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Old 09-28-2013, 09:14 PM   #76
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But does it create a vortex (whirlpool) effect to pull down any protein layer that forms?
No vortex. It's kind of hard to explain but picture that horizontally, it creates a sort of circular flow and picture the circle being parallel to the front/back glass. It does create more surface agitation, but more gently, so I don't know how well it would do with surface scum. My guess is not well. To be honest, it almost looks like ocean waves way out, not breaking ones, just the movement of waves off shore. Again, subtle though.
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Old 09-28-2013, 09:22 PM   #77
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Sounds neat for everything submerged. My concern would be surface scum and dead spots due to reduced flow. Glad you like them though. I almost picked some poppy style myself.

I think your lighting is cool for now. I know both Current and Finnex are in the works for serious PAR pumping LED plant lights. With the increased PAR and full spectrum output, we should be able to suspend the lights while maintaining high PAR at the substrate level... kiss bulb replacements goodbye!
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Old 09-28-2013, 09:31 PM   #78
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Sounds neat for everything submerged. My concern would be surface scum and dead spots due to reduced flow. Glad you like them though. I almost picked some poppy style myself.

I think your lighting is cool for now. I know both Current and Finnex are in the works for serious PAR pumping LED plant lights. With the increased PAR and full spectrum output, we should be able to suspend the lights while maintaining high PAR at the substrate level... kiss bulb replacements goodbye!
I would have hated these pipes on my last tank, 20L "iwagumish" tank. With all stems, well, that is the reason I picked them.

I think the color is likely not a lighting issue. My guess is too much ferts, I have my theory on this, someone may be able to disprove it but with high co2 and excess ferts, I feel like the plants are able to grow faster, thus getting less light per inch grown. What I mean is if I reduced ferts, it would take say, twice as long to grow the same amount, thus getting 2x the light exposure for the growth. Not sure if that is at all true, just my theory. I will play around with ferts and lighting but I want to keep algae at bay and get things grown in before that.


As for new lights, I have been considering LED's for a long time. It seems only now (or what is coming out) will possibly sway me. My friend has AI LED's on his reef and the controlability is amazing. Until I can get something out the box like that, I likely won't mess with LED's. I am not sure it will be as cool on freshwater as the AI's are on a reef but still, I want sunrise, sunset, realistic moon lights and be able to shift the color spectrum on top of having good output. I am kind of picky after seeing how cool the AI's are and don't want to DIY.
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Old 09-28-2013, 10:10 PM   #79
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For the ferts... I'm not an expert on it but I've been told by someone who has a 220g Dutch-like scape with very colorful contrasting plants to keep the Nitrates low, Phosphates high, and increase the Micro dosing... what are your nitrates and phosphates reading at?

As for the lighting... SW definitely got more neat stuff, but it comes at a hefty price by comparison (most of the time). But since I like that extra control as you mentioned, I opted for the Current Sat+ lights... only thing is I had to get two and I'm putting them on the tank rather than suspending them to squeeze extra PAR out of them. But that's part of the reason why I had to have my Besta stand taller... I didn't want to look down on my lights and not stoop down so low to look into my tank. But all the controllability is there... I have different color temperatures, different modes like clouds, storms, moonlights, etc. They're super cool. I'll see how well two do in growing medium+high plants at 12" distance. Also, with the new Current Ramp Timers coming out, everything can be automated out of the box. No crazy Arduino coding needed! LOL

I'm thinking, Current's plant specific light will have a huge boost in PAR and the compatibility with the Ramp Timer. Not sure what Finnex's strategy will be.
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Old 09-29-2013, 03:06 PM   #80
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I am just doing EI dosing but I have yet to reset my autodoser for the shorter tank size so it's getting about 1.5 the amount. I use fountain pumps so every time I change tanks, I need to re do the setup as it's based off the head height of the pumps.

As for LED's, I think Current is developing something I may be very interested in. I do have backlit RGB LED's on this tank so it's similar to the Sat+. I just need to build a new background for it, hoping my brother may be able to laser cut something for me out of acrylic.
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Old 10-01-2013, 07:11 PM   #81
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So I did some cleaning this morning and decided that I just need to get rid of anything floating. I basically decided any plant I have not put in the substrate needs to go. Some things are not in the final places, especially on the right side which I have not yet thought out. Other than that, I replaced with I thought was R. wallichii with some other I got yesterday.

I am not sure what type of ludwigia is in the back right corner but it is not doing well. That area was very shaded. If it doesn't work out, I will replace it with ludwigia glandulosa, something I really want in this scape. Things are growing way faster than it appears, I am trimming regularly to try to develop a theme.

My concern now is it looks a bit contrived and more of a "stem farm" than something "flowing". Dutch style is contrived but I just feel it's a bit stiff. If I get the colors right, it may be fine, but I feel like I may have to pull some plants. It will take me awhile to get right, no big deal, just trying to get further in the process.

