ICP Water Test results–Opinions needed on results and long, ongoing tank problems - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-12-2019, 09:43 PM Thread Starter
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ICP Water Test results–Opinions needed on results and long, ongoing tank problems

I decided to revisit my original problems from this thread:

https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/3...lacking-5.html

I saw a post here referencing a water test provider and figured I might as well give it a try
and see if anything comes of it.

So far my tank has not changed. It just continues to exist in its sad state.

I decided to revisit this because we were considering replacing our Poland Spring water delivery service with an RO system for drinking water. Before I took that step I was wondering if using it for my tank would be worth it. I know it can only help, but the RO system wastes a lot of water and thus I am not sure I want to go that route for the aquarium as well as drinking water. I know I can use the waste for other things, but in the cold months, I cant really use it outdoors for plants, so it's not a big benefit to use it for the garden etc.

Here is a pic of my tank and tap water results.

Does anything stand out as problematic?

I just emailed ICP and am enquiring as to how it's possible they measured 80-90ppm chlorine in my tank and tap. The tank is 7 days since the last water change and it was treated with Prime on the water change day. I'm not sure how there is still chlorine present with the Prime treatment and 7 days airtime. My towns water report shows at maximum 1.5ppm chlorine form their last test.

NOTE: Well after speaking with the company the results are not accurate as they test to higher levels for salt water aquariums. I need to speak with them and figure out how to adjust the values they reported. I am a little confused as they offer "home water" analysis on their site and I don't see any mention as to how it may be inaccurate for freshwater. It doesn't make sense. Why offer a home water analysis if the results are misleading as their tests are more geared for saltwater.



TAP WATER RESULTS


TANK WATER RESULTS


Thanks,
iso

Last edited by isonychia; 08-13-2019 at 04:21 PM. Reason: added Chlorine note
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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-13-2019, 06:07 PM Thread Starter
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After speaking with the lab, it seems the only value that is really off is Chlorine and Sulphur.

They suggest that Chlorine is probably 0.

The rest should be good.

Any thoughts on the results? Anything stand out as a problem?
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-13-2019, 10:39 PM
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Curious also as to why their testing would provide different results whether freshwater or marine. And that you would show so much chlorine in an established aquarium, but then they suggest that it's "probably zero." I would hope so, but didn't they test and get that value? Enough to shake my faith in their testing. I followed your original thread, your source water is very hard, no? For a 17 gallon tank, it would be very tempting for me to switch over to RO or at very least RO mixed with tap, just to bring down the KH.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-14-2019, 04:13 AM
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Don't worry. You got your moneys worth with this test. But for starters can you update use on what fertilizers and other products you were adding to the tank when the water was sampled? Also were you using tap water and what was your water change schedule and how much water you change out?

The first thing you need to know is how this test is done and what it will and will not tell you. This test takes your sample and heats it up until it turns into a plasma. At this point each atom in the sample will give off light. The wavelength (color) and intensity is then measured with a spectrum analyzer and analyzed by a computer. It doesn't tell you what the molecules were in the water and if the elements were in there toxic or safe form. Also gases (H, O, N and others) are not listed in the the report because air and water contamination would produce very high values.

Your utility adds chlorine and or Chloramine to sterilize the water. Free chlorine in the water is dangerous to fish and people, same with Chloramine. however chloride salts like sodium chloride, potassium chloride are safe to fish people and plants. Calcium and magnesium chloride and many other chloride molecules may also be present. Water utilities typically use water tests that specifically look for free chlorine and chloramine and this value is reported in the water quality report. They generally don't test for chloride salts. Tap water is typically rich in chlorides. So the 98ppm level is not alarming in any way.

Your 26ppm sulfur is also of no concern. Also if you are sill using equilibrium keep in mind it is entirely made of sulfate salts. Now bacteria can converting the sulfates to HS or SO2. If those levels are high enough to be toxic the tank would smell bad. Also note some other GH boosters use chloride salts and water conditioners don't remove chlorine they just react with it to convert it to a safe chloride salt. If you add carbonate to control KH it should eventually bind with excess CL and SO2 to make more safety salts.

