Going back to the gas can, C02 questions - Page 2 - The Planted Tank Forum
 47Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-05-2020, 10:42 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
minorhero's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,247
Ugh sorry to hear that! It seems co2 is the number one killer of fish/shrimp.
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
minorhero is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-05-2020, 10:43 PM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Wow I am really sorry to hear that. I hope I did not contribute with my observations on my own tank.
All fault lies with me, I absolutely don't mean to imply that. I was too enthusiastic and thought that with 18 hours of run time I would be safe. Had I just used the controller (which I already have on hand) or even tested pH that morning, I wouldn't have this story to tell.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
How much was the pH drop? A 1.0 drop should not have that effect, and in my own tank I go to a 1.4 drop with no discomfort.
I tested as soon as I saw dead fish and it was off the API chart acid. Didn't even grab my pH pen, I think part of me didn't want to see precisely how badly I'd screwed up. Kicking myself for not testing yesterday morning. Lights weren't on yet but no fish gasping and I saw a living shrimp in the other tank so went on with my business. That's the part that has me kicking myself -I made a conscious decision to forego testing it and that would have taken about a minute out of my day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Do you have good surface agitation?
Not in the slightest on one tank, the other had a HOB dumping water in which is probably the only reason guppy fry survived.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
You have plenty of O2?
Same answer as above. And once the surface film started, it had to have gotten worse. Curious as to what you use that doesn't degas your tank.
Greggz likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-05-2020, 11:02 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Greggz's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Novi, MI
Posts: 4,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
I tested as soon as I saw dead fish and it was off the API chart acid. Didn't even grab my pH pen, I think part of me didn't want to see precisely how badly I'd screwed up.
I know this was not meant to be funny but that part made me laugh.....only because I have been there before!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
Curious as to what you use that doesn't degas your tank.
I don't worry about off gassing at all. O2 and CO2 are not mutually exclusive, so my goal is to have plenty of each.

I have spray bars aimed up at surface creating good surface ripple at all times. High O2 is appreciated by the fish and the tank in general. When CO2 turns off, air stones come on to create vigorous surface agitation to degas and create extra flow for a few hours. Also keeps surface clean of surface film.

I look at it this way. Relative to everything else in this hobby CO2 is cheap. My 10lb tank on my 120G lasts about 18 weeks and is $15.00 to refill. Not much in the scheme of things.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Greggz is online now  
 
post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 01:21 AM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
Thanks for that info! I'll get these dialed in this week. How do you have your air pump set up so that it alternates with the CO2 solenoid?
Greggz likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 01:53 AM
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
EdWiser's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Louisville,Kentucky
Posts: 324
I would put the air pump on a timer. Set Opposite of the timer for the Co2 solenoid.
The Kasa power strip works great for this.

Kasa Smart WiFi Power Strip by TP-Link - 6 Outlet Surge Protection, Works with Alexa Echo & Google (HS300), White, 1-Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G95FFN3..._ue3oEbWG17DFW

They also make single outlets. But cheap to get the strip

I spend a whole week slowly turning the needle valve. Learned the hard way too.
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.
EdWiser is online now  
post #21 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 02:17 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Greggz's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Novi, MI
Posts: 4,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
Thanks for that info! I'll get these dialed in this week. How do you have your air pump set up so that it alternates with the CO2 solenoid?
I don't have it set it to alternate with CO2 solenoid....but I could. My American Pinpoint has switched outlets for both high and low pH levels. During the day it's just the constant surface agitation from the spray bars creating O2.

Like above, I use a Kasa smart strip to control the air pump. When lights go off, heavy aeration from air stones comes on for two hours. Does two things. Degasses tank so the bows are very comfortable at night, and creates an extra level of flow that rolls down the front glass then across the substrate that moves detritus to the back of the tank.
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Greggz is online now  
post #22 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 05:00 AM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
Just so I'm clear, your solenoid is on a controller which is on a timer as well? Or does the controller get bypassed and run 24/7?

My goal for these two tanks is not to have my hands in something weekly, and maybe pushing the CO2 envelope is foolish of me to begin with. But I'm inspired by the tanks I see on here and realize I haven't been touching on their potential. I've seen what people have done with basically the same plants and equipment I have. I've followed tank journals showing what can happen (and how quickly) in these aquariums where almost nothing is deficient. And I can't wait to try a toned down version. Having said that, I'm ready to take multiple safeguards after this.

I've never felt older than when I just googled "What is a smart plug."
Greggz likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #23 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 01:47 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Greggz's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Novi, MI
Posts: 4,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
Just so I'm clear, your solenoid is on a controller which is on a timer as well? Or does the controller get bypassed and run 24/7?
Yes, the controller is on a timer. Comes on 1.5 hours before lights, turns off 1 hour before lights off.

The timer is a Kasa Smart Strip. You program it via your phone.