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Old 10-01-2013, 09:49 PM   #82
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Grandulosa is a pretty large, fast growing plant. Trade you L. repens x acuata fir your new walichii

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Old 10-01-2013, 11:22 PM   #83
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Grandulosa is a pretty large, fast growing plant.
Agreed... the plant can make your tank look small from how much room a single stem can take up. You should get some mini AR.
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Old 10-02-2013, 01:08 AM   #84
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Quote:
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Grandulosa is a pretty large, fast growing plant. Trade you L. repens x acuata fir your new walichii

v3
I know it is but I could find room. I will make sure you get the first trim of it which will likely be about the time I will be able to next meet up, especially if you are busy too. I can meet next week. If you want some quick, all about fish has it in good shape. Most there stems are nice, and basically anything else that doesn't stay around long.
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Agreed... the plant can make your tank look small from how much room a single stem can take up. You should get some mini AR.
It would be exactly one stem in the back corner, right side if I do it.
Alternanthera reineckii 'Mini' would be a good substitute for it in the mid ground. I often use the regular for a mid ground but it's not my favorite so I am trying to keep my spices down until I get everything I want. The mini has always been something I have had interest in. Will have to consider that.






OK, off to finally make my background.
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Old 10-02-2013, 02:53 AM   #85
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Finished up my background, I got to say, I love RGB LED's. I wish this system had a bit more colors to chose from, it has a ton but green and purples don't look very natural. I tried to take some pictures on settings I find to be attractive or natural looking. This would be way cooler on a natural style tank but it's fun to mess with. I don't see myself using it much, just will give my friends and especially my kids friends something to play with instead of trying to play "grab the fish".







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Old 10-02-2013, 04:32 AM   #86
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Grandulosa is a pretty large, fast growing plant. Trade you L. repens x acuata fir your new walichii

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Big as in Tall, it reaches the top at 18" < 1 week. It really needs a 24" tall tank, just like L. Cuba and such. L. sp red would be another choice. And Rotala macrandra .

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Old 10-02-2013, 04:44 AM   #87
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Big as in Tall, it reaches the top at 18" < 1 week. It really needs a 24" tall tank, just like L. Cuba and such. L. sp red would be another choice. And Rotala macrandra .

v3
I had it in my 29 and liked it. It wasn't hard to keep and had great color. Not sure that I will use it, rotala macrandra will work there. I am using ludwigia sp red as a midground since it colors up more easily than most. It just is hidden on the left side for now. Not great color but pretty red for 3-4 in tall.
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Old 10-09-2013, 02:18 AM   #88
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Sooo, update time. Anytime you go out of town for 5 days with a fairly new tank, it's always interesting to come home to. Algae was not bad, just a bit on the glass. I do have a lot of brown stuff that looks like mulm, I don't have fish so I am not sure what it is. My guess is that it from some of my plants that didn't do well from transport.

I am going to have to rethink my layout. It just looks like a stem farm to me. When you are dealing with a lot of plants you have never grown, it's hard to predict growth habits.

Color is non existent. I will have to talk to some of my friends about this (OVT). I just bought some Rotala macrandra, rotala macrandra v. 'narrow leaf' (R. Magenta) and Nesaea red. I find the first two hard to grow, the last I have never tried and seems even harder. Hopefully they survive. I may need to take a trip to WC and drop some stems off at OVT's to make sure I have a supply later, haha.

Anyway, things are going kind of alright. I can up both the CO2 and the light but want to stock before I get to far as I need to get some fish out of my 6 gallon that is way over stocked from my 20 long break down.

Here are the (green) pics, will trim tonight most likely:
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Old 10-10-2013, 12:29 AM   #89
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Ok, I got my new plants in. OVT, please come by and take a few stems as I do not need this much and they are so nice. I would hate to get them to you later not looking as nice.

Added R. macrandra, R. macrandra "narrow leaf" (R. Magenta) and Nesaea. I am very surprised how nice they look giving the transport home from LA. Nature Aquarium is a very nice shop, anyone in SoCal should make a point to go there on a regular basis.


I think I said it before but it's going to take awhile to see this really turn into something. Add the fact only a few of my plants are coloring up decently, not well, longer. I think this next update is pretty representative of what I want, just not at all there yet. I am finally finding a rhythm in scaping this. Getting the horticultural side down, not so much.

The sad part is I have to ditch some plants that I just don't like. That's part of a tank like this. I ditched one that I didn't feel comfortable giving away, have a few I am not sure will work but can grow in the tank for now.

That said, still working it out but improving as I go (I think). Excuse the mess, we are still getting wedding presents and they always end up next to the tank










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Old 10-11-2013, 07:27 PM   #90
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I've been meaning to ask you, what are those two clips on the back of the tank with wires coming off of them?
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