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Old 10-13-2005, 05:56 PM   #31
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Dosing 3x a week is just a smart plan for providing everything the plant's need throughout the week, I will draw up an example of a plan that I myself and many others use, and post it on front page...
Dosing all at once, seems to create a small problem between Iron in Trace, or Fe, and Phosphate, so dosing all at once is not highly recommended, that is fine for a lowtech no C02 tank, but for highlight C02 injection, it seems to work best, doing odd even days on mAcro's/mIcro's..

Will have it drawn soon...

Thanks for the question!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GraFFix
Just a quick question...

When you are dosing, I see most everything is 3X a week. Do you guys dose different things on different days? Or is it ok to just does everything at once? basically I dose but im not on any type of schedule. I do try to do it every other day, but having such a high light tank Ive been noticing I could be doing better with dosing.

Just wondering if there any any downsides to dosing all at once or alternating dosing for different days? Like trace's/Iron on monday, KN03 and P04 on tues, traces/iron wed..etc
I mean it would be simpler to just does everything at once 3x a week. But im not sure if thats the best plan...I downloaded that text file and will be using it to get a schedule down. hopefully the greenspot will go away once i get things organized

thanks for the post and the text file
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Old 10-13-2005, 06:15 PM   #32
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Personally I find a daily routine easier to keep than one that is every other day.
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Old 10-15-2005, 04:50 AM   #33
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It looks like I have been under dosing traces? The sticky says to mix 1TBS of CSM+B in 250 ml of water. Greg Watson's web page says to mix 1TBS in 500 ml of water.

I have been adding 10 ml from the ratio GW recommened. Hmm I just mixed up some more solution with the more concentrated recipe. I will give it a try.

I have some Baby Tears and some Blyxa Japonica that are just haning on. They are not really growing or dieing just kind of dorment. I hope increasing the traces will get them going.

Rick
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Old 10-15-2005, 01:56 PM   #34
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I was looking and i thought iron was a trace element? Looking at his dosing he has traces seperate with iron so what are traces then?


Here is what i dose for my 125 gal tank does this look like a good start.


1.5t of nitrates kno3 3x week
1.5t of mono potassium phosphate kh2p04 3x week
.5t of plantex csm+b plus iron 3x week

Is their something i need to add take away or does this look good? Also i quit dosing the iron right now because im having a bba outbreak so im dosing flourish excel right now to get rid of if 25ml everday.
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Old 10-16-2005, 12:11 AM   #35
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Default can some one please help me with this

OK I have a 125 gallon tank heavily planted
Following this sticky I would dose:
kno3 1.5 tsp 3x wk
kh2po4 .5tsp 3x wk
k2so4 .25tsp 3x wk
trace 30mil 3x wk

OK here is where I am confused and need help
according to chuck's calculator this would give me
Nitrate 32.66 ppm I know I am shooting for 20-30 ppm so will back this down to 1.25 tsp which will give me 27.22ppm
Phosphate 10.62 it shows my target should be 1 ppm
Potassium 9.97 it shows target should be 20ppm

Am I missing something ?
From my reading I feel I have the KNO3 down but I am really confused on the Kh2po4 and k2so4


any help would be appreciated
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Old 10-16-2005, 09:31 AM   #36
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Ogsy I came across this, I hope it will give adequate answer's for you.

Nitrate (NO3) from KNO3 (Greenlight Stump Remover)

Greenlight brand stump remover is pure potassium nitrate (KNO3).

MWs: Potassium Nitrate (KNO3) = 101.1, NO3 = 62, therefore NO3 is 61% of KNO3

From consensus on the Aquatic Pants Mailing List it is recommended to use 10 ppm KNO3 twice per week.

10 ppm NO3 = 10 mg/l NO3. Since KNO3 is 61% NO3 you need 10/.61 = 16.4 mg/l of KNO3

In 10 gallons there are 3.77 x 10 = 37.7 liters

For 10 gallons you need 37.7x16.4 = 618 mg of KNO3

To get 10 ppm NO3 from KNO3 in each 10 gallons of water add .62 grams of KNO3.

So for 100 gallons add 6.2 grams KNO3

For 75 gallon tank

For 10 ppm in 66.2 gallons (75 gal tank) use .62x(66.2/10)= 4.1 grams of KNO3 (twice per week)

For 125 gallon tank

(105.7/66.2) x 4.1 g = 6.5 g

Use 6.5 grams of KNO3 twice per week for the 125 gallon tank.

