CRS SS - SSS dying off one by one .. seeking experience advice
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Old 08-29-2013, 09:42 PM   #1
blue planter
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CRS SS - SSS dying off one by one .. seeking experience advice


hi all,

I dont post much but I go through the forums posting quite often on planted tank. I am seeking some advice in regards to why my SS ~ SSS grade CRS keeps dying off one by one. last year around the same time I started with 6 SS grade and grew the colony to about 20 SS~SSS grade CRS; today I have 6 left again. for the past 2 month i lost about 5 adult CRS.. I dont know the reason this is why I am seeking help.

I often see them get berried but for the past 7 month; eggs either have been dropped or the shrimp just end up dying.. they are molting however is molting in 1 full piece fashion (I read some where that this was bad ? suppose to molt in separate pieces?)

just test my water parameter:
ammonia = 0
ph= 7.6
nitrate = 0
Nitrite = 0
GH = 2
KH = 3
TDS = 48
temperature runs between 70-73F
I dont pump co2 however pump air only with air stone.

I am using fluval shrimp stratum substrate (going for a year now), have one giant piece of ada african with some attached java fern and java moss.

filter wise- its just the build in internal filter that came with the eheim tank. (see picture below)

I do weekly water changes of 15% -20% + top off daily because the cooling fan is on about 6 hours a day due to evap. I use RO water only and when I do perform water change i add 1 tsp of kent's RO right to bring the water chemistry back to normal status.

here is what i have found and cant seem to figure out why (and perhaps is the main reason contributing to why my shrimps are dying off slowly but surely; they're not eating much and dont move much) : PH out of the RO water jug is 6.4 .. however ph parameter in the tank as I test weekly remains 7.4 to 7.6. I dont know what is causing the PH to rise ? I dont know whether or not the substrate has lost its buffering ability or the drift wood is causing the ph rise. even if the substrate has lost the buffering ability - the RO water I put in is 6.4 why does it remain at 7.6 even after I do the water change weekly.

im all out of ideas.. any suggestion or recommendation in to what Test I should be performing to solve this problem is greatly appreciated!!!..
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:05 PM   #2
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Bump. A better authority than I will respond. If it was my tank, I would work on lowering kh to a level between 0-1. I would also raise the gh to about 5.
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:12 PM   #3
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The gh and tds are low. Try 5gh and lower the kh. I had a hob filter but still dying one by one until I added a sponge filter and all living good.
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:12 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meppitech View Post
Bump. A better authority than I will respond. If it was my tank, I would work on lowering kh to a level between 0-1. I would also raise the gh to about 5.
thanks meppitech,

in regards to the GH level; yes i often forget to add RO right when I perform water changes.. I am thinking to double dose next water change or perhaps just add one tsp now and test water parameter tomorrow..

perhaps is the seiryu rock ? I happen to stumble upon this thread.. so I decided to give it a try; took them out put vinegar on them and its sizzling!

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=82249

thoughts or other tips anyone? or any other suggestions, comments ?

thanks!
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:17 PM   #5
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Your gh and tds is way too low. You need to have gh 5-6, and tds of at least 100. I'm actually surprise your shrimps survived so long at such a low gh. Shrimps don't generally live long in low gh, because they generally hit molting issues and die.

If you are using ro, your kh should be zero, if your remineralizer is raising your kh, you might want to switch to a new one like salty shrimp.

Don't be so concern about the ph for now, your priority is the gh and the tds. Raise it! Worry about your ph, once you fix that. (While they prefer and breeds better inlower ph, they are perfectly fine in ph 7ish. They won't die)
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:27 PM   #6
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The seiryu rock is likely raising your KH. I don't know if Kents RO raises KH as well as GH though (you could test your remineralized water before adding it to the tank though).

I agree that you want to lower the KH to basically 0 and raise the GH to 5. I would recommend using Salty Shrimp or Mosura Mineral Plus, I have used both of those with great success.
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Old 08-29-2013, 10:29 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aluka View Post
Your gh and tds is way too low. You need to have gh 5-6, and tds of at least 100. I'm actually surprise your shrimps survived so long at such a low gh. Shrimps don't generally live long in low gh, because they generally hit molting issues and die.

If you are using ro, your kh should be zero, if your remineralizer is raising your kh, you might want to switch to a new one like salty shrimp.

Don't be so concern about the ph for now, your priority is the gh and the tds. Raise it! Worry about your ph, once you fix that. (While they prefer and breeds better inlower ph, they are perfectly fine in ph 7ish. They won't die)
Thanks guys, I am taking notes and at the same time taking some action..

Aluka, actually most of them died.. only the strong survived :X .. let me try to use the RO right .. if it raises the KH then i guess i will have to try salty shrimp or shirakura CA+

thanks!
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Old 08-29-2013, 11:16 PM   #8
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Honestly, I think is the fluval substrate. It not as good at buffering as ada. The ph rise is the result of the water agitation from the filter. Your best bet right now is to a add humid acid or a new layer of substrate.
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Old 08-29-2013, 11:41 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipoi84 View Post
Honestly, I think is the fluval substrate. It not as good at buffering as ada. The ph rise is the result of the water agitation from the filter. Your best bet right now is to a add humid acid or a new layer of substrate.
should i just add some eheim peat pallets to the internal filtration system? i am wondering how that would effect the water parameters as it is now..
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:08 AM   #10
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Your water is definitely not right. Your colony numbers should be up over 100 minimum in a year. Like others said, bite the bullet and replace the fss with a good buffering substrate, use RO and remimeralize with a shrimp specific product and get rid of rocks that will raise your kh. You want gh of 6 and kh of 0-1.

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Old 08-30-2013, 12:31 AM   #11
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The things you have not considered are harming your colony.

Things that stand out. Inadequate filtration, poor oxygenation, lack of bacteria supplementing, drastic ph swings. Active substrate is helpful but not mandatory. Fluval Shrimp stratum is not an ideal choice for substrate. One may actually have better luck with regular clown puke gravel from petco.

stability is key. weekly water changes isn't inline with that. Another thing worth keeping an eye out for is planaria or hydras. they have been known to kill shrimp over time. Hope your colony recovers soon.
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:39 AM   #12
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TDS : too low
GH : too low
KH: too high
PH : too high

Last edited by jimmytruong87; 08-30-2013 at 01:07 AM.. Reason: :)
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Old 08-30-2013, 01:08 AM   #13
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All have said good stuff you need to get your kh down to 0-1. Your gh to 4-6. Your ph to 6-7. Your tds to around 140. Make sure your temps are not much more than 74-76

Also if you have Seiryu stone it will raise kh and ph. It is fine with neos by crs are allot more finicky.

I think your shrimp are dieting because they are having a hard time molting. There shells are not dense enough to shed. What do you feed are you feeding foods rich in calcium or supplement with some other form of calcium?

I would run a air stone in your ro water and do that for 48hrs and check ph and all others after that.


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Old 08-30-2013, 01:25 AM   #14
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Your TDS and GH are a bit low, but I don't think that's the main reason of shrimp dying They are low but you're not the only person keeping CRS in that kind of parameters, other people I know doing that are all very successful, even including some world famous breeders.

However, your KH is what's increasing your PH, and Kent RO Right does increase KH. Together with a substrate that doesn't buffer the PH low enough, your shrimps are having a hard time surviving.

From Kent RO Right product description:
Quote:
Kent R/O Right Water Conditioner is a specially formulated mixture of dissolvable solids ..., together with a small amount of carbonate alkalinity (KH) to reproduce artificial river water (most aquarium fish are river fish).
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Old 08-30-2013, 01:29 AM   #15
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Quote:
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Your TDS and GH are a bit low, but I don't think that's the main reason of shrimp dying They are low but you're not the only person keeping CRS in that kind of parameters, other people I know doing that are all very successful, even including some world famous breeders.
I highly doubt world class breeders keep shrimps in gh 2 and tds 45 o.o.

Honestly, I am still shocked they lived for a year.
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