Substrates that you would NOT use.

[sawallace]

As much as I'd like to switch from Eco to silica sand, I'll probably stick with Eco, at least till I set up a new tank.


I'd never use kitty litter or large gravel.

[Wasserpest]

Originally Posted by SCMurphy

...what are you guys willing to struggle along with?

Ah okay now you are changing the subject

I like that bag of kitty litter that's still sitting in my garage. I know it's too cheap to be taken seriously, but it works well for me. Profile is good too, but yes, the orangy loamy color is a whole degree uglier than flourite.

I think my next tank is going to have a bottom layer of kitty litter, and a top layer of price-matched flourite. Perfect.

[bharada]

I really like my current mix of coarse quartz sand and Profile. It's very easy to plant in as the grains are smooth and the sand collapses on the inserted roots easily. The sand also has enough color diverstiy so that the Profile blends right in. Finally, 100# of the sand costs $10. I used 150# of sand and three 8# bags of Profile (specifically Schultz Aquatic Plant Soil) to do my 125g tank (okay, I also threw in a bag of Flourite ).

Now if I can only muster up the courage to swap out the plain gravel in my 40...

[plantbrain]

MPV turface is 12$, same as Profile for 3-4x the cost.
Mixed 50/50 with a good color matched gravel will make it tough to beat for performance/cost.
The gravel adds the needed weight.


regards,
Tom Barr

[scolley]

Please, what is MPV?

[Wasserpest]

Turface MVP, one of the Turface flavors, made by Profile Products.

It is suspected that some of the products by Profile (Schultz Aquatic Soil, Profile, Turface etc) only differ in packaging and price.

[AaronT]

It works just like Flourite in that it is initially inert, but has a very high CEC (cation exchange coefficient). In other words it attracts nutrients well and makes them available to the plant's roots. The problem with it is that it is a VERY butt ugly uniform orange color and is very light weight making it next to impossible to plant delicate or intricate plants in. Hence, the reason for suggesting to mix it with heavier gravel.

[aquaverde]

I've used Flourite, Onyx sand, Eco/Volcanite, small quartz gravel, Moon sand alone, Profile, and various layered concoctions including as much as a half inch layer of peat and leonardite as well as soil/leonaride/peat with Sean's unpatented terra cotta ironite soup.

I'm not interested in kitty litter. I also rejected some speedy dry. Don't like the mush. Also, in the future, the terra cotta will be left out of my soil recipes (see replanting pic below). All combinations grew plants well.

[aquabillpers]

OK, I'll dissent.

I would not use any substrate that would cost me more that $5.00 unless there was a clear reason to do that.

And even after two years of looking for one, no one has given me that reason.

The closest was that some of the "special" substrates present a lot of surfaces for bacteria to occupy, this enhancing the conversion of waste into plant nutrients. But 2mm - 3mm silica gravel would seem to do that, too.

"It looks better" is a good reason, but for $100 plus, not enough for me.

Some of them leach iron or calcium into the water column, but there are better, cheaper ways to add those - if they are needed.

I use soil/gravel substrates and also plain gravel augmented with chemical nutrients. The former works fine; the latter is still experimental for me but I expect good results.

There! <g>

Bill

[sarahbobarah]

I've had numerous tanks, but so far, the best results I've had have been from a mixture of peatmoss and black sand as the one inch bottom layer, with a layer of plain old Aquatic Soil (Schultz) one inch on top of that.

What would I not ever, ever use (again)? Sand. After cleaning one tank out, I nearly puked from the smell.

What would I be willing to work with or try? Hmm..... mud and old leaves.

[Talonstorm]

OK, I will go out on a limb here and say that I will never use flourite again. There are several reasons why (this is entirely my own experience and opinion and feel free to disagree). First, it was horrible to rinse, it took literally hours and I finally gave up figuring I would never be able to rinse it to my satisfaction. The first 5 washes produced something the consistancy of thin clay. After that, just a horrid reddish brown dust. Finally, I gave up and put it in the tank. Now everytime I move something I get a cloud of nasty red dust swirl through the water (hehe, my new eheim takes it out really quick though). The second reason is the color, I absolutely hate it. I plan on redoing the tank in the near future with something dark grey to black in color. Lastly, I saw very little if any improvement in plant growth after switching from plain gravel. I know there are many factors in this, but I do have sufficient light and nutrients and all else equal, I expected some sort of improvement. The only good feature I will say about it was that it holds the plants down much better than regular gravel. Anyway, that is solely my own opinion.

Tina

[gsg]

I won't ever use JBL Aquabasis Plus as a bottom fertilized layer again. Ir rockets your kH to the sky. Even when it's under a 2' inert gravel layer. Of course, they don't mention a single word in the bag about how it affects your water paremeters.

[Wasserpest]

Originally Posted by Talonstorm

First, it was horrible to rinse, it took literally hours and I finally gave up figuring I would never be able to rinse it to my satisfaction. The first 5 washes produced something the consistancy of thin clay. After that, just a horrid reddish brown dust. Finally, I gave up and put it in the tank. Now everytime I move something I get a cloud of nasty red dust swirl through the water (hehe, my new eheim takes it out really quick though).

I agree with you on the other reasons, like color is personal pref (once it is mosty covered with plants it doesn't look too bad) and no it doesn't grow plants better if lights and/or nutrients are not in line. However, that washing part... I think the trick is to add water very v e r y slowly, and let it stand a few days, then start up filtration, wait another day or two (what's a week if you want a tank that lasts many years). IME the fine stuff moves down towards the bottom, and a quick vacuuming takes care of the surface dusty stuff.

[bharada]

My one tank with Flourite was set up without any washing. I just poured it into the tank then filled it with water very gently. using a shower-head type nozzle on the filling hose worked well for me. My biggest problem wasn't with general clouding of the water column, but surface scum being deposited on the glass whenever I stopped the filling to plant/'scape.

I ended up running a diatom filter after I was done wiping off the glass, using a water pitcher as a surface extractor so that it (the surface scum) would all get filtered out. I have some picture of the operation on my site (under the 20g tank journal).

[Talonstorm]

To be honest with you, I have done my water changes without vacuuming the gravel since I put the flourite in. I was afraid of the mess it would make if I tried to vacuum it and I wasn't sure how to go about it without uprooting the plants. I did add the water very slowly when I filled the tank, I didn't get much initial clouding, but lots of nasty red scum on the glass and water surface. The clouding every time I move something now though is terrible. What a pain! I just prefer to use something different in the future and avoid the whole experience, lol.

Tina