I have been looking at this test and am considering using it on my aquarium water but I haven't yet. Now this company was set up to analyze salt water tanks. So they definitely know what is right and wrong for salt water tanks. But they may not be that good at providing fresh water advice.

Any way when you look at a test like this a good place to start is to determine how much of each element you add in based on your fertilizer dose. You can use a fertilizer calculator to do that such as this one:
https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php

The other important thing to look for are zeros.

Let start at the macros. Your iron value is of 0.12 is just a bit higher than the 0.1ppm I dose in my aquarium. Boron of 0.07ppm is higher than 0.018ppm the fertilizer calculator list. CSM doesn't have boron when it leaves the factory. However aquarium shops do add add it so the high value in this report is probably not an issue. CSM does add about 0.001ppm copper and 0.006ppm Zinc. If you are using tap water the higher readings in your tank water make sense. Your Molybdenum levels also look OK. CSM doesn't provide nickel but your water has it. 0.001 should be sufficient but you level of 0.027 is much higher then I would expect. I don't know if Nickel is at a toxic level.

But the BIG red flag is Manganese. Your tap water doesn't have this and CSM should supply 0.029ppm. You have zero in the test results. CSM is not supplying enough Manganese. Many people that make there own macros dose at about 0.035. You need to supply more Manganese.

For your macros potassium, Calcium, magnesium, sulfur and chlorine are all more than sufficient. I don't know what your Phosphate dose is so it might be OK or it might be high due to the Micro deficiency. As stated earlier the test doesn't provide any information on Nitrogen.

Note sodium, bromine, iodine, selenium, and vanadium are all animal and bacteria nutrients. All the others are not necessary for a healthy aquarium. Preferably we want to keep these unused element at tap water levels or lower. If they are higher they night be coming from your substrate. Some are definitely toxic if levels get high enough.

To boost manganese levels buy some manganese sulfate:
https://www.loudwolf.com/store/index...fe1598d34e0561

4 onces for $8 should last you a long time. Make a solution of 49ml of distilled water + 1ml of vinegar and 297miligrams of manganese sulfate (you will would need a scale). Add 1 ml at every water change plus your regular fertilizers.

If you don't have a adequate scale you can get this one:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It is probably not the best but it is low cost and has worked well for me.

Then for the next month be very consistent with your fertilization and the zinc dose, and water changes. Then send another sample out for a test. I would expect to see some nutrient levels drop and hopefully a non zero reading of manganese. Keep an eye on copper, zinc, molybdenum and nickel. if any of these go to zero you will also have to add them. I keep B, Zn both at 0.020ppm. in my aquarium. I keep my copper at 0.006 ppm and iron at 0.1ppm. I am thinking of using this test to refine my levels but I have not yet done that. After the second test you can do more test to further refine the levels.

Let us know how it goes. The later test results may be helpful to others.
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Last edited by Surf; 08-14-2019 at 06:07 AM. Reason: Edits
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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-14-2019, 03:14 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
Curious also as to why their testing would provide different results whether freshwater or marine. And that you would show so much chlorine in an established aquarium, but then they suggest that it's "probably zero." I would hope so, but didn't they test and get that value? Enough to shake my faith in their testing. I followed your original thread, your source water is very hard, no? For a 17 gallon tank, it would be very tempting for me to switch over to RO or at very least RO mixed with tap, just to bring down the KH.

I will attempt to answer some of these questions. I may not be explaining it properly, so don't take what I say as fact.
When I spoke over the phone with the tech guy (very nice and extremely helpful) he said the Chlorine levels they test for is to a very high scale for saltwater, thus their system does not report accurately for freshwater since the levels are so low.The same for sulphur. Maybe Surf can explain it better since he seems to understand their testing system.

