Dosing ferts safe for shrimp
Planted Tank Forums
Your Tanks Image Hosting *Tank Tracker * Plant Profiles Fish Profiles Planted Tank Guide Photo Gallery Articles

Go Back   The Planted Tank Forum > Specific Aspects of a Planted Tank > Plants


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-17-2008, 01:27 AM   #1
xerxes
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Posts: 7
Default

Dosing ferts safe for shrimp


I have a heavily planted tank which will soon be occupied by a few shrimp colonies. Normally, I dose my planted tanks with the Tropica MasterGrow formula which has been working out well. With the addition of shrimps however, I am looking to change my ferts to a different solution (or fert combination) which does not contain any copper compounds as these are toxic to freshwater shrimp.

Any suggestions for new dosing regimes or information sources that could help me get going in the right direction?

Thank you!
xerxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-17-2008, 01:35 AM   #2
plantbrain
Planted Tank Guru
 
plantbrain's Avatar
 
PTrader: (255/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The swamp
Posts: 13,334
Default

No, copper is NOT toxic except at higher concentrations, like us and most any critter. I routinely have dosed TMG at high levels and other traces with CRS's and Cherries and Amanos without any issues. They have bred just fine without any effort on my part other than good plant care.

Going to extrremes with shrimp or anything is not wise.
Keeping a particular nutrient low is noit the same are trying to eliminate it.

Folks go way too far and have zero clue about what is or is not a lethal concentration or a rick based concentration.

Not met a single shrimp keeper to date who knows where the levels of copper starts to cause any brood issues or adult lethality for any shrimp species in any reasonable test method.

Folks have been dosing traces like TMG and others for a long time without issue. That alone should tell you something.
Regards,
Tom Barr
__________________
Regards,
Tom Barr
plantbrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 01:56 AM   #3
connordude27
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
connordude27's Avatar
 
PTrader: (36/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Washington
Posts: 864
Default

i am 50% leaf zone by API is leathal even at half dose
connordude27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 02:40 AM   #4
xerxes
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Posts: 7
Default

Thanks Tom, I was really hoping that I would get an answer back like that. The TMG works really well in my experience and it is really quite convenient. The amount of copper in a TMG dose is 0.006% and that doesn't seem to me to be excessive... some degree of copper is going to be needed in the enviroment anyway, for the plants and even the shrimp themselves.

I think I will continue dosing normally with the TMG after the shrimp go in, and just keep an eye out for signs of trouble.

Thanks again!
xerxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 03:09 AM   #5
icom
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clinton,IA
Posts: 91
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by connordude27 View Post
i am 50% leaf zone by API is leathal even at half dose

why is that ? all Leafzone is,is chelated iron and potassium.. I dose it,and none of my cherries have cared in the least bit;they continue to munch away and have babies
__________________
Fluval Pimp #11

Filstar PIMP #140
icom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 04:18 AM   #6
Round Head
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Tacoma, WA.
Posts: 55
Default

Pardon my ignorance but what is TMG?
I am getting started with some shrimp and read alot that CSM can kill them.
Round Head is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 04:19 AM   #7
Green Leaf Aquariums
Sponsor
 
Green Leaf Aquariums's Avatar
 
PTrader: (86/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: SWAMP
Posts: 4,699
Default

CSM+B does not kill shrimp..
TMG= Tropica master Grow

Regards, Orlando
Green Leaf Aquariums is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2008, 04:10 PM   #8
plantbrain
Planted Tank Guru
 
plantbrain's Avatar
 
PTrader: (255/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The swamp
Posts: 13,334
Default

The real question is how much kills a shrimp and what is the KH of the tank water.

Dose makes the poison, not any amount of the "poison". Copper is a required nutrient for shrimp.

Like any drug, too much kills the patient, too little does not cure the disease.
KH is important when discussing any metal, in general, it's more toxic at lower KH's.

This is for free unbound metals though, chelation and other formulations make this more complicated. Chelation generally make the metals much less toxic per unit of ppm etc vs free metal ions.

A simple thing is to test the dosing, or for folks that already have been dosing and not losing shrimp to begin with, we already know it cannot be due to that.

there are 1001 and ways to kill critters in aquariums, we do not know them all or know the competence of every one we post with, however, this is not one of them.

Quite a few folks have these shrimps and dose these products at high concentrations without issues. For this to be the sole reason, we need to all have similar results.

I know I am adding TMG, CMS etc whatever chemical, and I am not having dead shrimp so I KNOW it cannot be due to that, it has to be some other issue.

Perhaps it could be a indirect thing, but it cannot be a direct issue as claimed.
Go back and look for another hypothesis why your shrimp are dying, have issues.

Regards,
Tom Barr
__________________
Regards,
Tom Barr
plantbrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
copper, ferts, safe, shrimp

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Planted Tank LLC 2012