It controls everything, lights, air pump, and controller.
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Greggz is online now  
post #24 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 03:52 PM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
It's on order. And a Whisper 150, which is $8 cheaper at Amazon than through my wholesalers and will come 4 days faster. Crazy times. I don't do Alexa, etc. but will install the phone app. I look forward to getting this all set up and really appreciate you guy's help.
Greggz and Asteroid like this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #25 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 08:01 PM
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Coldstream, BC
Posts: 184
Blueridgereef. I believe you have the Milwaukee mc122? If so it will have two plug ins. One for the controller and one for the switched output of the controller. The switched output plugin is the one that you want on a timed outlet. The main power plug for the controller you want on a non timed outlet. This way your ph will display 24/7. The controller will call for co2 to come on when ph rises but because the timed switched outlet is off it won't actually activate the co2 solenoid.

My Milwaukee controllers 'activated' light flashes all during the lights off but doesn't actually activate the co2 solenoid until two hrs before lights on which is what I've got my smart outlet set for. Then the switched outlet becomes hot and the solenoid on the co2 regulator activates.

Sorry to read of your losses. Tough.
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.

45g fluval bowfront tank, plant 2.0 light, 2 x 206 canister filters, 5lb co2 art pro se
10g quarantine tank

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Squisher is online now  
post #26 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 08:10 PM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
That's the unit I have, will hopefully get it set up in the next couple of days. Lots on my plate this week but will have the controller and Kasa running by Saturday (barring something not working). I'll be sure and check your post when setting it all up, thank you for that explanation. And for the condolences.
Squisher likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #27 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 08:26 PM
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Coldstream, BC
Posts: 184
If you click on my journal you can see how I wired up my smart plug. I used a non smart switchable power bar and one of those outlets(the only one that isn't switchable, constant power) I plugged in a teckin 3way smart plug/timer. same cat, different way of skinning it.

I do like the looks of this six way smart powerbar though. I either couldn't find it when I was researching them or Amazon Canada doesn't carry it? I'm not big into smart this that or the other. But I will say I'm quite pleased with this smart plug technology. I don't use Alexa or any kind of automated home stuff. But just downloaded the smartlife app just for this and found it very intuitive. Makes me feel like George jetson when I change a setting or turn something on or off from my iPad.
Blue Ridge Reef and Greggz like this.

45g fluval bowfront tank, plant 2.0 light, 2 x 206 canister filters, 5lb co2 art pro se
10g quarantine tank

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Squisher is online now  
post #28 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 10:57 PM
Planted Member
 
MD500_Pilot's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 157
Don't mean to jump in on someone else's thread but when you guys talk about a pH controller, does it basically just monitor your pH and start and stop your CO2 as necessary to keep your pH in a specific range?

And if I am reading @Greggz correctly you have your controller on a timer as well? If the job of the controller is to keep your pH within a certain range, why not let the controller run 24x7? Or is the premise that regardless of the pH increase, you do not ever want your CO2 coming on at night?

I assume that this is the same reason you run an airstone for a few hours each night, to get rid of CO2 and raise the pH? What is the benefit in doing so?
Blue Ridge Reef likes this.

75 Gallon Planted Fresh Water Tank
Fluval FX6 & 406 Filters / 2 x Fluval Plant 3.0 LED Lights
CO2Art CO2 Regulator w/DIY Grigg Reactor
Seneye+ Tank Monitoring System / Atlas Scientific Hydroponic Monitoring System
MD500_Pilot is offline  
post #29 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 11:14 PM Thread Starter
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (13/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 2,100
No jumping in at all, I'd love to hear the thinking behind everyone's methods!
Greggz likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is online now  
post #30 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-06-2020, 11:37 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Greggz's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Novi, MI
Posts: 4,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD500_Pilot View Post
Don't mean to jump in on someone else's thread but when you guys talk about a pH controller, does it basically just monitor your pH and start and stop your CO2 as necessary to keep your pH in a specific range?

And if I am reading @Greggz correctly you have your controller on a timer as well? If the job of the controller is to keep your pH within a certain range, why not let the controller run 24x7? Or is the premise that regardless of the pH increase, you do not ever want your CO2 coming on at night?

I assume that this is the same reason you run an airstone for a few hours each night, to get rid of CO2 and raise the pH? What is the benefit in doing so?
Yes a pH controller turns your CO2 solenoid on and off. For instance, with mine my low point is set at pH 5.50. So when the pH drops to 5.50 it turns the CO2 off. When pH rises back to 5.60 it turns CO2 back on. So my pH drifts between those two levels during the CO2 injection period.

You will hear lots of pros and cons of CO2 controllers. Personally I wouldn't be without one. Makes it easy to make accurate small adjustments and less worry about CO2 in general. Dialing in CO2 by counting bubbles or adjusting flow rates is tricky business, and takes a lot of effort to fine tune. If I want to drop pH by an additional 0.05 to see what happens, I just adjust the setting. Couldn't be easier.

And not insignificant is that it acts as a fail safe to protect the fish.

I do not run CO2 overnight, as plants are not using it then. Most folks run their CO2 this way, as plants are only using it during the lighting period.

I run the air stones (strong air pump!) only for a few hours each night. When lights go off I like to degas tank quickly and create lots of O2 for the comfort of the Rainbows. It also creates a lot of flow which moves fish waste/detritus across the substrate to the rear of the tank.

I really don't know if it helps the plants or not, but have always been of the mind that good O2 levels can only be a good thing.
Blue Ridge Reef and Squisher like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
---
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Greggz is online now  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome