Questions for Edward on PPS-Pro - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 12:25 AM Thread Starter
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Questions for Edward on PPS-Pro

Hi,
You seem to have a lot of knowledge on the PPS system.
For about the last 6 months, I have been using the pro method on a 55gal tank. 5 ml macro on Mon,Wed,Fri and 5 ml of micro Tues,Thurs,Sat. Sunday is water change with no ferts. I got this schedule from the place i bought from Dosing Instructions, and posts here in the forum.
I have been looking at more threads lately, and have seen you stating to use both micros and Macros everyday, not every other day. The website I bought from originally stated to use them every other day, but has now changed to say to dose both everyday.
My supplier also says to use 1 ml/10 gal for the micros,where as you and the https://sites.google.com/site/aquati...r/home/pps-pro site say to use 0.1 ml/10 gal.

Is my supplier wrong at 1ml/gal micros?
I'm just looking for the proper regime to follow, as I am confused now.

Tank specs:
55gal with 48"Sat+ Led
medium plant load,mainly java fern, anubias, Bacopa, 2 amazon swords, small amount of crypts.
30ish cory cats of various breeds.
5ml excel daily.

Thanks

Last edited by Dazzlin Dave™; 04-08-2016 at 12:31 AM. Reason: added excel
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 01:20 AM Thread Starter
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Its actually w/c day for the tank, and here is the tank figures
ph 6.6
ammonia 0
N02 0
N03 20-30, closer to the 20
PO4 1
GH 3 drops/53.7
KH 3drops/53.7
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 01:49 AM
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Hi Dave
I am sorry for the confusion. There were some improvements done to the trace dosing, you can read about it here.


As far as the chaos in dosing some days this and other days that, I have no idea. Both PPS systems were designed to be dosed daily. Just like feeding fish. Feed fish, feed plants, simple.

You need to monitor either NO3 or conductivity to regulate the water parameters with water changes. Conductivity is more accurate. You don’t want to do too little or too much of water changes. Consistency is the key.

The proper dose for 55 gallon fully planted aquarium with CO2 injection is 5 ml of solution #1 macros and 10 drops of solution #2 micros. If you don’t use CO2 then the fertilizer consumption is going to be lower. This is why the monitoring is more important.


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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 04:15 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for replying Edward

I will take your method and try it out.

What do you use for a dropper for "the drops" with the micros? Just a standard "eye dropper"?
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 04:27 AM
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Hi,
Have a question about PPS-PRO:
When you say:
"You need to monitor either NO3 or conductivity to regulate the water parameters with water changes. Conductivity is more accurate. You don’t want to do too little or too much of water changes. Consistency is the key."
If my TDS meter tested water at 100 ppm higher at water change time, what percentage of the water would I change?
Sorry for the hijack
Thank you
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 02:28 PM
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Hi Dave
Something like this will do.


Hi heel4you
Before I answer your question, why did you decide on number +100 for water changes?
There is a variety of TDS and conductivity meters. If you want to find what the right number for your meter is then add 10 drops of solution #1 macros in 1000 ml and test it. Also test your water source. Now you have two TDS numbers and this is the range you want to maintain.

To find how large water portion (%) to change is dependent on three values.
TDS of water source
TDS before water change
TDS after water change

If you supply three of those four then I can calculate the fourth one. Or you can just change water and take a reading.


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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 04:58 PM
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@ Edward
I just threw out a number.
I thought that if the TDS reading went up by 100ppm it was time for a water change. Example: if the starting PPM was 100 and it rose to 200pm at weeks end, then it was time for water change. I just don't know what percentage of water change to do.
I did not realize that it was this complex. This would make a great calculator, like the fert calculator
I will do the testing and get back to you.
Thank you
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heel4you View Post
@ Edward
I just threw out a number.
I thought that if the TDS reading went up by 100ppm it was time for a water change. Example: if the starting PPM was 100 and it rose to 200pm at weeks end, then it was time for water change. I just don't know what percentage of water change to do.
I did not realize that it was this complex. This would make a great calculator, like the fert calculator
I will do the testing and get back to you.
Thank you
It is not complicated.
The problem is with using wrong equipment. You can see here. People have variety of conductivity meters, reading TDS in equivalent concentrations of NaCl, kitchen salt, KCl, potassium chloride, 442 and what not. They all give different results.

