Potassium sulphate only during cycle - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-31-2016, 09:47 PM Thread Starter
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Potassium sulphate only during cycle

Hey guys, I hope everyone is well. I've recently set up a new scape and have had it running for 2 weeks now. I'm using a 6500K LED daylight with pressurised co2, amazonia substrate with estimative index dosing method. I had read on here to simply dose EI from the start during the cycle.
However a member of a local Facebook group had advised me to dose potassium sulphate only for the first 3/4 weeks until cycled to avoid algae blooms. I have started doing this over the past couple of days as the guy who suggested it is more experienced than me but noticed that the plants aren't looking as good.
Wondering if anyone here had success using the same method or if i should just go full EI dosing as normal.

Also, doing a 60% water change ever 3 days how long would you expect I might need to wait before adding fish and shrimp

Thanks in advance guys
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-31-2016, 10:04 PM
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You have plants that crave nitrates. Have you checked your nitrates? I found Spectricide Stump Remover is 100% KNO3. Good level is 10 to 20ppm.

So no fish in yet?

Personally I don't like these regiment rules of dosing. For when dealing with nature nothing is written in stone. Even 2 tanks setup similar will have different problems.
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-31-2016, 10:19 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Hilde View Post
You have plants that crave nitrates. Have you checked your nitrates? I found Spectricide Stump Remover is 100% KNO3. Good level is 10 to 20ppm.

So no fish in yet?

Personally I don't like these regiment rules of dosing. For when dealing with nature nothing is written in stone. Even 2 tanks setup similar will have different problems.
Thanks, yeah I've been testing before and a few hours after each water change, nitrates are at 10ppm the last 3 changes. Today, Nitrites were 1ppm with ammonia 0.5ppm. Those 2 have been bouncing up and down a bit.

Nope, no fish yet. I'm think of a school of ember tetras, some copper harlequin rasboras, a few ottos and one centre piece fish but can't decide on what to go for. Need something peaceful which won't eat shrimp or uproot plants.

I understand no 2 tanks are the same and that nothing is written in stone but I'm using this method so that I have each individual nutrient to hand so that when I see a particular deficiency/excess I can add more/less of that particular nutrient for the next mix.
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-01-2016, 01:49 PM
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I can't answer you're particular question because I am a debutante in the hobby, but I will tell you my own issue which is similar. Set up a 24 gallon cube a month ago; Flourite substrate with volcanic pebbles on the bottom, CO2 through a GLA regulator (1-2 bps)/Finnex Ray2 light both on 10 hours a day, full planting of dwarf baby tears up front, hair grass in the middle and variety of taller plants in back. Didn't use ferts for a week or two and my plants started to look like yours, yellowing and some spots on leaves etc. Based on recommendations on the planted tank forum, picked up clay capsules with macros and Thrive all in one liquid fert from NilocG. First couple of weeks didn't add anything but the clay capsules below the rooted plants (before planting). Couple of weeks in I added the Thrive as directed...next day hair algae hanging all over the place. Over the last two weeks I have altered dosing and CO2 (cutting back both), changed out the water and cleaned off the algae twice, used H202 on the large rocks and baby tears (under water) to oxidize remaining algae...and tried again. I'm now down to one squirt of Thrive (recommended dose is one squirt per ten gallons, so I'm now down to less than a half dose) and also cut three times a week as recommended down to twice. I can't completely get rid of the algae but is is less than before. Chemically my nitrites are spiking and have been for over a week, and nitrates are starting to rise as well. I"m convinced the capsules, in combination with the Thrive in the water column with plants that are not fully grown...is simply too rich for my tank yet...particularly in light of the fact the tank has yet to fully cycle.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-01-2016, 02:33 PM
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If I chose to dose per Estimative index, then I would dose accordingly.
Would take comfort that nutrient deficiency can pretty much be eliminated with this method.
Any variation's from the EI method, and it is no longer EI.
Too much light,poor CO2 distribution, and too much ammonia possibly being released by ADA substrates would more likely bring algae rather than dry mineral salt's dosed as per EI for your size tank.
Believe many suggest frequent water changes for first few day's/week's with some of the ADA substrates. (ammonia leaching)
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-01-2016, 03:29 PM
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Test for ammonia and nitrItes. The HC looks like it's being poisoned (guess)

The reason people only dose K in the beginning with AS is because it leaches ammonia for a while and also has a f-ton of other nutrients...except for K.

