20 20’s 75 gallon - update 11-09-2008

[eyebeatbadgers]

Riccia is one of those plants, like moss, that once it's in your tank, it is hard to eradicate completely.

I don't mind it myself though.

[i love planted tanks]

nice tank cant wait to see it when it grows out more

[i love planted tanks]

cant wait to see it when it grows out more

[20 20]

Thanks, me too! Me too!

I might just pull the riccia, don't really know where I'd want it in the tank, and I think I have enough types of plants without it. Just a bit concerned about the algae at this point.

[20 20]

Pulled the riccia, but...

Algae and Snails and Algae, OH MY!

So, here's some pics:




You can see the green/brown algae on the rock, the brown hairy/slimey algae on the plant and the driftwood, there is also some very short black (and I think hairy) algae on the narrow leaf java fern, and what looks like diatoms on the wood and maybe on the substrate.

I'm currently dosing dry, and have been, for 9 days. KN03 (3/4 tsp) and KH2P04 (1/4 tsp) 3 times a week, trace Trace (1/4 tsp) 3 times a week. On water change days (once a week) I dose nothing. Tonight was the second water change in this tanks short life.

Pressurized CO2, with RexGrigg reactor. Red Sea drop checker is green.

4 wpg, 40 watt NO flourescent on for 13 hours, 260 watt PC's on for 11 hours.

Water parameters 30 minutes ago:
PH 6.9 (had been hovering around 6.8 before this)
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 40
Kh - 4
Gh - 5
Temp - 80

So, what I'm going to do:

- Just did a 50% water change.

- Cut photoperiod back to 8 hours of 260 watt PC's, 10 hours 40 watt NO flourescent.

- I've just received some true 4 dKH solution, so I'll 'reset' the drop checker with that instead of the tank water the Red Sea drop checker instructions say to use, and check the color in a couple of hours.

- If I can get to the fish store tomorrow, get 6 oto's.

- Put some lettuce in the tank tonight, and see how many of the snails I can catch with it by tomorrow morning.

Also, the water smells a bit (wifes not real happy with that), so I'm going to put the 'bio-chem zorb' (Rena's brand of carbon) into the XP3 and see if that helps.

So, if anyone feels like it, please 'critique' the steps I'm taking, and let me know if I'm on the right track, or if I should be doing something else or differently. ALL opinions greatly appreciated!

[lauraleellbp]

Any reason you're keeping your temp at 80? At those temps it's likely algae will grow better than most plants. 76-78 is average for most tropical plants and fish.

Your nitrAtes were sky high (40ppm is the level where the fish danger zone begins) so it's good that you did a PWC. You may want to think about reducing your N dosing.

I'm not so sure that you want to add a chem-zorb pad to the Rena; IMO the goal here should be growing your plants so they can outcompete the algae, not stripping you water column.

IMO you've got wayy to much light going into this tank. I'd drop the entire photoperiod down to 8 hours, and maybe only 2-4 hours with the 260watts... at least till you get the algae under control.

[20 20]

I'm not trying to keep it at 80, I'm trying to keep it at 78, and that's where it's been until today. Right now, after the WC, it's back at 78. Not sure why it went up today.

40 nitrAtes is sky high? (40ppm is the level where the fish danger zone begins) so it's good that you did a PWC. You may want to think about reducing your N dosing. I can cut back the N dosing, that's the KN03, right? I have been dosing 3/4 tsp 3 times a week, does cutting it back to 1/2 tsp 3 times a week sound like a good starting point?

I'm adding the chem-zorb pad to the Rena because of the smell of the water. Don't want to strip the water column, but what should I do about the smell? Will 'getting things right' (water paramters, dosage, etc) eliminate the smell?

I'm surprised that you think I've got way too much light, but you're not the first to say that. (Not that I did anything the first time I was told, eh? ). It's 4 wpg, I know that's high, but didn't think it was out of line for a tank running pressurized CO2 and dosing dry ferts. Trouble with alternating my "watt's" is that I've got two fixtures, each with only one on-off switch. A 40 watt NO flourescent fixture, and a 260 watt PC fixture. So you're recommending running the 40 watt fixture for 8 hours, and the 260 watt fixture for only 2 to 4 hours?