Use 2 x (1/2) teaspoon (6.2 grams = 9.5 ppm) twice per week.

Phosphate from Fleet Enema

For Generic Fleet Enema (assume anhydrous)

MWs: Monobasic Sodium Phosphate (NaH2PO4) = 120, PO4 = 95, therefore PO4 is 79% of NaH2PO4

Dibasic Sodium Phosphate (Na2HPO4) = 142, PO4 = 95, therefore PO4 is 67% of Na2HPO4

Monobasic Sodium Phosphate (NaH2PO4) = 19 g, .79 x 19 = 15.01 g PO4

Dibasic Sodium Phosphate (Na2HPO4) = 7 g, .67 x 7 = 4.69 g PO4

Total PO4 is 19.7 g in 133 ml of water. Or 148 mg/ml

For Generic Fleet Enema (assume hydrated compounds)

MWs: Monobasic Sodium Phosphate (NaH2PO4H20) = 138, PO4 = 95, therefore PO4 is 69% of NaH2PO4H20.

Dibasic Sodium Phosphate Na2HPO4H20 = 160, PO4 = 95, therefore PO4 is 59% of Na2HPO4H20.

Monobasic Sodium Phosphate (NaH2PO4H20) = 19 g, .69 x 19 = 13.11 g PO4

Dibasic Sodium Phosphate (Na2HPO4H20) = 7 g, .59 x 7 = 4.13 g PO4

Total PO4 is 17.24 g in 133 ml of water. Or 130 mg/ml

According to John Fitch, Fleet says that the concentration of PO4 is 131.36 mg/ml

Potassium (K) from Muriate of Potash (KCl), 0-0-60


How much KCl is needed to make 5 ppm K in a 100 gallons of water?

KCL, Muriate of Potash. The bag says 0-0-60. It also says K2O=60%. MW of K=39.1, of O=16. K2O is 83.0% K. That means the bag is .6 x .83 = 49.8% K.

5 ppm = 5 mg/L

You have 100 gal x 3.77 = 377 liters

For 5 ppm K you need 5 x 377 mg K = 1885 mg K

1885 K/.498 = 3785 mg KCl

To raise K 5 ppm in 100 gallons add 3.9 grams of KCl.

Chemical Computations

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oqsy
I have a request. could someone convert the above table for use with the following macro sources? (these items are locally available for myself and many other hobbiests where the greg watson stuff would require s&h charges)

NO3: Green Light
P: Fleet
K: KCl powder / pellets

I know Sulphur is covered by the K2SO4 many use for dosing, but is it necessary to add it to the above items in conjunction with Flourish or TMG, or should "average" tapwater contain enough of sulphur to keep plants happy?

Oqsy
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Old 10-16-2005, 10:10 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbysl
I was looking and i thought iron was a trace element? Looking at his dosing he has traces seperate with iron so what are traces then?
They are both Trace, mIcro nutrient's,
Flourish, TMG, KB, Plantex CSM, CSM+B, CSM+Bw/ extra Iron, they all have iron, some more than other's, Flourish, is the crme de la crim of them all, then Plantex.
here is a comparison.

http://www.gpodio.com/fert_table.asp

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbysl
Here is what i dose for my 125 gal tank does this look like a good start.


1.5t of nitrates kno3 3x week
1.5t of mono potassium phosphate kh2p04 3x week
.5t of plantex csm+b plus iron 3x week

Is their something i need to add take away or does this look good? Also i quit dosing the iron right now because im having a bba outbreak so im dosing flourish excel right now to get rid of if 25ml everday.
If BBA is growing, get that C02 up up up, pick it out, I will not lie to you, BBA is hard to rid, good conditions, and a steady dosing regime with lots of C02 will slow the growth way down, clean everything that has it, intake/exhaust tubes, hoses, heater, filter, substrate, clip off every leave that has it, bury infected substrate, no light= no growth, and so on.

1.5Tsp KH2P04 3x a week for a 125g is a bit much, use about 1/2Tsp 3x a week.

