IRON FISH vs Seachem Flourish Iron. What better Iron supplement for planted tank? - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 09:53 PM Thread Starter
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IRON FISH vs Seachem Flourish Iron. What better Iron supplement for planted tank?

I have been researching this and it seem that there are 2 economical solutions to possible having a good iron supplement to the aquarium.

One of them is a commercial product from Seachem that is 1% iron in a larger bottle design for aquariums.

The other ones is a slow release iron fish design to add iron to the diet in 3rd world countries in which they cook soup and various food with the iron fish while the fish release small amount of bioavailable iron into the soup or other food. The idea is that if its safe for human use, then it would also be safe for aquarium use.

What do you guys think?

Seachem
Flourish Iron - 67.6 oz
67.6 oz. treats up to 400 gallons for 4-6 months.
Iron (Fe) 1.0%

Flourish Iron - 67.6 oz. | That Fish Place


VS

Lucky Iron Fish

"The Lucky Iron Fish is made from natural ferrous iron, which is easily absorbed by the body and is safe."

...." A Lucky Iron Fish releases low levels of easily absorbed (bioavailable) iron per use. On average it releases 70 g/g. To put that in perspective iron supplement pills can provide between 60mg-300mg of iron. Because our Lucky Iron Fish releases such a small amount of iron in each use users do not experience negative side effects."
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post #2 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 10:12 PM
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Iron is more readily absorbed in pH of 5 -6.5. Our tanks are probably not going to be at that level so I wonder how well any iron fert is absorbed by plants with this in mind. So, the lower your pH, the greater the iron absorption? My thoughts are, higher pH tanks may have issues because of this requirement unless the iron is specifically made to work in the higher pH aquaculture. I wonder if Flourish takes this acidity into account, and if there is a difference in the type of iron in Flourish, and the type available from cooking? I have never really thought about it.
Another interesting tidbit I copied:
'Acidic foods that have a higher moisture content, such as applesauce and spaghetti sauce, absorb the most iron. For example, one study published in the Journal of the American Dietetic Association found that the iron content in 100 grams of spaghetti sauce jumped from 0.6 mg to 5.7 mg after being cooked in a cast iron pot. Other factors that boost the iron content of foods include longer cooking time, frequent stirring, and using a newer iron skillet.'

Good stuff.
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post #3 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 10:18 PM
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https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/15...uid-ferts.html is a very good source for iron in two forms, liquid and dry. Dry is always going to be the best bargain, because you don't pay for water, just the nutrient.

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post #4 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 10:25 PM
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Plants need a lot of iron. The newest and most effective way to add iron is cast iron pan. They can be purchased for less than $20. What you want to do is break up the iron pan and put the smaller peices into your filter.

Flourish Iron is 99.5% water. A cast iron pan is 99.5% iron. It's cheaper in the long run.

Also you can hire an Iron Man.

Up to you though.

Welcome to the forum though. You'll find tons of knowledgeable members. They will be able to make guesses and assumptions about many things.
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post #5 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 10:27 PM
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Another Interesting blurb:
https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ss555

In certain soil situations, carbonate or sulfide compounds may form with Fe. Commonly in waterlogged situations, ferric iron is reduced to the ferrous state. If sulfates also are abundant in the soil, these become oxygen sources for bacteria and black-colored ferrous sulfide is formed
Where organic matter is present in soils, Fe may be present in its reduced state as Fe++ in the soil solution or adsorbed onto soil particle surfaces. Organic matter in soils plays a major role in the availability of Fe to plants. Biochemical compounds or organic acids (aliphatic acids or amino acids) and complex polymers (humic and fulvic acids) can form soluble complexes with Fe, or act as chelating agents and thereby increase Fe availability to plants (chelating agents are organic compounds that complex with Fe and help hold Fe in more soluble forms).
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post #6 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 10:48 PM
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My point is, that unless your tank is 6.5 pH or lower, it will be very difficult to get much iron to your plants. The same is true with terrestrial plants. Acidic soils = more iron uptake. Alkaline soils are tough on plants that require more iron. They die.

The use of RO water, co2, and higher temperatures are all helpful in keeping your tank water the lowest pH possible for the health of the plants.
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post #7 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 11:07 PM
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The iron fish is no different than a cast iron pan.

If I'm not mistaken, you need to cook with the iron fish, the heat and water will create some free floating iron ions. That's not going to work in your tank. As others have mentioned, acidic water will help in this process.