Oh, and thanks for the reply!

[lauraleellbp]

The tank may be warming up due to the warmer weather. Seems like you may have a 2 degree fluctuation on your heater with the weather, so I'd prolly move the thermostat back to 76 so the tank will stay in the 76-78 range.

Also the smell may go down just with a lower temp. Did your water change make any difference with the smell? How long has it been since you cleaned your filters?

Your dosing may need to go even lower than 1/2 tsp, but if you test your nitrAtes for a few weeks you should be able to get a better feel. Perhaps test right before you dose, and then again a few hours after you dose, and keep a journal? IMO 20ppm nitrAtes is a gracious plenty to keep in the water column.

I think that those Rena chem-zorb pads strip the water of phosphates... which will be a problem with your CO2 and lighting. Nitrates and phosphates need to be maintained in ratio with each other to avoid plant deficiencies and algae growth.

You might also want to read through BiscuitSlayer's journals for some pointers- I think he keeps his tanks around 4wpg. That kind of lighting makes for quite a balancing act...

[20 20]

Temp is around 78 today, I'll keep an eye on it, and if it goes up again, I'll adjust the heater down as you suggest.

Yep, smell is a bit better after the water change. I've never cleaned the filters. But then again, they've only been running for 10 days. I'll keep an eye on the nitrates, I've started the 1/2 tsp dosing. I do keep a journal, so I can get the trend. I'll also remove the chem-zorb pad. About the lighting, are you recommending to run the 260 watt fixture for only 2-4 hours, leaving only 40 watt's for the remainder of the 'daylight period'?

[lauraleellbp]

Oh I forgot that question, sorry- Yes, I'd try something close to that photoperiod at least till the algae is under control.

[20 20]

How DARE you forget one of my questions!

Actually, you've been very helpful, and it's greatly appreciated. Now, off I go to yank out the chem-zorb, and set back the light period.

And just to show you that algae isn't the only thing growing in my tank, a before-after set:

'Before', 05-03-2008:


'After', 05-14-2008 (first one with flash, second one without):

[eyebeatbadgers]

Those plants are cookin! Very significant growth, and significant lighting to go with it

I'll second lauralee's recommendations on the new photoperiod.

You can have success with high lighting levels, you just need to find the balance point of where the light is simply excessive.

[20 20]

First, a tip. For all of those as clutzy as me. Don't, whatever you do, when unhooking your XP2 (or 'insert your filter of choice here'), DON'T accidently hit the on-off switch on the powerstrip while reaching to unplug the filter AFTER you've already turned off the powerstrip and unhooked the tubing. Just don't... (because I just did...)


And second, a further lighting question. Which would be 'better', setting the 260 watt PC fixture to run for 4-ish hours, or remove two of the bulbs so it's putting out 130 watts and run it for 8-ish hours. It may make no difference at all, or one way may be better for both plant growth and algae 'inhibitance' (I just made that word up...). I'm most concerned about the growth of my HC, I want it to continue to spread along the substrate, not start growing vertically.

[eyebeatbadgers]

Good question!

Either will work, and I don't know which would be more effective.

I'm inclined to say running half power for 8 hours would be the best route, but the 40 watt tube with a 4 hour burst may prove more effective.

Sounds like it's time for an experiment on your part!

[20 20]

Just tested the water:

Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 20 to 40 (I hate these color coded tests!)
PH 6.6
Phosphate - 5.0 (year old nutrafin test kit)
temp - 80

I adjusted the heater down a bit, we'll see if the temp stays a couple of degrees lower. What should the phosphate level be? I have no idea.

Today was the first day with a 4 hour period for the 260 watt PC's, and 6 hour period for the 40 watt NO. Their was a great deal of algae on the wood, but it seemed to be 'clumped' a bit more than before. Also some on the substrate. I siphoned off a great deal of it with airline tubing, so we'll see how it looks tomorrow.