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Old 02-22-2014, 02:04 AM   #46
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I actually sort of enjoyed the lecture, however much deserved. Nothing wrong with knowing the principles of classical composition (which evolved over a very long time), but I see no reason why these principles must be followed in designing for an enjoyable tank layout. His point that such a design might endure longer probably has weight, but that completely ignores the enjoyment many of us get by fiddling around over time.

The OP has some awesome rocks to work with.
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Old 02-22-2014, 03:54 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by tomfromstlouis View Post
I actually sort of enjoyed the lecture, however much deserved. Nothing wrong with knowing the principles of classical composition (which evolved over a very long time), but I see no reason why these principles must be followed in designing for an enjoyable tank layout. His point that such a design might endure longer probably has weight, but that completely ignores the enjoyment many of us get by fiddling around over time.

The OP has some awesome rocks to work with.
Why do you fiddle around with it? If I'm ever fiddling around with a drawing, painting, or stone arrangement, it's because it's not "perfect" yet. The elements of color, space, arrangement, framing, etc. isn't correct so fiddling is an attempt to balance it.

Here's an example of why balance is so essential:

If you attempt to remove any element in this mobile, no matter how small, even the last piece, the entire thing would collapse.

In terms of stone arrangement, if you were to attach the rocks to a mobile, would it be balanced or would it collapse? If it's perfectly balanced, you wouldn't want to fiddle with it. This is the key to successful stone arrangement.
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Old 02-22-2014, 04:40 AM   #48
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Why do you fiddle around with it? If I'm ever fiddling around with a drawing, painting, or stone arrangement, it's because it's not "perfect" yet. The elements of color, space, arrangement, framing, etc. isn't correct so fiddling is an attempt to balance it.

Here's an example of why balance is so essential:

If you attempt to remove any element in this mobile, no matter how small, even the last piece, the entire thing would collapse.

In terms of stone arrangement, if you were to attach the rocks to a mobile, would it be balanced or would it collapse? If it's perfectly balanced, you wouldn't want to fiddle with it. This is the key to successful stone arrangement.

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Old 02-22-2014, 09:22 AM   #49
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It's amazing the lengths some people will go to malign knowledge and promote ignorance.
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Old 02-22-2014, 03:10 PM   #50
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Although I agree there are some basic artistic principals that make viewing an aquascape a more pleasing experience for the viewer, your taking it too far. Firstly, most don't view planted tanks this way. At best, yes it's art, but for most it's a hybrid-type hobby between placing hardscape, growing plants and yes fiddling around with it. You really can't compare a living scape to a painting or that mobile you used as an example. The aquascape will change over time and things need to be adjusted not only for an artistic reason, but sometimes for the plant to live, etc. It's not static, it will change sometimes very quickly. You come across as preaching, but your choir is somewhere else.
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Old 02-22-2014, 11:01 PM   #51
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Plants grow, and in my tanks 90% of the composition is green. So it is always changing, so I fiddle. For a mountain scape with minimal greenery like the OP is attempting I think the balance of the hardscape becomes more important and prominent.

My aquariums are more like cottage gardens that have a hardscape that pokes through various places at various times and less like japanese gardens with formal structure that need to follow these formal principles more closely to be successful. So perhaps we can agree that these "rules" need not always apply in aquascaping. Heck, what with Rothko and Newman and bazillions of other more modern artists perhaps we can agree that the "rules" need not always apply to painting.

I love Calder's work, always and everywhere.
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Old 02-23-2014, 04:16 AM   #52
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I rather enjoyed the lecture, Solcielo -- though it may not been the appropriate place to debate and discuss art principles.

Solcielo does bring up interesting points about the classical art and I enjoyed his analysis of the woman and the dove.

To the OP: that all said, if it looks good to you, then it's art to somebody. Also, Rome wasn't built in a day.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:17 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solcielo lawrencia View Post
It's amazing the lengths some people will go to malign knowledge and promote ignorance.
I do agree with you on this point but real knowledge is to know the extent of ones ignorance.

Opinion is the medium between knowledge and ignorance....Plato

The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it's the illusion of knowledge....Stephen W. Hawking

I have no problem with trying to teach people of the rules and regulations of artist styles but the way you come across is more preaching than teaching. Please do share some of your work and I promise I won't be as harsh as you with my critique. I might have a different thought process when it comes to these rules you speak of so I leave you with this thought....

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Old 02-24-2014, 05:44 PM   #54
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...real knowledge is to know the extent of ones ignorance...
"It does not matter how large your circle of competence is. It only matters that you know where the perimeter is." - Warren Buffett
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