There's not a whole lot of plant mass in there, I seriously doubt anything is underfed right now. My guess is if anything needs increasing it's water changes. Again this is just a guess.


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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-01-2016, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burr740 View Post
Test for ammonia and nitrItes. The HC looks like it's being poisoned (guess)

The reason people only dose K in the beginning with AS is because it leaches ammonia for a while and also has a f-ton of other nutrients...except for K.

There's not a whole lot of plant mass in there, I seriously doubt anything is underfed right now. My guess is if anything needs increasing it's water changes. Again this is just a guess.
Yep, with fresh AS you don't need to dose N or P. There's plenty of that in AS.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-01-2016, 11:54 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burr740 View Post
Test for ammonia and nitrItes. The HC looks like it's being poisoned (guess)

The reason people only dose K in the beginning with AS is because it leaches ammonia for a while and also has a f-ton of other nutrients...except for K.

There's not a whole lot of plant mass in there, I seriously doubt anything is underfed right now. My guess is if anything needs increasing it's water changes. Again this is just a guess.
Thanks for the info. I've been doing 50-60% water changes every couple of days and testing a few hours after each change. Yesterday my parameters were:

PH 6.4
Ammonia 0.5 ppm
Nitrite 1 ppm
Nitrate 10ppm

I think the HC is okay I got it in vitro and most of the leaves have melted which seems to have happened with anything I've grown from in vitro containers. The new growth is looking strong now so I'm gonna give it a trim tomorrow when I have time and that should tidy it up a bit.
Could the AS be the reason my drop checker is now constantly yellow? Even 19 hours after my co2 switches off.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-02-2016, 03:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eskoflip86 View Post
Hey guys, I hope everyone is well. I've recently set up a new scape and have had it running for 2 weeks now.

Also, doing a 60% water change ever 3 days how long would you expect I might need to wait before adding fish and shrimp

Thanks in advance guys
I think you will be able to add animals in about four weeks. Sorry about the trouble you're having with the plants. Congratulations on the new setup.
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-03-2016, 02:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eskoflip86 View Post
I've been doing 50-60% water changes every couple of days and testing a few hours after each change. Yesterday my parameters were:

PH 6.4
Ammonia 0.5 ppm
Nitrite 1 ppm
Nitrate 10ppm

I think the HC is okay I got it in vitro and most of the leaves have melted which seems to have happened with anything I've grown from in vitro containers. The new growth is looking strong now so I'm gonna give it a trim tomorrow when I have time and that should tidy it up a bit.
Doing water changes makes the cycle take longer. Water changes are only necessary if ammonia goes above 5 ppm or nitrates are above 20. Here is more info on fishless cycling

I have found dosing with iodine help the plants grown in vitro containers. I use this iodine.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-05-2016, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Hilde View Post
Doing water changes makes the cycle take longer. Water changes are only necessary if ammonia goes above 5 ppm or nitrates are above 20. Here is more info on fishless cycling

I have found dosing with iodine help the plants grown in vitro containers. I use this iodine.
Hi,


Thanks for the info. I've never heard of using iodine but will certainly look in to it as the in-vitro are great value for money considering the mount you receive. If I can keep more than 20-30% alive that would be even better.
I've been doing so many W/C's due to the amount of ammonia that leaks from the ammazonia ad was advised by my lfs to do so. But now see where you're coming from, I want ammonia in the tank so the nitrites can develop.
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-05-2016, 08:21 PM
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Hi,
Thanks for the info. I've never heard of using iodine.

I've been doing so many W/C's due to the amount of ammonia that leaks from the ammazonia ad was advised by my lfs to do so.
I decided on this particular iodine for the label said it was liquid kelp. Buying it when I was ill I did not read all of the info on it. Decided to use kelp because Brightwell aquatics FlorinAxis has kelp in it. When I ran out I could not find FlorinAxis at a decent price.

It is really better to buy plants from this site or APC when you want a lot of plants

Considering what retail employees get paid you can't expect them to know what they are sell unless they have used the product.

I don't see any mention of the size of the tank. What is it?
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-05-2016, 11:35 PM Thread Starter
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The tank is 100 litres, I'm limited for space so can't go bigger
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