.5Tsp CSM+B is about 40ml, start with a little less than 1/2, roughly 3/8
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Old 10-16-2005, 11:11 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldbyrd
OK I have a 125 gallon tank heavily planted
Following this sticky I would dose:
kno3 1.5 tsp 3x wk
kh2po4 .5tsp 3x wk
k2so4 .25tsp 3x wk
trace 30mil 3x wk

OK here is where I am confused and need help
according to chuck's calculator this would give me
Nitrate 32.66 ppm I know I am shooting for 20-30 ppm so will back this down to 1.25 tsp which will give me 27.22ppm
Phosphate 10.62 it shows my target should be 1 ppm
Potassium 9.97 it shows target should be 20ppm

Am I missing something ?
From my reading I feel I have the KNO3 down but I am really confused on the Kh2po4 and k2so4


any help would be appreciated
For a heavy planted 125 you should be in good shape with that regime, Nitrates and Phosphate are more important than Potassium, also take into concideration that when dosing "K"N03 & "K"H2P04 the amount of Potassium (K+) that is going in from those two chemical's(K), target for K+ is in the 15 to 30 ppm range, and after looking at you're plan, I noticed I had a slight typo in the Potassium scale on that one set of tank's, I fixed it, Thank You
So you would actually want to dose close to a 1/2Tsp K2S04 3x week.

KN03 looks good, I wouldn't go any less than 1.25Tsp for a heavy plant mass high light C02 125g tank, unless you have a hefty bioload and feed hard, then you would still need to be alert, you do not want to run out of any nutrient at any time, especially nitrates, and especially during photo period, that would open you up to some mean BGA, its better to have a little more than a tad less, a little more will not hurt.

I personally make sure that my highligh C02 tank's have all the needed nutrient's in the water before the light's come on, I think it is just good practice.

Lastly, KH2P04, target is actually around 1 to 3, but I have ran it as high as 5+ppm with no adverse effect's.
Keep in mind we are dealing with variable's, plant uptake rate's, which I suspect change daily, up, down.
amount of food, bioload etc.
Try not to get to hung up on number's calculators and test kit's untill you learn to read the plant's.

Doing the above regime, will eliminate alot of variable's, especially if you start having some trouble along the way with various algae types, you will need good C02, it's a must, if you have high light, poor C02 will bring in alot of trouble by itself, so dosing enough KN03, KH2P04, K+, Trace,s then C02 is where you need to look.

I hope this help's you, any more question's along the way, we will leave the light on for ya
and keep us informed of how you're plant tank is running, and it's progress.

Thank's
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Old 10-16-2005, 01:29 PM   #39
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will do and thanks this makes more sense now
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Old 10-23-2005, 11:28 PM   #40
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What a perfect sticky! Maybe after everyone who hasn't tried this regimen starts to, we can share results and compare how it works for those who use higher or lower co2 and lighting and how it can be adjusted in various ways if any.
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Old 10-24-2005, 02:18 AM   #41
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wolf: thanks a million for those conversions, man! i'm bookmarking this and using it for my dosing calcs from now on

Oqsy
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Old 10-25-2005, 10:41 PM   #42
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You are welcome Ogsy!
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Old 11-17-2005, 05:17 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.lemay
I've never had a mold issue with my CSM mix. It could be because of chlorinated tap water. Chlorine kills mold.

Which leads me to my next thought:

Maybe adding a drop of chlorox to a 250ml bottle of solution would prevent the mold from growing. It wouldn't be detrimental to the fish since the concentrations we add to the tank are so miniscule. Just an idea;Please don't jump on me about how chlorine can kill fish. So can nitrates and we add those to the tank.

Marcel
I have read to add HCL (Which is aka Boric Acid or Hydrocloric Acid). I can't recall the amount, but it is very little like 10ml for 500ml or something like that... But keeping it in the fridge prevents the mold.
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Old 12-20-2005, 06:17 AM   #44
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I personally have talked with Craig over the phone and it has really been a
pleasure for starters... This whole thing can make alot of people either strive to get it down or just walk away from the hobby due to fustration...
Keep up the great work here Craig! I believe it is appreciated by all!!!!!!
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Old 01-16-2006, 12:30 PM   #45
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alright time to start asking lots of newby questions.

i have a 55g tank high light around 4wpg and co2 injection system. atm my tank is moderatly planted. im letting my plants grow out and im pickey on what i buy so it will fill with time. they are all growing great. i have some aglea starting up. no bba just some hair/tread algea. i ohavent started ferts yet besides some flurish excell here and there. i need to start a fert scedual. so how should i do it? i know little to nothing about ferts. should i do what you had on the front page? i need to start and am pretty clueless... so i need some help. and thanks for all the time people put into this stickey there is alot of great knowlage here!

thanks again!

-=- fish newb -=-
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