My source water has a KH of about 7-9dKH. My GH tests have ranged from 20-30 dGH.
The reason for getting this test is to see what could be causing my problems. Is it something other than Gh or KH.

I have researched the high GH or KH problem to exhaustion. Does a high GH and high CA and MG or the ratio cause problems? Does high KH cause problems. Is a KH of 8 even considered high? Do either cause nutrient uptake problems? Is my tap PH of 7.6 causing problems? In all that research I have come away with ZERO facts. The answers are all over the map. MOST, not all, say none of those issues I described above cause problems. The answer is usually, those values are fine, except for a few soft water loving plants. A few, not a lot. I consider all the plants I have had problems with to not fall in the "few" plants that require soft water.

I tried distilled water for about a month. A mix of distilled with tap. It's in that thread I think. But I noticed very little improvement. The problem with that test is I believe it would take at least 2 months for all my existing plants to react to the change. Also, I'm not even sure the existing plants, that have been beat up for so long, would even react to the change. I would probably have to get new plants and retest with the distilled/tap mix.
2 months with 8 water changes and 9 gallons of water each time (50% of 17 gallons). Thats something like 30 gallons of distilled water. Since I tested it and noticed no difference, I didn't want to even attempt it again. Maybe I am just being lazy and agitated at the situation that has shown no signs of improvement etc. for so long.

iso

Quote:
Originally Posted by Surf View Post
Don't worry. You got your moneys worth with this test. But for starters can you update use on what fertilizers and other products you were adding to the tank when the water was sampled? Also were you using tap water and what was your water change schedule and how much water you change out?

The first thing you need to know is how this test is done and what it will and will not tell you. This test takes your sample and heats it up until it turns into a plasma. At this point each atom in the sample will give off light. The wavelength (color) and intensity is then measured with a spectrum analyzer and analyzed by a computer. It doesn't tell you what the molecules were in the water and if the elements were in there toxic or safe form. Also gases (H, O, N and others) are not listed in the the report because air and water contamination would produce very high values.

Your utility adds chlorine and or Chloramine to sterilize the water. Free chlorine in the water is dangerous to fish and people, same with Chloramine. however chloride salts like sodium chloride, potassium chloride are safe to fish people and plants. Calcium and magnesium chloride and many other chloride molecules may also be present. Water utilities typically use water tests that specifically look for free chlorine and chloramine and this value is reported in the water quality report. They generally don't test for chloride salts. Tap water is typically rich in chlorides. So the 98ppm level is not alarming in any way.

Your 26ppm sulfur is also of no concern. Also if you are sill using equilibrium keep in mind it is entirely made of sulfate salts. Now bacteria can converting the sulfates to HS or SO2. If those levels are high enough to be toxic the tank would smell bad. Also note some other GH boosters use chloride salts and water conditioners don't remove chlorine they just react with it to convert it to a safe chloride salt. If you add carbonate to control KH it should eventually bind with excess CL and SO2 to make more safety salts.

I have been looking at this test and am considering using it on my aquarium water but I haven't yet. Now this company was set up to analyze salt water tanks. So they definitely know what is right and wrong for salt water tanks. But they may not be that good at providing fresh water advice.

Any way when you look at a test like this a good place to start is to determine how much of each element you add in based on your fertilizer dose. You can use a fertilizer calculator to do that such as this one:
https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php

The other important thing to look for are zeros.

Let start at the macros. Your iron value is of 0.12 is just a bit higher than the 0.1ppm I dose in my aquarium. Boron of 0.07ppm is higher than 0.018ppm the fertilizer calculator list. CSM doesn't have boron when it leaves the factory. However aquarium shops do add add it so the high value in this report is probably not an issue. CSM does add about 0.001ppm copper and 0.006ppm Zinc. If you are using tap water the higher readings in your tank water make sense. Your Molybdenum levels also look OK. CSM doesn't provide nickel but your water has it. 0.001 should be sufficient but you level of 0.027 is much higher then I would expect. I don't know if Nickel is at a toxic level.

