Dwarf Baby Tears Fertilizing Questions - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-24-2018, 12:15 AM Thread Starter
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Dwarf Baby Tears Fertilizing Questions

Hello everyone,

I have a 8 gallon 12"x12"x12" tank that has been established for around 2 months now with red cherry shrimp. I am using Aquasolum soil. I have a pressurized CO2 system here going at around 1bps and my Par levels are around 100+. In here I have some Anubias, Bacopa, and DBT. It has been during the past two to three weeks when my DBT are starting to yellow and die off. I bought these DBT submersed from my LFS and they are around over a 1.5 old in this tank. I have read on here that it may be a macro nutrient deficiency, so I went ahead and bought the following ferts and dosed:

Flourish (everything) 3x week
Flourish Potassium 2x week
Flourish Phosphorus 2x week
Flourish Nitrogen 3x week

I noticed that my nitrates were constantly hovering at 0 ppm even adding the Flourish Ferts. Just two days ago I added around 1.5ml of Nitrogen and after waiting around an hour to check results, I had around 5ppm from my API liquid test kit. The bottle says to double this amount after dosing so it ended up around 10ppm I assume.

Today when I checked the nitrates again, it was back to 0 and I just added 2ml of Nitrogen again. What is concerning me is am I adding too much Nitrogen? The bottle instructions says to add much less than 2ml for my tank size but it just keeps going down. I am looking for some feedback on how I should control my ferts on a weekly basis as I am still a beginner in this. I really want to save my DBT.

Also my Anubias are also yellowing on the leaves as well. Not sure if this is an indication of anything

After the recent fertilizing I am getting some sort of hairish algae on the tank glass, and some sort of green bead algae that looks like little balls on the rock.

Thank you so much!

Photos:
https://imgur.com/a/5U8WAy5
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-24-2018, 04:52 AM
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I have never heard of nitrates dripping like that even in a heavy plant tank.

Is your test outdated? Maybe not shaken enough? Something just doesn't seem right to me.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-24-2018, 06:11 AM Thread Starter
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I have never heard of nitrates dripping like that even in a heavy plant tank.

Is your test outdated? Maybe not shaken enough? Something just doesn't seem right to me.
I know about the shaking problem with the nitrates, but i'll shake it more to make sure. I thought something was wrong.

But would you know what is causing my DBT and anubias yellowing?
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-24-2018, 12:42 PM
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With bright lighting and CO2 the demand for nutrients are going to be pretty high, especially if you don't have enough livestock in there generating waste.

The green spots you speak of sound like green spot algae (GSA) and is usually an indicator of low phosphates, but not always. If you are below 1 ppm, then it's a good chance you are too low. I do remember having to dose something like 2 mL of Seachem Phosphorus per gallon when I was using it in a high tech tank. This kept me in the 2-3 ppm range. I went through that 250 ML bottle rather quickly, so I went ahead and purchased KH2PO4 and started dosing that instead. As for nitrates, I used to keep them at 20-30 ppm in my high tech tank with no issues. I was also doing weekly 50% water changes.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-24-2018, 01:50 PM
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I know about the shaking problem with the nitrates, but i'll shake it more to make sure. I thought something was wrong.

But would you know what is causing my DBT and anubias yellowing?
You need to slam bottle #2 on a hard surface several times. One of the reagents settles out and crystallizes in the bottom. I smack the bottom on a table 10x hard, then smack the top 10x on the table as well. Bottle hasn't broke yet!

Yellowing can indicate a few things, could be N, S, Fe....once you repeat the test for N, we'll have a better idea. How much Fe are you dosing?

Edit: I just looked at your photo. The anubias(center-top of first photo) with the leaf that is not just yellow, but dying/browning, looks like a PO4 deficiency. It's possible that there could be a few things going on here though...

I'd consider picking yourself up an EI package from one of the vendors - nilocg.com, greenleafaquariums.com, etc.. Save yourself a ton of money vs. buying Seachem products, as madcrafted mentioned. Also, I'd head over to rotalabutterfly.com and use the nutrient calculator. Enter in your tank size, your Seachem product, and then the target you're aiming for. For NO3, I'd be targeting 30+ ppm, PO4 I'd target 4-5 ppm and Fe .1-.2 ppm.

Last edited by mgeorges; 07-24-2018 at 02:00 PM. Reason: .
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-25-2018, 03:06 AM Thread Starter
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You need to slam bottle #2 on a hard surface several times. One of the reagents settles out and crystallizes in the bottom. I smack the bottom on a table 10x hard, then smack the top 10x on the table as well. Bottle hasn't broke yet!

Yellowing can indicate a few things, could be N, S, Fe....once you repeat the test for N, we'll have a better idea. How much Fe are you dosing?

Edit: I just looked at your photo. The anubias(center-top of first photo) with the leaf that is not just yellow, but dying/browning, looks like a PO4 deficiency. It's possible that there could be a few things going on here though...

I'd consider picking yourself up an EI package from one of the vendors - nilocg.com, greenleafaquariums.com, etc.. Save yourself a ton of money vs. buying Seachem products, as madcrafted mentioned. Also, I'd head over to rotalabutterfly.com and use the nutrient calculator. Enter in your tank size, your Seachem product, and then the target you're aiming for. For NO3, I'd be targeting 30+ ppm, PO4 I'd target 4-5 ppm and Fe .1-.2 ppm.
I have bought a new API nitrate test kit just in case and today I read 5ppm (if doubling then 10ppm). The color indicates it is just a tad lower than the reading I had yesterday. I actually bought and dosed some Iron today, which I did not do prior from today.

