inline diffuser from CO2Art. Output is a spraybar on the back of the tank. It is pointed down quite a bit, flow is bouncing of the front glass going down, over the substrate to the back and then comes back up.

I have been struggeling with adding CO2 for a long time. Never seemed to be enough. Was a victim of the dropchecker is green tunnelvision for a long time. Until recently the new growth isn't getting affected by BBA. The pH drop of 1.3 is probably doing the trick. Fish seem to be fine, although I have never pushed it that high for them to start showing signs of distress. I measure pH with a Hanna Checker plus, which I calibrate with 4.01 and 7.01 buffer at least a few times a month.

Also greatly reducing light intensity has made a big difference. I kept reducing intensity and duration, but nothing seemed to help. I was running the lights at around 70 percent intensity and only a total of 5 hours a day, when I first measured the par output. It turned out I was still blasting the substrate with 250 par.

I know you guys always say when people are having algae issues, reduce lights and up the CO2. I just never figured out I had to reduce it by that much. I think I run the lights at around 30 percent intensity for 5 hours plus some ramp up ramp down. For evening viewing time I use only the RGB leds, a bit heavy on the red side, at such a low intensity it gives a par reading of 0. Amazing how the colors, although not that great yet, can pop.
At full intensity the lightbar reads 350 par at substrate. Crazy how overpowered some led units are.

Anyway, I will post a few pictures in a few weeks when plant health is hopefully improving.

Thanks for all the feedback and suggestions!
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-28-2020, 11:29 PM
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Be interesting to see if anyone else is growing the ar mini here at kh 8. That could be an issue as mentioned by @Quagulator With par around 100 I'm surprised your hygro pinn is not more red.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 02:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asteroid View Post
Be interesting to see if anyone else is growing the ar mini here at kh 8. That could be an issue as mentioned by @Quagulator With par around 100 I'm surprised your hygro pinn is not more red.
My tap water is around kh 8 and I have some AR mini heading my way.


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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 09:33 AM Thread Starter
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Maybe the Hygrophila Pinn. is still adjusting to the improved CO2 levels. I attached a photo from this morning. I think it showes the new growth getting better colouration.

I will try to keep parameters stable for the coming weeks to see if that improves the growth of the AR mini. If it indeed proves to be difficult to grow AR mini nice in a KH of 8, I may have to say goodbye. In the past I tried to grow all kinds of difficult stem plants. They never looked good and only caused headaches.

I will keep you guys updated!
Thanks!
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 04-29-2020, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
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My tap water is around kh 8 and I have some AR mini heading my way.
Cool, you could be our test tank.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by diederik_creutzburg View Post
Maybe the Hygrophila Pinn. is still adjusting to the improved CO2 levels. I attached a photo from this morning. I think it showes the new growth getting better colouration.
Thanks!
That could be. BTW Why is the hygro planted right on top of the AR Mini?


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