But the BIG red flag is Manganese. Your tap water doesn't have this and CSM should supply 0.029ppm. You have zero in the test results. CSM is not supplying enough Manganese. Many people that make there own macros dose at about 0.035. You need to supply more Manganese.

For your macros potassium, Calcium, magnesium, sulfur and chlorine are all more than sufficient. I don't know what your Phosphate dose is so it might be OK or it might be high due to the Micro deficiency. As stated earlier the test doesn't provide any information on Nitrogen.

Note sodium, bromine, iodine, selenium, and vanadium are all animal and bacteria nutrients. All the others are not necessary for a healthy aquarium. Preferably we want to keep these unused element at tap water levels or lower. If they are higher they night be coming from your substrate. Some are definitely toxic if levels get high enough.

To boost manganese levels buy some manganese sulfate:
https://www.loudwolf.com/store/index...fe1598d34e0561

4 onces for $8 should last you a long time. Make a solution of 49ml of distilled water + 1ml of vinegar and 297miligrams of manganese sulfate (you will would need a scale). Add 1 ml at every water change plus your regular fertilizers.

If you don't have a adequate scale you can get this one:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It is probably not the best but it is low cost and has worked well for me.

Then for the next month be very consistent with your fertilization and the zinc dose, and water changes. Then send another sample out for a test. I would expect to see some nutrient levels drop and hopefully a non zero reading of manganese. Keep an eye on copper, zinc, molybdenum and nickel. if any of these go to zero you will also have to add them. I keep B, Zn both at 0.020ppm. in my aquarium. I keep my copper at 0.006 ppm and iron at 0.1ppm. I am thinking of using this test to refine my levels but I have not yet done that. After the second test you can do more test to further refine the levels.

Let us know how it goes. The later test results may be helpful to others.

Hi Surf,

Here are some answers.

Mon, Wed, Friday
Micros
1/32 tsp Plantex CSM+B
1/32 tsp Iron Chelate Fe

Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday
Macros
1/8 tsp KNO3
1/32 tsp KH2PO4
1/32 tsp K2SO4

Saturday rest day.

Sunday water change

I usually change about 40% of the water each week.

I'm using my tap water.

I squirt a little Prime in the tank while adding in my tap water.

I don't add anything else.

I will look into the other suggestions and tips you mentioned in the post and purchase some manganese. Thank you for taking the time to respond.

I know you have responded to my posts before. What are your opinions on my water quality and the problems I have been having?

What I was hoping for was some opinions on the GH/KH values, CA and MG ppm, nutrient uptake etc and any problems that the hobby knows as fact that could be caused by my water source. Installing an RO filter is a project. I am not too concerned with the expense, but mostly the work involved with installing, storage tanks etc and I am not too keen on the waste aspect. What are your opinions on my GH/KH,PH,CA and MG values.

Thanks,
iso

Last edited by Darkblade48; 08-21-2019 at 04:25 AM. Reason: Please use the edit function for back to back posts to keep threads cleaner
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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 06:00 AM
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Your calcium and magnesium levels are high enough to support good growth. And when converting the PPM to calcium carbonate equivalent does indicate you have hard water. So Your GH and KH test results from your home kits appears reasonably accurate. The only concern I would have is with PH is the affect it can have on iron but your iron levels in the lab test is high enough that I don't think that is a problem.

As to what else might be affecting nutrient uptake it is difficult to know. There are few hard fact right now

in this hobby. What works for one person may not work for others. However what I do know is that a manganese deficiency will throttle plant growth down so much that right now it dominate over anything else that may be affecting plant growth.

That is why I think you should fix it and then rest in a month. The test may show other problems that right now might not be obvious. Or it may show nor more issues. The only other thing that would answering the nutrient uptake question is observing the plants with the manganese deficiency resolved.