It seems I am also getting diatoms on the tank glass and possibly on the leaves of my bacopa/anubias.

I also talked to my LFS and they said that I might have too much light (prob 140-150 par where the DBT is) and for too long (13 hours currently). They told me to lower the duration to around 8 hours and light intensity.

Perhaps adding the iron might help? I will also get the EI packages after I finish this batch of seachem. Seems to be much cheaper.

Edit:

I am looking at rotalabutterfly.com and it seems to be super helpful. The back of the bottle is very inaccurate and this website tells me exactly what I need to dose to reach target ppm. Thank you for this!
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-25-2018, 03:32 AM
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Originally Posted by CrazyPeekles View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgeorges View Post
You need to slam bottle #2 on a hard surface several times. One of the reagents settles out and crystallizes in the bottom. I smack the bottom on a table 10x hard, then smack the top 10x on the table as well. Bottle hasn't broke yet!

Yellowing can indicate a few things, could be N, S, Fe....once you repeat the test for N, we'll have a better idea. How much Fe are you dosing?

Edit: I just looked at your photo. The anubias(center-top of first photo) with the leaf that is not just yellow, but dying/browning, looks like a PO4 deficiency. It's possible that there could be a few things going on here though...

I'd consider picking yourself up an EI package from one of the vendors - nilocg.com, greenleafaquariums.com, etc.. Save yourself a ton of money vs. buying Seachem products, as madcrafted mentioned. Also, I'd head over to rotalabutterfly.com and use the nutrient calculator. Enter in your tank size, your Seachem product, and then the target you're aiming for. For NO3, I'd be targeting 30+ ppm, PO4 I'd target 4-5 ppm and Fe .1-.2 ppm.
I have bought a new API nitrate test kit just in case and today I read 5ppm (if doubling then 10ppm). The color indicates it is just a tad lower than the reading I had yesterday. I actually bought and dosed some Iron today, which I did not do prior from today.

It seems I am also getting diatoms on the tank glass and possibly on the leaves of my bacopa/anubias.

I also talked to my LFS and they said that I might have too much light (prob 140-150 par where the DBT is) and for too long (13 hours currently). They told me to lower the duration to around 8 hours and light intensity.

Perhaps adding the iron might help? I will also get the EI packages after I finish this batch of seachem. Seems to be much cheaper.

Edit:

I am looking at rotalabutterfly.com and it seems to be super helpful. The back of the bottle is very inaccurate and this website tells me exactly what I need to dose to reach target ppm. Thank you for this!
Holy wow, 13 hours is an insane amount of light, lol. I would actually cut that down to 6 hours even until you start seeing healthy, new growth from your plants. The combination of duration plus intensity is a recipe for a mess. I'm surprised this hasn't become an algae farm. Running that much light will certainly exacerbate any deficiencies, too, so cutting it way down while you get things dialed in - real good idea.

For reference, I run about 120 PAR at substrate in my well established 29 gallon. Lots of plant mass, lots of CO2 and ferts. Light is on a timer for 7 hours, that's a pretty solid photo period for the plants. If I did 13....I can't even imagine the adjustments I'd have to make to keep that from becoming an algae farm!

I love rotalabutterfly. Wonderful tool, so useful!
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-25-2018, 03:56 AM Thread Starter
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Holy wow, 13 hours is an insane amount of light, lol. I would actually cut that down to 6 hours even until you start seeing healthy, new growth from your plants. The combination of duration plus intensity is a recipe for a mess. I'm surprised this hasn't become an algae farm. Running that much light will certainly exacerbate any deficiencies, too, so cutting it way down while you get things dialed in - real good idea.

For reference, I run about 120 PAR at substrate in my well established 29 gallon. Lots of plant mass, lots of CO2 and ferts. Light is on a timer for 7 hours, that's a pretty solid photo period for the plants. If I did 13....I can't even imagine the adjustments I'd have to make to keep that from becoming an algae farm!

I love rotalabutterfly. Wonderful tool, so useful!
Oh I see.. I seem to have found my big problem then lol. I'll put it back down to 7 hours. It kinda makes sense because it might be light burn on my leaves. Does light burn happen to plants?
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-25-2018, 02:10 PM
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Oh I see.. I seem to have found my big problem then lol. I'll put it back down to 7 hours. It kinda makes sense because it might be light burn on my leaves. Does light burn happen to plants?
Not that I've ever seen. I've got only a handful of lower light plants in my tanks and they're getting blasted with light without issues. The big issue is the potential deficiency it can cause in the water column. If your plants run out of food and are still getting hit with loads of light, they'll start having problems as you've seen.

I think I've also heard that plants will only photosynthesize for so long under intense light, and then they shut down. If the light stays on, at that point you're just feeding algae. Maybe someone else can chime in and confirm this, it's been a while since I've seen this mentioned.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 07-25-2018, 09:18 PM Thread Starter
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Not that I've ever seen. I've got only a handful of lower light plants in my tanks and they're getting blasted with light without issues. The big issue is the potential deficiency it can cause in the water column. If your plants run out of food and are still getting hit with loads of light, they'll start having problems as you've seen.

I think I've also heard that plants will only photosynthesize for so long under intense light, and then they shut down. If the light stays on, at that point you're just feeding algae. Maybe someone else can chime in and confirm this, it's been a while since I've seen this mentioned.
That makes sense. Thanks for the help. By the way, do you have test kits for all of NPK, Fe? API doesnt make test kits for K and Fe, and I was wondering what brand is good for those to meet my target ppms.
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