Ferts - Can you put Plantex, Potas, and Iron Together in one bottle? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-21-2004, 07:21 PM Thread Starter
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Ferts - Can you put Plantex, Potas, and Iron Together in one bottle?

Assuming I get the proportion right, can I roll all 3 of these up into one mixing bottle? For example, right now I have 3 seperate bottles, all of which I dose 10ml per dosing, and I use 176ml water in each. Could I just put all the mixes together into one bottle of 176ml water, and still do 10ml of water per dosing and still get the same concentration of each? Or is there some math that I am missing in which I should do more than just 10ml?

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 12:49 AM
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You can. But I prefer to dose my potassium dry.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 12:59 AM
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I was mixing Potassium, Nitrogen, Phosphorus, Iron and Tropica Master Grow (for traces) together, and was getting some kind of precipitate. Don't know what was causing it, but I dropped the Iron and the TMG, and the precipitate went away.

Steve - 33g reef and a 180g planted in need of a re-scape.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 03:10 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the advice!

I may actually start dosing K dry as well. Due to it clumping up in the refrigerator, I dont think I am getting the full potential. And this is after diluting it so much that I have to add 20ml per doing (3x per week).

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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 03:13 AM
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it was wise of you to ask the question first...
If it were me, I would mix them up without any question ... KABOOM! :P

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 03:33 AM
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Plantex/TMG/Iron (etc, you get the picture) will complex with phosphate and will precipitate out. Keep phosphate separate.


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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 03:52 AM
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The cloudiness will go away, but it is unsightly.

Follow Gomer's advice!

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 04:05 AM
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Just to be a little more thorough, Iron complexes with phosphate to form Iron phosphate (I believe in the (III) state. This has a ksp of 1.3 x 10-22 ...which translates to not soluble at all.

If Fe(II) state, solubility will still suck..so the story is the same.


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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-22-2004, 11:09 AM
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Pls forgive my chemistry ignorance here...

If one wants to throw all the fixin's in one pot, what do you leave out? Iron or Phosphate? Both or either?

And by leaving them out, what do you avoid?

Steve - 33g reef and a 180g planted in need of a re-scape.
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scolley
Pls forgive my chemistry ignorance here...

If one wants to throw all the fixin's in one pot, what do you leave out? Iron or Phosphate? Both or either?

And by leaving them out, what do you avoid?
I did the search and this is the only thread that asks the question I wanted to ask: Can I mix KNO3,K2SO4 & KH2Po4 in solution into one bottle and dose that instead of three separate doses? (leaving the micros + iron out of course).

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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 01:41 AM Thread Starter
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yes, you can.

You may find it hard to get everything to disolve well enough though. Even if you do, by adding a minor amount of each to a 500ml bottle (for example) you will end up having to dose about 30ml's each time if not more. Maybe you can get this down some, but probably not. Let us know how it turns out!

Glad to see a post by me a year ago got found in a search

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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 01:47 AM
 
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Phosphate will precipitate with iron, so keep the phosphate seperate. k2so4 doesn't dissolve well in higher concentrations, so it's best to dose that dry seperately as well. You can mix everything else together.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 01:48 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.lemay
Phosphate will precipitate with iron, so keep the phosphate seperate. k2so4 doesn't dissolve well in higher concentrations, so it's best to dose that dry seperately as well. You can mix everything else together.
he was already leaving out Traces and Iron from the mix. The KNO3, K2SO4, and KH2PO4 are fine to combine without fear of the Iron/PO4 ill effect.

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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 02:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spar
yes, you can.

You may find it hard to get everything to disolve well enough though. Even if you do, by adding a minor amount of each to a 500ml bottle (for example) you will end up having to dose about 30ml's each time if not more. Maybe you can get this down some, but probably not. Let us know how it turns out!

Glad to see a post by me a year ago got found in a search
I'm trying to quit the post-a-random-thought habit.

Steve

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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-28-2005, 05:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scolley
I was mixing Potassium, Nitrogen, Phosphorus, Iron and Tropica Master Grow (for traces) together, and was getting some kind of precipitate. Don't know what was causing it, but I dropped the Iron and the TMG, and the precipitate went away.
Mono-potassium phosphate and Iron always form a precipitate when mixed. Some are so paranoid they don't even dose iron and phophate on teh same day. I've never had a problem dosing at the same time, but yeah, you can't mix these two.
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