Overall in my opinion your water is good enough for plants and fish that do well in hard water. You could soften the water if needed by mixing RO with the tap. It is really the fish you want in the tank that will determine if you need to soften the water or just leave it unsoftened.

Sorry for the delay in response. Currently doing a little traveling.
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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-20-2019, 04:26 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Surf View Post
Your calcium and magnesium levels are high enough to support good growth. And when converting the PPM to calcium carbonate equivalent does indicate you have hard water. So Your GH and KH test results from your home kits appears reasonably accurate. The only concern I would have is with PH is the affect it can have on iron but your iron levels in the lab test is high enough that I don't think that is a problem.

As to what else might be affecting nutrient uptake it is difficult to know. There are few hard fact right now

in this hobby. What works for one person may not work for others. However what I do know is that a manganese deficiency will throttle plant growth down so much that right now it dominate over anything else that may be affecting plant growth.

That is why I think you should fix it and then rest in a month. The test may show other problems that right now might not be obvious. Or it may show nor more issues. The only other thing that would answering the nutrient uptake question is observing the plants with the manganese deficiency resolved.

Overall in my opinion your water is good enough for plants and fish that do well in hard water. You could soften the water if needed by mixing RO with the tap. It is really the fish you want in the tank that will determine if you need to soften the water or just leave it unsoftened.

Sorry for the delay in response. Currently doing a little traveling.


Thanks Surf!

Until the Manganese gets here I have been dosing extra CSM+B.

I know how slow stuff grows in my tank. If I trim a stem of rotala sp green, it takes weeks for it to sprout new growth from the trimmed section. It also still shows poor condition leaves at the bottom and also shows slight yellowing of the tips/edges even near the middle of the stem leaves. Overall you can tell it's just not happy. I will use that plant as my test. Once I start dosing the MnSO4, I will trim a stem and see what happens.

I usually order from GLA. Is there any reason I couldn't order their MnSO4?
You linked to MnSO4.H2O. Is there a difference?

I need to order more KNO3 from GLA anyway. So I figured I would get their MnSO4.

Thanks,
iso
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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 02:36 AM
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You can use the Nilocg MnSO4. In the past I didn't see it on the site. Now I do and so I guess it was recently added. Many salts have water in them. Sometimes a lot. If there is a lot then it could affect the dosage calculation. And some fertilizer salts can be purchased in there hydrated for or non hydrated form. MnSO4 H20 only has one water molecule so it won't significantly affect the calculation. Sometimes vendors forget to list the water content or are ignorant the importance it sometimes has. I am guessing the Nilocg MnSO4 is actually MnSO4 H2O. But if you want you can ask them. NIlocg is generally good at responding to e-mails.

Last edited by Surf; 08-21-2019 at 02:55 AM. Reason: Added information
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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 07:46 PM Thread Starter
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You can use the Nilocg MnSO4. In the past I didn't see it on the site. Now I do and so I guess it was recently added. Many salts have water in them. Sometimes a lot. If there is a lot then it could affect the dosage calculation. And some fertilizer salts can be purchased in there hydrated for or non hydrated form. MnSO4 H20 only has one water molecule so it won't significantly affect the calculation. Sometimes vendors forget to list the water content or are ignorant the importance it sometimes has. I am guessing the Nilocg MnSO4 is actually MnSO4 H2O. But if you want you can ask them. NIlocg is generally good at responding to e-mails.
Thanks Surf.

I ordered some more KNO3, Mn and I also ordered some GLA EDTA+DTPA MICROMIX.
I still have the original CSM+B from GLA. I figured I would try this different micromix as I read it may be better for harder water. If thats wrong let me know. I believe it's different than the original CSM+B I order from them 4 years ago.

I probably should only add the Mn and not change my micro mix to the new one.

This way I will know if the added Mn helped.

