E. tenellus 'micro'
Planted Tank Forums
Your Tanks Image Hosting *Tank Tracker * Plant Profiles Fish Profiles Planted Tank Guide Photo Gallery Articles

Go Back   The Planted Tank Forum > Specific Aspects of a Planted Tank > Plants


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-29-2008, 11:08 PM   #1
Church
Planted Tank Guru
 
Church's Avatar
 
PTrader: (17/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 3,370
Default

E. tenellus 'micro'


Is this a different species than E. tenellus? I came across a post somewhere on teh interweb about it having been reclassified as "Helianthium tenellum" or something like that... is this true? Anyone?

Last edited by Church; 12-30-2008 at 03:35 AM.. Reason: correcting the name
Church is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-30-2008, 02:23 AM   #2
bsmith
Planted Tank Guru
 
bsmith's Avatar
 
PTrader: (278/99%)
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: St.Louis, MO
Posts: 9,059
Default

I had this plant before. It was MUCH thinner then normal Tenellus and had a slightly purple color to it in my tank with higher light.
bsmith is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 03:05 AM   #3
fishbguy1
Wannabe Guru
 
fishbguy1's Avatar
 
PTrader: (40/98%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: S.E Michigan
Posts: 1,203
Send a message via MSN to fishbguy1
Default

I used to have a bunch of it, but then it got algaefied.

I always called it E. Tenellus 'red micro'

It turned reddish purple in my tank 2.4ish wpg's with daily iron and excel dosing.
__________________
65 gallon low tech planted
fishbguy1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 03:45 AM   #4
macclellan
Planted Tank Guru
 
macclellan's Avatar
 
PTrader: (208/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 5,071
Default

Search for DanielSword's posts on the lastest taxonomical opinions on the Echinodorus and Helanthium genuses. Basically, all runner-type 'swords' are now Helanthium spp. That doesn't address your specific question though...

Either 'E. tennellus' or 'H. tennellum' is a highly variable species with two (or more) distinct sub-species or what is normally sold in the U.S. as E. tennellus is its own species and 'E. tennellus "micro" ' or H. tennellum' micro is another.

Regardless of the taxonomical situation, the two plants are sufficiently different such that they deserve separate names for aquaria. One grows quite tall (8" in my experience) and stays green no matter what, whereas the micro stays small (3") and has a maroon/purple sheen to it in good light.
macclellan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 06:04 AM   #5
bsmith
Planted Tank Guru
 
bsmith's Avatar
 
PTrader: (278/99%)
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: St.Louis, MO
Posts: 9,059
Default

I even thought they were referring to tenellus as angustifolius for a few weeks a few months ago.

They/we have no idea.
bsmith is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 01:53 PM   #6
macclellan
Planted Tank Guru
 
macclellan's Avatar
 
PTrader: (208/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 5,071
Default

E. angustifolius is different from E. tennellus...I have that too.
macclellan is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 02:48 PM   #7
Church
Planted Tank Guru
 
Church's Avatar
 
PTrader: (17/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 3,370
Default

Dang so how does one know what he is getting before ordering? (I know the answer to this question... poop.)

This is all very good information. Thanks guys. I'm going to look up Daniel Swords posts right now...
Church is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 03:55 PM   #8
HoustonFishFanatic
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
HoustonFishFanatic's Avatar
 
PTrader: (34/100%)
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Houston,Texas
Posts: 414
Default

You might find this article interesting.
Echinodorus tenellus

Bhushan
__________________
Checkout my blog AquaMusing

HoustonFishFanatic is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-30-2008, 06:37 PM   #9
Church
Planted Tank Guru
 
Church's Avatar
 
PTrader: (17/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 3,370
Default

^ That was some hella good reading... thanks!
Church is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-02-2009, 10:03 PM   #10
Daniel*Swords
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
Daniel*Swords's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Turku, Finland
Posts: 764
Default

Yes, agreed, Neil Frank's article is a very good read indeed.
However, back to the original question.
The E. tenellus 'micro' is exactly what is meant by Helanthium tenellum.
Though I haven't grown the plant normally sold in the US under the name E. tenellus I think it is safe to say that that in all likelihood is NOT Helanthium tenellum. It should be called H. bolivianum as all the other runner-making ex-swords are currently grouped under that name (save the H. zombiense which is so rare that you won't have it) - even the E. angustifolius. However, Samuli Lehtonen who published this new revision has publicly annouced his doubts about this.

He has said/ written that there probably are more than these 3 species of Helanthiums out there. It is unfortunately near-impossible to tell a) which plants belong to which species (due to their high morphological plasticity, cf. Frank's article) and b) which name should go with what species. Both questions should be resolved before one can say a name for a Helanthium sp. No one has studied these plants closely enough to say the last word on them.

That said, H. tenellum as per Lehtonen (and the revisionists before him: Haynes & Holm-Nielsen, 1994) is easy to distinguish with its 1-2 mm wide submersed leaves that get that reddish hue in proper light. It doesn't get higher than 4'' normally, usually less. If you were to grow that plant emersed, you would get flowers that differ esp. in size and somewhat in shape of the other Helanthiums (the others much more closely resemble each other).

Hope I managed to clarify the situation a bit there...
__________________
New reseach on the Echinodorus & Helanthium in cultivation published in 2011 in the article
"Watery Varieties: Aquarium Plant Diversity from Aesthetic, Commercial, and Systematic Perspectives."
Daniel*Swords is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:08 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Planted Tank LLC 2012