Hikari 'Shrimp Cuisine' contains copper, why?

[Clare12345]

Can anyone tell me why Hikari has a new food for shrimps called Shrimp Cuisine and says:
"Contains copper which aids blood regeneration"
on their website.
Can anyone tell me if copper is good, or bad for shrimps?????

http://www.hikariusa.com/products/tr...mp_cuisine.php


Would copper hurt any shrimp reproduction?

[CKJ]

Yes copper is bad for shrimp!

I don't know about that food but I had made a mistake when I was in a hurry and bought something called shrimp pellets. It had copper in it so I didn't use it and realized it was made of shrimp not for shrimp!

Hope somebody else can help you about the food, I just know copper si not good for shrimp!

Good luck!

Cindy

[Clare12345]

Well this specifically says on their website:
Shrimp Cuisine™
A scientifically deveoloped diet for all types of freshwater ornamental shrimps especially caridina or neocaridina species.


So THEY think an amount of copper is GOOD for shrimp. Can anyone tell me why they think copper is bad for shrimps?

[southerndesert]

Copper is deadly for inverts even in small amounts, but the copper contained in fish food is claimed not to be problematic.... How many ppm is toxic to shrimp, I do not know, but avoid its use in any form. Coppers ability to kill inverts is also why it is used to kill Ick and some other problems in fish aquariums....

There is much info on this subject with a search here, online, or at other forums.

[omboocat]

Bill, what foods do you recommend on feeding shrimp?
Wilma

[Clare12345]

I really wanted to feed them foods with astaxanthin in it, which I have read really brightens the colors of fish and shrimp. Thats why I wanted to use that hikari brand. But I just realized the hikari micro wafers have astaxanthin also and not any copper, plus I already have some, so I will use those and algae wafers that my LFS recommended.

[CKJ]

Mine seem to really like the hikari algea wafers. Some of mine are very bright red anyway so my main concern was that they are happy and healthy first. But I have a 20 gal that has been running for over a year so there's plenty of bio film and algea so they probably don't even need the algea wafers but I do stick some in my tank every few days as some of my fish like them too!

I'm hoping their color mainly comes from genetics and maybe some day after i've done good with several generations i'll try breeding for color.

Good luck too you!!

[southerndesert]

Originally Posted by omboocat

Bill, what foods do you recommend on feeding shrimp?
Wilma

Hi Wilma,

I use Shirakura, Green Beans (cooked), Ken's veggie sticks and earthworm sticks, Spirolina, Tetra brand hermit Crab cakes, and various other things. I try to keep it varied, but if I had to choose one food it would be the Shirakura and I feed it the most.

[zoologist101]

I use Ocean Nutrition Shrimp Wafers – no copper. I also have a large tub of Red Astax food, which you can buy on eBay quite cheaply.

[omboocat]

Yes, I too feed the Shirakura, they do go for it and a Hikari algae wafer, micro wafer, and some of the meaty foods. All my shrimp so far have great coloring and appear to be very healthy.
wilma

[mistergreen]

crustacean blood is cooper based people.. they need cooper.

[Veneer]

Originally Posted by Clare12345

"Contains copper which aids blood regeneration" on their website.

To be a stickler for terminology, shrimp don't have blood or a closed circulatory system as in vertebrates; instead, a fluid called hemolymph sloshes about within the body cavity. The oxygen-carrying molecule in their hemolymph is hemocyanin, a respiratory protein which binds oxygen using two copper atoms.

According to this paper, decapod crustaceans (like shrimp) need around 31.3 to 38.1 μg (1 μg = 1/1,000,000 of a gram) of copper per gram of body mass "to meet the requirements of both copper-associated enzymes and the copper bearing respiratory pigment haemocyanin".

The line between need and toxicity can be fine (source), but copper is an essential trace metal required for copper-dependent enzymes in energy production, pigmentation, and so on.

We should distinguish this dietary requirement from the effects of the cupric ion (Cu+2). This is copper's major toxic species -- doing much damage to crustacean gills by inhibiting osmoregulation -- and results when copper sulfate medications are added to water (source).

[imeridian]

Wow, real information instead of just alarmist propaganda, very nice!

[fishsandwitch]

Originally Posted by Veneer

To be a stickler for terminology, shrimp don't have blood or a closed circulatory system as in vertebrates; instead, a fluid called hemolymph sloshes about within the body cavity. The oxygen-carrying molecule in their hemolymph is hemocyanin, a respiratory protein which binds oxygen using two copper atoms.

According to this paper, decapod crustaceans (like shrimp) need around 31.3 to 38.1 μg (1 μg = 1/1,000,000 of a gram) of copper per gram of body mass "to meet the requirements of both copper-associated enzymes and the copper bearing respiratory pigment haemocyanin".

The line between need and toxicity can be fine (source), but copper is an essential trace metal required for copper-dependent enzymes in energy production, pigmentation, and so on.

We should distinguish this dietary requirement from the effects of the cupric ion (Cu+2). This is copper's major toxic species -- doing much damage to crustacean gills by inhibiting osmoregulation -- and results when copper sulfate medications are added to water (source).

+1! This is totally correct!

I wish I could explain it as well as you

[Clare12345]

Yes. Seems to be true. I actually emailed Hikari yesterday and this their reply to me today:

"Here is a more in depth response from our research staff.

Yes, too much copper in the diet will kill the shrimp. But, shrimp need a very small amount of copper in their food for good health.

Not like us(humans), animals or fish, most shrimp use copper to deliver oxygen
inside of their body. For example, we (humans) have red blood cells which
contain hemoglobin. Hemoglobin contains iron metal (Fe), and this iron
actually absorbs oxygen at large and delivers this oxygen to every part of
body and organs.

However, in the case of Shrimp, they have Hemocyanin in their blood cells, with
copper metal. They use copper to deliver oxygen to their vital organs and circulatory system.
That is why their blood is clear or green color rather than red color like ours (humans).

We hope this additional information helps!"
End of email.