Later on I can transition to the new micromix.

iso
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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Micros
1/32 tsp Plantex CSM+B
1/32 tsp Iron Chelate Fe
Why iron Chelate were you using before you ordered before this order?


My understanding is that nilocg.com sell CSM+B and offers to also sell you a bag of FE DTPA. I don't believe they mix it. The basic difference is:

FE EDTA (the type of iron in CSM+B), This iron salt is stable in water with a PH of 6.5 or less. Some however stay last up to a PH of 7.

FE DTPA, This iron salt is stable in with with a PH of 7 or less. Some however may last up to a PH of 7.5

If your water PH gets to hight the iron will separate chelating molecule and the iron might become insoluble and might not be available to plants. At least that is the general theory. However the chemistry in aquaiums doesn't always behave the same as in the lab.

The general thinking right now is that FE DTPA is probably a better choice for use in aquariums. However if you look at your water test results iron is shown at 0.127ppm. So based on your test results I don't think you need to worry about iron right now. Maybe that will change when the Mn deficiency is resolved. But for now I think taking it one step at a time is a good idea. Solve the Mn deficiency and then see what happens.
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post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 09:57 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Surf View Post
Why iron Chelate were you using before you ordered before this order?


My understanding is that nilocg.com sell CSM+B and offers to also sell you a bag of FE DTPA. I don't believe they mix it. The basic difference is:

FE EDTA (the type of iron in CSM+B), This iron salt is stable in water with a PH of 6.5 or less. Some however stay last up to a PH of 7.

FE DTPA, This iron salt is stable in with with a PH of 7 or less. Some however may last up to a PH of 7.5

If your water PH gets to hight the iron will separate chelating molecule and the iron might become insoluble and might not be available to plants. At least that is the general theory. However the chemistry in aquaiums doesn't always behave the same as in the lab.

The general thinking right now is that FE DTPA is probably a better choice for use in aquariums. However if you look at your water test results iron is shown at 0.127ppm. So based on your test results I don't think you need to worry about iron right now. Maybe that will change when the Mn deficiency is resolved. But for now I think taking it one step at a time is a good idea. Solve the Mn deficiency and then see what happens.
I ordered DTPA chelated iron from GLA back in 2015 I think. I was not using any other fertilizers before then. The only other Iron I have tried (other than that already existing in CSM) was the Flourish iron recommended to me by Seattle_Aquarist in my other thread. I didn't notice a difference when I did that.

I went to Rotala Butterfly and tried to get a tsp dose measurement of what I would need 3x per week for the Mn. It is recommending less than 1/64tsp 3x a week. Is that what you would suggest if I am dry dosing Mn? .1ppm target for the week? I would rather do that than make a solution as you suggested. It's easier and it's how I dose my other fertilizers. Those little tsp are pretty accurate. I tested them against a 1tsp measurement and they are pretty close.

Also the Mn is not chelated. Do you think that will affect things?

iso
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post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-23-2019, 03:53 AM
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When I first did the calculation for how much Mn you need I used Rotala Butterfly but it didn't generate any Tsp amounts which is why i only listed milligrams levels. For some reason now it does now generate tsp amount of about 1/64 per water change. Strange.

Quote:
Also the Mn is not chelated. Do you think that will affect things?
MnSO4 is commonly used in many fertilizers. According to Wikipedia up to 52grams can be dissolved in 100ml of water at a temperature of 5C. Which is more than enough. I have been making my own micro fertilizer for about a year with MnSO4,and the only Chelated compound I use is Fe DTPA. The other micro nutrients are mainly sulfates. When making a solution using water with PH of 6 or less makes it even easier to dissolve everything. Iron Chelate are typically used because in general iron doesn't dissolve easily.

Bump: When I first did the calculation for how much Mn you need I used Rotala Butterfly but it didn't generate any Tsp amounts which is why i only listed milligrams levels. For some reason now it does now generate tsp amount of about 1/64 per water change. Strange.