There is only one, common conductivity reading unit and that is in Siemens, µS for aquariums. Then the 100 rule applies. Every time I recommended a meter I said µS micro Siemens.

So, ppm meters workaround is to once read the 10 drops of solution #1 macros in 1L to replace the 100 rule.


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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 07:12 PM
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I have both ppm & µS outputs on my meter. Will be interesting to see how the numbers work out given the above information. Thank-you Edward.


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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Immortal1 View Post
I have both ppm & µS outputs on my meter. Will be interesting to see how the numbers work out given the above information. Thank-you Edward.
You have a good meter, would you help?
How fine gram scale do you have, and do you have RO?


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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 08:30 PM
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Hi Edward,
I don't use the Kno3. My tank test Nitrate at 10-20 ppm always.
I have a light load of fish in the 29 gallon:
6 Serpea tetras and one other small fish.
Heavily planted.
Here is what I have:
TDS READINGS

Tap: 95

Add macros: 125

Tank right now: 185

This is the TDS meter I have:

http://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-TDS-EZ-Measurement-Resolution/dp/B002C0A7ZY
Thank you and sorry for the hijack

Last edited by heel4you; 04-08-2016 at 08:51 PM. Reason: Edit
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks again Edward.
I'm going to try finding something local at the petstore.Possibly something for baby kittens/pups.
I ordered this TDS meter from amazon this morning:
http://www.amazon.com/Digital-Professional-TDS-EC-Temperature/dp/B00HAKAFGC?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s01It seems to be decent with the scales we need.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-08-2016, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward View Post
You have a good meter, would you help?
How fine gram scale do you have, and do you have RO?
Yes, happy to help. My digital scale is accurate to 0.1g
I do not have RO water, but I know the local fish store sells it for all the marine tanks.

FYI;
Distilled water = 1ppm @ 69f NaCI or 4µs/cm @ 69f
10 drops #1 macro into distilled water = 76ppm @ 69f NaCI or 150µs/cm @ 69f

My tap water = 192ppm @ 68f NaCI or 384µs/cm @ 68f
10 drops #1 macro into tap water = 245ppm @ 68f NaCI or 506µs/cm @ 68f

And while I am at it, using API test kit for GH & KH my tap water shows 7 °dKH or 125.3ppm and 12 °dGH or 214.8ppm

http://www.amazon.com/Digital-Professional-TDS-EC-Temperature/dp/B00HAKAFGC/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1460155328&sr=8-5&keywords=tds+meter


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Last edited by Immortal1; 04-08-2016 at 10:42 PM. Reason: more interesting information
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-09-2016, 12:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Immortal1 View Post
Yes, happy to help. My digital scale is accurate to 0.1g
I do not have RO water, but I know the local fish store sells it for all the marine tanks.

FYI;
Distilled water = 1ppm @ 69f NaCI or 4µs/cm @ 69f
10 drops #1 macro into distilled water = 76ppm @ 69f NaCI or 150µs/cm @ 69f

My tap water = 192ppm @ 68f NaCI or 384µs/cm @ 68f
10 drops #1 macro into tap water = 245ppm @ 68f NaCI or 506µs/cm @ 68f

And while I am at it, using API test kit for GH & KH my tap water shows 7 °dKH or 125.3ppm and 12 °dGH or 214.8ppm

Amazon.com: Digital Aid® Best Water Quality Test Meter. Professional TDS, EC and Temperature Meter. Three-in-One. Lifetime Guarantee on this Accurate and Reliable Water Test Meter. With Protective Leather Case. TDS (Totally Dissolved Solids): Home Im
Thank you for the info! Can we continue here, post #48?


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Last edited by Edward; 04-09-2016 at 12:31 AM. Reason: .
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-09-2016, 12:37 AM
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@Edward

What is the significance of the 10 drops per 1000ml. I calculated that amount to be 20x the daily dose (10 drops = .5ml in .26 gallons is equal to 400 drops or 20 ml in 10 gallons). Is that the threshold for too much nutrients in the water column or am I calculating incorrectly.

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