Remineralizing RO/DI - Page 2 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #16 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 02:01 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcidGambit View Post
For kH, rotalabutterfly lists ppm in the input box, but it calculates for dKH (and the result will show dKH).
What the heck?! That can result in like a 4x overdose.
Anything else I need to know about Rotala?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Forget that ppm tab. It's there by default for everything. We are measuring for degrees of KH.

Here's the important part.......MY TARGET IS: DKH....enter in 1.0 and that is your dose.

It will be the same as in my example from Zorfox above. dKH 1.0 and CO3 at 10.69ppm.

I hope that makes sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagulator View Post
CaSO4 For Ca / gH - 20-30ppm
MgSO4 for Mg / gH - 5-10ppm
KHCO3 or K2CO3 for kH - 0.5-1.0 degrees.

https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php - punch in your 50 gallons, and set range for each compound and it will tell you how much is needed.
If the numbers above for Ca and Mg work out to a GH of around 7, why would i dose the kH to 1? Shouldn't that be around 4?

-Dennis
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post #17 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 03:23 AM
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I was actually just wondering if there was a different option than Seachem Equilibrium but this thread just confused me even more. I like Seachem's relatively straightforward instructions for GH, KH, and pH.


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post #18 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 03:36 AM
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Originally Posted by d2creative View Post
If the numbers above for Ca and Mg work out to a GH of around 7, why would i dose the kH to 1? Shouldn't that be around 4?
dGH and dKH are completely independent.

You can dose both to any level you desire.

So you can dose dGH to 7 with a combination of Ca/Mg, then dose dKH to any level you like.

My RO water is dosed to dGH of about 7 and dKH of about 1.0.

Not sure where the dosing to 4 dKH comes in???
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post #19 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 03:38 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Not sure where the dosing to 4 dKH comes in???


I thought a planted tank should have levels of kh around 4 and gh around 8. At least as a starting point.
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-Dennis
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post #20 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d2creative View Post
I thought a planted tank should have levels of kh around 4 and gh around 8. At least as a starting point.
Not sure where that figure came from, but in general the softer the water the better for most species.

I used to raise my dKH to 4, then backed it down to 1. The biggest change was better success with soft water loving species like Tonina and Syngo's. But in general it did make everything a bit easier.

But whether at 4 dKH or 1 dKH you can grow almost anything.


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Last edited by Greggz; 10-22-2019 at 01:55 PM. Reason: typo
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post #21 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 03:09 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Not sure where that figure came from, but in general the softer the water the better for most species.

I used to raise my dKH to 4, then backed it down to 1. The biggest change was better success with soft water loving species like Tonina and Syngo's. But in general it did make everything a bit easier.

But whether at 4 dKH or 1 dKH you can grow almost anything.
OK, good to know. That was part of the confusion.

As far as where... pretty much everywhere I searched for things like "best planted tank parameters".

Just one example from this page...
https://www.advancedplantedtank.com/ph-kh-gh-tds.html

Between 2-8 dKH you can keep 97% of all commercial aquatic plants in optimal condition.
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post #22 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by d2creative View Post
Just one example from this page...
https://www.advancedplantedtank.com/ph-kh-gh-tds.html

Between 2-8 dKH you can keep 97% of all commercial aquatic plants in optimal condition.
Yeah that's all true.

But it's more relevant when you considering whether to use source water or go with RO.

When you start with RO, you can set it anywhere you want.

And when you are closer to zero KH that is where you can grow the other 3% well too, the very soft water loving species.

But really anywhere in that 1 to 4 range is pretty darn good for most everything.
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post #23 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 04:18 PM
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@d2creative: The substrate you're using will lower whatever kH you're adding to the water. So I don't think you should focus on or add any kH at all. There may be some critters that won't work for you but I don't think that's a bad thing. A lot will certainly be fine.

@Triport: There are tons of options - not just from Seachem. There are products from companies like SaltyShrimp that have mineral salts for shrimp and fish. And some people, like myself, make their own GH+ mixes that are tailored for dwarf shrimp. Cheap and relatively easy to do with a $10 scale.

.....

I think it's important to keep in mind that there are some species that are sensitive to kH levels, so tanks need to be designed around parameters in those instances. In this particular case, that substrate is gonna drop Dennis' kH to 0 pretty much instantly and lower pH to 6 or less.
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post #24 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Greggz View Post
Yeah that's all true.

But it's more relevant when you considering whether to use source water or go with RO.

When you start with RO, you can set it anywhere you want.

And when you are closer to zero KH that is where you can grow the other 3% well too, the very soft water loving species.

But really anywhere in that 1 to 4 range is pretty darn good for most everything.
Great, thanks for the help! Sorry to be a pain.
I can shoot for around 2-ish giving me leeway in either direction.
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post #25 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 08:14 PM
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Great, thanks for the help! Sorry to be a pain.
I can shoot for around 2-ish giving me leeway in either direction.
You are not being a pain.

I am trying to help so you can get that thing filled and we can see where this going. Looks so far like an epic build!

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@d2creative: The substrate you're using will lower whatever kH you're adding to the water. So I don't think you should focus on or add any kH at all. There may be some critters that won't work for you but I don't think that's a bad thing. A lot will certainly be fine.
Aha good call I didn't realize this was with an active substrate.

If that is the case, I would also do some further research on active substrates. There is a lot to know especially when you get started.

I have no experience with it, but there are many here who do and could be helpful.

And by the way, one more thing. When/if you dose to add KH, pay attention the ppm of K that you are adding. Need to figure that into the fert equation.
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Last edited by Greggz; 10-22-2019 at 08:27 PM. Reason: Addition
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post #26 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 08:18 PM
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Your substrate will make that 0. You've got quite a bit of it, so it's going to buffer for quite some time. Probably a couple years at minimum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d2creative View Post
I can shoot for around 2-ish giving me leeway in either direction.


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post #27 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 01:54 AM Thread Starter
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Your substrate will make that 0. You've got quite a bit of it, so it's going to buffer for quite some time. Probably a couple years at minimum.
When you say it's going to "buffer" what does this mean exactly?
Earlier you said you wouldn't worry about adding kh, but if the substrate is removing it, isn't that a bad thing? Don't i need some kh in the water?
And what should be my gh be then?

-Dennis
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post #28 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d2creative View Post
When you say it's going to "buffer" what does this mean exactly?

The substrate removes kH thus lowering pH = buffering the water in doing so. A buffer is the ability to resist a change in pH

Earlier you said you wouldn't worry about adding kh, but if the substrate is removing it, isn't that a bad thing?

No, low / no kH is best for plants.

Don't i need some kh in the water?

No, your substrate is the buffer in your situation, no need to try and fight the buffering ability of the substrate by adding kH only to have the substrate strip the water of it

And what should be my gh be then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagulator View Post
CaSO4 For Ca / gH - 20-30ppm
MgSO4 for Mg / gH - 5-10ppm


https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php - punch in your 50 gallons, and set range for each compound and it will tell you how much is needed.


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post #29 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 02:31 PM
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Thanks for explaining that, @Quagulator!

In this case, just remineralize gH, Dennis. Your tank will be stable on the pH/kH front without adding anything because of your substrate. The wood you've added to the tank is also going to release tannic acid and also help soften the water.

Your tank is going to be really easy to maintain as far as non-fert water parameters are concerned. Easier than you initially thought.


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