Ideal Phosphate levels? - The Planted Tank Forum
 260Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-25-2018, 10:24 PM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 172
Ideal Phosphate levels?

Please someone explain this to me, coming from reef tank I’m use to 0.000 phosphates

My new high tech planted tank has about 10-20ppm nitrates and when I test phosphates with salifert test kit it’s almost 0

And I’m getting some kind of black algae or Gsa it blows off when I turkey bast it ...

I bought Tropica fertiliser both specialist and premium not sure which I should use? And Phosphorus by flourish incase

Do I dose Phosphate? Or keep it low at 0
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	8E7B6956-E82C-4ED2-B04A-5C3D96B9AE03_1524694963216.jpg
Views:	189
Size:	62.4 KB
ID:	849841  

Click image for larger version

Name:	3B8FAD42-7FB6-4F02-BA02-AA468EC593ED_1524694979996.jpg
Views:	181
Size:	47.8 KB
ID:	849849  

Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-25-2018, 10:30 PM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 831
With nitrates at those levels, you'll want at least 1-2 ppm of phosphates.
Greggz and Greggz like this.
madcrafted is offline  
post #3 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-25-2018, 10:47 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,684
Roughly 10:1 NO3:PO4
Greggz, Greggz, Immortal1 and 1 others like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.
Maryland Guppy is online now  
 
post #4 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-25-2018, 11:20 PM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 172
So I dosed phosphorous from flourish as recommended morning I tested now still 0 , do I dose everyday until I read 1 ppm? And is it safe for fish shrimp?

Do I also dose Tropica Specialised fertiliser(nitrate,ammonium,phosphorus) or I don’t dose this yet because there is 10-20ppm nitrates already?
post #5 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 12:39 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,684
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
So I dosed phosphorous from flourish as recommended morning I tested now still 0 , do I dose everyday until I read 1 ppm? And is it safe for fish shrimp?

Do I also dose Tropica Specialised fertiliser(nitrate,ammonium,phosphorus) or I don’t dose this yet because there is 10-20ppm nitrates already?
Flourish recommended is 2.5ml per 20 gallon which delivers .132ppm PO4
These low amounts are hard to detect.
24.5ml would bring 20 gallons up to 1.3ppm.
Seachem can be hard on the wallet too!

My Cory's and RCS have not melted yet!

Zorfox planted tank calculator can be downloaded to your PC.
It can resolve dosing problems and you don't need to understand molecular weights etc...

The tropica product I am not familiar with but an EI dose would require 22ml.
Based on the rotalabutterfly.com calculator.

What are your existing nitrate levels from??? Phish???

In a new tank I just dose immediately to desired level.
Greggz and Greggz like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.

Last edited by Maryland Guppy; 04-26-2018 at 12:40 AM. Reason: edit
Maryland Guppy is online now  
post #6 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 12:49 AM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 831
I remember having to dose a bit more than 1 mL per gallon of seachem's phosphorus to bring level just over 1 ppm. It goes quickly. I now use the dry form (KH2PO4) for saving costs.

Here's a nifty little dosing calculator that can be used for measuring out your ferts, whether using a premixed solutions like seachem or dry salts: Rotala Butterfly | Planted Aquarium Nutrient Dosing Calculator
madcrafted is offline  
post #7 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 01:31 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: PA
Posts: 1,713
Who REALLY believes the ratios matter? Besides, measurements of 1 ppm are as likely to be near zero as they are to be 2 ppm.
Deanna is offline  
post #8 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 01:39 AM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 172
My nitrate levels were like 40ppm from cycle I got it down to 10-20 okay so this algae is starting because of 0 phosphates? Does that mean that 0 phosphates and 10-20 nitrates plants cant use because no phosphates?

Do I dose Tropica fertiliser now that I have nitrates already or no??

And also wanted to be clear, do I dose phosphorus until test shows 1ppm?

Last edited by Darkblade48; 04-26-2018 at 08:30 AM. Reason: Please use the edit function for back to back posts to keep threads cleaner
post #9 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 02:25 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,684
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deanna View Post
Who REALLY believes the ratios matter? Besides, measurements of 1 ppm are as likely to be near zero as they are to be 2 ppm.
If dosed based on calculator you will be there, sometimes due to inaccurate testing by users one may fall short.