Quote:
Also the Mn is not chelated. Do you think that will affect things?
MnSO4 is commonly used in many fertilizers. According to Wikipedia up to 52grams can be dissolved in 100ml of water at a temperature of 5C. Which is more than enough. I have been making my own micro fertilizer for about a year with MnSO4,and the only Chelated compound I use is Fe DTPA. The other micro nutrients are mainly sulfates. When making a solution using water with PH of 6 or less makes it even easier to dissolve everything. Iron Chelate are typically used because in general iron doesn't dissolve easily.
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post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-23-2019, 10:37 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surf View Post
When I first did the calculation for how much Mn you need I used Rotala Butterfly but it didn't generate any Tsp amounts which is why i only listed milligrams levels. For some reason now it does now generate tsp amount of about 1/64 per water change. Strange.

Quote:
Also the Mn is not chelated. Do you think that will affect things?
MnSO4 is commonly used in many fertilizers. According to Wikipedia up to 52grams can be dissolved in 100ml of water at a temperature of 5C. Which is more than enough. I have been making my own micro fertilizer for about a year with MnSO4,and the only Chelated compound I use is Fe DTPA. The other micro nutrients are mainly sulfates. When making a solution using water with PH of 6 or less makes it even easier to dissolve everything. Iron Chelate are typically used because in general iron doesn't dissolve easily.

Bump: When I first did the calculation for how much Mn you need I used Rotala Butterfly but it didn't generate any Tsp amounts which is why i only listed milligrams levels. For some reason now it does now generate tsp amount of about 1/64 per water change. Strange.

Quote:
Also the Mn is not chelated. Do you think that will affect things?
MnSO4 is commonly used in many fertilizers. According to Wikipedia up to 52grams can be dissolved in 100ml of water at a temperature of 5C. Which is more than enough. I have been making my own micro fertilizer for about a year with MnSO4,and the only Chelated compound I use is Fe DTPA. The other micro nutrients are mainly sulfates. When making a solution using water with PH of 6 or less makes it even easier to dissolve everything. Iron Chelate are typically used because in general iron doesn't dissolve easily.
When I went to Rotala it said less than 1/64 tsp 2-4 times per week for Mn.

Since this is a micro I was going to dose it 3 times per week when I also dose CSM+B and Fe. Should I do that or dose only at water change day which is when I dose my macros? Which would be one dose of about 1/32 heavy tsp.

Thanks
Iso
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post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 09:41 PM
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Since this is a micro I was going to dose it 3 times per week when I also dose CSM+B and Fe. Should I do that or dose only at water change day which is when I dose my macros? Which would be one dose of about 1/32 heavy tsp.
I don't think it maters if it is once a week or with each micro dose..Use whatever way works for you. But be sure to retest the water at a later date to see what effect it had. When you do the second test update this post. Your experience may help other people.
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post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-18-2019, 07:53 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Surf View Post
I don't think it maters if it is once a week or with each micro dose..Use whatever way works for you. But be sure to retest the water at a later date to see what effect it had. When you do the second test update this post. Your experience may help other people.
Well it doesn't look like the added Mn helped.

I still have very slow growth and the tips/edges of the rotala sp green get slight yellowing. The new growth is green, but over time the older growth gets that yellowing.

I trimmed all the tops off the rotalas, replanted them and started dosing with the new GLA EDTA+DTPA MICROMIX and continued with the Mn.

I'm still unsure how this test is going. It's only been about a week with the new micromix. I would not say growth has really sped up. The yellowing progression or regression is hard to distinguish, since they are the tops of the plants that already had some yellowing. It will take time for the tops to grow and thus see if the top 2/3rds of the plant continue to show yellowing.

Just some info. My light is set at about 50 par. Its been like that for a while. I'm not sure what kind of growth I should get, but 1" every 2 weeks seems rather slow to me and thus makes me think something is wrong, in addition to the yellowing edges.

iso
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