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post #8 of 42 (permalink) Old 03-31-2016, 11:28 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chinaboy1021 View Post
Plants need a lot of iron. The newest and most effective way to add iron is cast iron pan. They can be purchased for less than $20. What you want to do is break up the iron pan and put the smaller peices into your filter.

Flourish Iron is 99.5% water. A cast iron pan is 99.5% iron. It's cheaper in the long run.

Also you can hire an Iron Man.

Up to you though.

Welcome to the forum though. You'll find tons of knowledgeable members. They will be able to make guesses and assumptions about many things.
I like the idea in theory but there is another post about adding cast iron to an aquarium and I though the conclusion is that is was not " bioavailable" and could only provide iron if the roots happen to tap into the iron but if the iron was mixed into the water, the leaves would not be able to absorb the iron?

Is that not the case?

I like the idea of adding some iron to the tank and forgetting about it for a year rather then buying all this chemicals and lab equipment. That is going to get you flagged as the next unabomber or something. I read a story of a guy buying some fertilizer at the home depot for his farm and having the men in black showing up at his front door.

Have you personally tried this cast iron cut up into pieces and places in the filter technique ?

Thanks.

P.S. You should only do this with Chinese cast iron not the American made cast iron pans which I think are considered collector items and probably have a rich history.

75 Gallon community planted Aquarium. Pearl Gourami,Golden barbs, zebra, pearl Danios,black neon tetra, glow-light, denson barb, Rasboras, cherry barbs, fancy tail guppies, hachet fish, rosy tetra, flame tetra
29 gallon Gold fish tank(1 large fish)
55 gallon planted red cherry shrimp tank, otto, neon tetra, white cloud.
10 gallon betta tank
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post #9 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpaceLord View Post
I like the idea of adding some iron to the tank and forgetting about it for a year rather then buying all this chemicals and lab equipment. That is going to get you flagged as the next unabomber or something. I read a story of a guy buying some fertilizer at the home depot for his farm and having the men in black showing up at his front door.
I dose chelated iron to supplement that in the Microplex that I also dose. My "lab equipment" consists of a set of measuring spoons, from the kitchen drawer, a dosing bottle, which measures out one ounce portions for me, Fertilizer Dispenser | 500 mL (16 oz) | Green Leaf Aquariums and a cardboard funnel I made to make it easy to dump powder into the dosing bottle.

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post #10 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:06 AM
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If cast iron worked for our purposes, there wouldn't be any debate now. I'd rather buy a pound of chelated iron and make a solution or dry dose directly than rely on an iron fish made to supplement malnourished 3rd world societies. It might be fun as an experiment but I don't see any benefits of putting cookwear in our tanks for the sake of plant/iron uptake. Also, IMO using cast iron would just add unnecessary weight and water volume decrease.
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post #11 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:07 AM
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cut and past a cut an past....................
Quote:
Now, this relationship between oxygen and iron isn’t a full time thing. In reality iron is flitting between ferrous and ferric states, but the dominant state in high pH and oxidized environments is ferric- and this means that your plants cannot take it up.
These details important because they dictate how we examine the solutions.
Many practitioners throw rusty iron items into their systems falsely assuming that this will supplement system iron.

In a sense it does add to the reservoir of system iron, but not in a constructive or meaningful way. All this does is introduce more ferric iron to the system- a form of iron that was most likely already in plentiful supply.

Other practitioners intentionally develop dedicated anaerobic zones, where ferric iron will be reduced by the oxygen free, anaerobic environment to produce ferrous (corrected) iron. This is a more compelling approach, especially in low pH systems, but still does not entirely address the problem of getting the reduced iron ion (Fe++) through the oxygenated aerobic zone surrounding the plant roots (especially in high pH systems where hydroxyl ions are plentiful!)............... ect..............
Understanding Iron in Aquaponics

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post #12 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 12:14 AM
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Look for substrate with iron in it or I guess little bits of iron ore in your substrate. Plant roots can access this because it's usually more acidic in the substrate due to bacterial activities.


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post #13 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 02:03 AM
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I think we all agree on something. If you're ph is exactly 6.5, your fish will turn into iron. It will absorb the iron in your water. Meanwhile, your plants will turn into iron fish.
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post #14 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 02:31 AM
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This thread has gotten entirely too silly.

Starting small, keeping it simple..(?)
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post #15 of 42 (permalink) Old 04-01-2016, 02:51 AM
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It is turning into a diet and exercise thread: Cook the iron fish as part of the diet, and break up cast iron pans for exercise.
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