Ratios are absolutely meaningless.

The horse will not drink @ every water crossing!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.

Last edited by Maryland Guppy; 04-26-2018 at 02:27 AM. Reason: edit
Maryland Guppy is online now  
post #10 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 02:27 AM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 172
Ok bottom line , if ratios don’t matter why do I need 1ppm phosphates?
post #11 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 02:36 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Maryland Guppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (15/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Arnold
Posts: 3,684
"Master Po: [after easily defeating the boy in combat] Ha, ha, never assume because a man has no eyes he cannot see. Close your eyes. What do you hear?
Young Caine: I hear the water, I hear the birds.
Master Po: Do you hear your own heartbeat?
Young Caine: No.
Master Po: Do you hear the grasshopper that is at your feet?
Young Caine: [looking down and seeing the insect] Old man, how is it that you hear these things?
Master Po: Young man, how is it that you do not?

Dose the phosphate.
1-2ppm of PO4 will never hurt a planted tank.

In general macros can be lathered on.
Micros can be another story and/or debate.
Greggz, Greggz, Immortal1 and 2 others like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Growing is not that difficult.
Maryland Guppy is online now  
post #12 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 02:47 AM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 172
Ok I will dose but I dose 1ppm worth or until I get a reading of 1 ppm?
post #13 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 03:01 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Jeff5614's Avatar
 
PTrader: (52/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 3,605
You'll want to dose 1 ppm. That would apply to anything else you're dosing as well ( NO3, Fe, etc.).
Jeff5614 is offline  
post #14 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 04:06 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: PA
Posts: 1,713
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
My nitrate levels were like 40ppm from cycle I got it down to 10-20 okay so this algae is starting because of 0 phosphates? Does that mean that 0 phosphates and 10-20 nitrates plants cant use because no phosphates?

Do I dose Tropica fertiliser now that I have nitrates already or no??
That's right: if your plants are starved for one of the macros, they are limited and will take very little of anything else. This forum is replete with examples of moderate loadings (3-5ppm ...and more) of PO4 taming GSA. Note: this is GSA, not other forms of algae. You have two problems and both are sourced in PO4: limited growth and GSA.

Nitrates have been shown to pose no problem up to 100 ppm. @Greggz works wonders at 60 ppm (if I recall correctly). I've run PO4 in the 20 ppm area, as a test, with an NO3:PO4 ratio of almost 1:1. No issues. I'd be happy to do it again if someone will tell me what to look for regarding a negative reaction.

Chances are, when you put some PO4 into your tank, you'll see NO3 drop as plant consumption increases, so keep an eye on that. Your plants are sucking up every bit of PO4 they can find, which is why it's at zero despite your fish providing some and the Tropica providing some. You have a high-tech tank (according to your info), you need EI levels of ferts. Put the Tropica Specialised back in and dose it according to this calcualtor: Rotala Butterfly | Planted Aquarium Nutrient Dosing Calculator. Monitor the NO3 and PO4 as you may need to increase dosage if you see one of them becoming limiting.
Greggz and Greggz like this.
Deanna is offline  
post #15 of 164 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 08:31 AM
OVT
Carpe Diem
 
OVT's Avatar
 
PTrader: (144/100%)
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: NorCal
Posts: 7,468
To be pedantic, ratios do matter.

Before we get ourselves into a debate, please consider:

1) Balanced (i.e. 20-20-20) agricultural fertilizers are not common
2) EI is not a 1-1-1 fertilization method
3) KH2PO4 => K+ +H2PO4 with H2PO4- + H2O <---> HPO42- + H3O+
4) N and P role in eutrophication (reduced o2 levels) and algae blooms in lakes (i.e. West Point Lake in GA)
5) Phosphate role in acid-base balance and effects of high/low levels in blood

Or more down to earth: 50% bread + 50% butter. Do you eat all of it? If not, who gets to eat the leftovers?
OVT is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome