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Old 01-26-2013, 02:02 AM   #46
Elliriyanna
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I have been keeping his ammonia very low But why so much information on the fishless cycle when I am doing the fish in cycle?
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:12 AM   #47
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Because you want to start a new tank soon.

Because you may want some background info about how to grow these bacteria.

Because the 'fish-in' cycle is no longer a valid way to grow bacteria.
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:29 AM   #48
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I don't have the attention span for all these long posts ... I am A.D.D. to be honest I just skim them i cant get my mind to settle on them so they don't help me. I do appreciate it and I know fishless is way better but if I felt I could do fishless ( Or even get my hands on ammonia) I would be doing it with my current tank.


And ... Now I feel like I am going to throw up because nerves and conflict ...
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:58 AM   #49
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Dude, don't stress . Diana also gives very valid information on yet another way to do this. Just go with your gut, have a great time , and expect to make some mistakes along the way. Remember, over the course of another 4-6 weeks or so, you'll have the same thing anyway. You're half way there! Pick a method (fish-in since you already have one) and run with it.

I also think I just set the record for the highest word/smiley ratio!!! (time to take that off my bucket list!)
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:06 AM   #50
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LOL you are awesome Wookie :P

I have a few months before the next tank will be set up ( Last thing I want to do is move in the winter with a delicate species)

I am still a little confused but thats normal lol I have a lot going on right now.
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:10 AM   #51
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When this sort of cycle is complete you have grown only a small colony of bacteria, enough to handle the waste from the fish you used to supply the ammonia. To add more fish you will have to go very slow, and allow the tank to cycle over and over again. Each cycle will go faster, once there is a starter colony, but you are still exposing the fish to toxins. Fish that are exposed to ammonia or nitrite are stressed, injured, and may never fully recover.

Diana, I respectfully disagree with this statement. The pre-cycled accumulation of ammonia, creates a "virtural bio-load" which is quite a bit larger than what your cycle fish produce on an ongoing basis (otherwise it wouldn't stress the fish), thus spiking nitrites higher, thus giving you a rather large colony of bacteria. Before your bacteria bed is established, it accumulates to high levels because it gets "backed up".

Now, once that spike as occurred and fallen, the bacterial population will start to dwindle based on it's ongoing nutrient source being significantly less, but that's the same regardless of what method you use, thus having to add fish slowly as you move on is the case in with both methods unless you add a large bio-load immediately after the cycle "explosion", but that comes with it's own set of problems.

Of course, if you were talking about using the fish-in method while keeping levels low through water changes, then I've just negated my own comment, because you'd be exactly right (still the same in the end though)
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:12 AM   #52
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Hey ... Did you ever go check out Finn? His tank isnt done yet but he has his own thread now
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:24 AM   #53
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Diana was refering to doing a fish in cycle and keeping the parameters low enough to not harm the fish too much. That is also exactly what I would do if using a betta to cycle a tank. Bettas are so prone to fin rot that I would keep the ammonia and nitrite quite low if using one to cycle. The bacteria will still multiply, albiet a bit slower, but the fish will be better off in the long run in my opinion.

Non sudsing ammonia can almost always be found at any Dollar Store if you want to use it with your fishless cycle for the next tank. I would recommend it since the bioload of the next tank will be larger than the bioload of this tank and even using a seeded filter you will need to increase your bacteria colony somewhat before stocking the tank. Of course, you can do that using fish food as well but ammonia is not as messy.
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:38 AM   #54
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Why would the bioload be higher? ADF have a very low bioload and it will only contain two...

I really thought I could just use the filter in this tank and put some gravel from my existing tank in the other one ...

I actually have a full thread on that if you wanna look
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:04 PM   #55
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I would assume the bioload is about the same as that of a similiar sized fish such as a betta. If that is a correct assumption then you will have double the bioload in the 2nd tank as in the first.
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:13 PM   #56
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I am pretty sure ADF bioload is lower than a Betta's Bioload... From everything I have read they aren't messy at all but its not like I can compare exact bioloads.

I would say the two frogs have almost the same Bioload as a betta

If the above is the case would putting the second filter in the first tank not work?
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:40 PM   #57
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You can buy "Dr. Tim's Aquatic Ammonia" on Amazon for less than $10. Seems like a lot to pay for ammonia, but you'll know there's nothing bad in it and that little bottle will last you for many tanks.

No matter what you do, there's no guarantee that the cycle in the second tank will be adequate. If you have the ammonia, you can transfer the seeded material and then add ammonia in order to see if the cycle is in place and make sure it can handle the load. This way you will not have to subject any fish or frogs to any harmful conditions.
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:55 PM   #58
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I will look and see if I can find ammonia ...


So if I stick the filter in the 1st tank for 4 weeks then put it in the 2nd tank and add ammonia daily and test until it reads like a cycled tank I should be fine and just keep adding Ammonia until I get the frogs? ( I dont like the idea of having added chemicals to my frog tank though )

I will look in our dollar store when I am planning to cycle the 5 gallon.
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:59 PM   #59
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Correct. The ammonia you are adding to the tank is no different than the ammonia that is produced as waste from the fish and frogs.
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Old 01-26-2013, 05:05 PM   #60
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So as long as I am careful choosing ammonia I don't have to worry about potential chemicals harming my frogs

I must say ... Its much easier to be an ignorant, Negligent owner lol ( Not that I would EVER go back)
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