sad Torta Vals & a DIY C02 question

[Matthew RJ]

Please see attached Pics. The torta vals look thin, and not like they were when they first entered the tank.

Substrate is flourite, lights are T-8 lifeglow.

I dose with Excel & flourish daily,
Root tabs are in. I know lights could be improved & C02. About all I can do at the moment is a DIY C02. In the past I tried this and it seemed to fail with diffusing.

Can I use the green thing ...not sure what it's from, but one end says "Air in" and the other "air out"

If it would work for a diffuser, should I bury it in the flourite?

[AUvet14]

Green thing is an air check valve. It won't work as a diffuser. Do a google search for Hagen Diffusion ladder. That's what I used when I had DIY CO2 and it works fine for smaller tanks. Put the check valve in the air line from the DIY yeast reactor to prevent water from the tank flowing back into the reactor. The goal of CO2 diffusion is to increase the exposed surface area (i.e. decrease the CO2 bubble size) to increase the amount of CO2 that can dissolve at any given moment, as well as increase the contact time of the bubble with the water, which is where the diffusion ladder does a pretty good job of giving you a visual aid. I'm sure you could find a video on youtube of it, but the bubbles come out of the air tubing at the bottom of the ladder and they slowly go back and forth along an inclined groove and the bubbles get smaller and smaller as they work their way up the ladder. It's pretty neat to watch, actually

[Matthew RJ]

Thanks. Think the C02 is all my torta vals are lacking?

[AUvet14]

Originally Posted by Matthew RJ

Thanks. Think the C02 is all my torta vals are lacking?

I'm not sure. I'm not too familiar with vals so it's hard to me to say. I think it's probably a little bit of both CO2 and fertilization. Also, what is your substrate?

[AUvet14]

My bad. Lol. I see that it's fluorite, which should be fine. It might be light, but I'm not sure. I'm not sure what light intensity that Vals prefer. If you're using Excel daily, that should provide at least some source of carbon. You might need to look at macronutrient fertilizers. Flourish is just micronutrients. What do the root tabs have in them? Do you know? I would think that should be helping out since I assume vals are heavy root feeders.

[leonardcarlson]

Matthew, what are you running for a filter? If it's a canister, put the end of your co2 tube in the intake to your filter, adjust the spray bar so you don't break the surface of the water, as, that will disperse your co2 out of the tank, into the atmosphere. It you are using a hob filter, get rid of it and get a canister.
Lastly, the real problem is probably the excel itself, it has a tendency to melt Val's, so, get rid of the excel and add another DIY co2
Good luck

[Matthew RJ]

root tabs are Tetra Pond Lilly Grow. My amazon sword thrived after I added that.

[Matthew RJ]

It's a HOB filter. I'm thinking before the filter upgrade I want to invest in C02.

[leonardcarlson]

The problem with a hob, is it's breaking the water surface, and dispersing any co2 you are putting in the tank, you will waste your money going to a co2 system, and stay with a hob. Hob's are great for aeration, bad for co2 retention

[AUvet14]

Originally Posted by leonardcarlson

Matthew, what are you running for a filter? If it's a canister, put the end of your co2 tube in the intake to your filter, adjust the spray bar so you don't break the surface of the water, as, that will disperse your co2 out of the tank, into the atmosphere. It you are using a hob filter, get rid of it and get a canister.
Lastly, the real problem is probably the excel itself, it has a tendency to melt Val's, so, get rid of the excel and add another DIY co2
Good luck

I disagree that you should ditch the HOB. I ran a successful planted tank for 2 years without using a canister. It's a pretty significant financial investment to get a canister as opposed to getting some sort of affordable diffuser like the Hagen diffusion ladder that can do just as good a job if not better. Also, if you put the end of your CO2 line into the filter intake, you're going to end up with CO2 accumulating inside the canister and it will constantly "burp" a bunch of bubbles into the tank. I know because I've tried this. It's very annoying to constantly hear your filter burping. If you use an HOB, just make sure the water level is all the way up so the outflow from the filter doesn't fall downward causing a bunch of surface agitation, as yes, this will cause the CO2 that is dissolved in the water to gas off into the air.

As for the excel melting the val, maybe that's the problem. Like I said, I don't know anything about vals, but I have heard that Excel can cause some crypts to melt, so perhaps it also affect vals too.

[leonardcarlson]

The problem in my opinion, is the excel, it destroys my Val's every time I try it, maybe only dose with excel once or twice a week, no more
As for the canister, it's a lot cheaper than a co2 set up, you can get an ehiem 2215 for like $80 online, if you look. I don,t know the size of the aquarium. As for gas bubbles and "burping" it won't happen with a canister that is below the aquarium, I run two aquarium's this way with no problems, that might happen with a hob that is above the aquarium, so to speak. Also, people will tell you the co2 will eat up the impeller, I can only speak of my experience, after 21/2 years, no problems

[AUvet14]

Originally Posted by leonardcarlson

The problem in my opinion, is the excel, it destroys my Val's every time I try it, maybe only dose with excel once or twice a week, no more
As for the canister, it's a lot cheaper than a co2 set up, you can get an ehiem 2215 for like $80 online, if you look. I don,t know the size of the aquarium. As for gas bubbles and "burping" it won't happen with a canister that is below the aquarium, I run two aquarium's this way with no problems, that might happen with a hob that is above the aquarium, so to speak. Also, people will tell you the co2 will eat up the impeller, I can only speak of my experience, after 21/2 years, no problems

My canister is below my aquarium and I still had the problem of burping. It might depend on how high a bubble rate you use, as my bubble rate is pretty high. Also, a DIY CO2 setup is way cheaper than a canister. Sure, a canister and a pressurized CO2 system would be the ideal setup, but if you're on a budget, I've found that an HOB works just fine, at least if the aquarium isn't too big. Especially considering this is a lower light setup, a DIY CO2 system would work just fine with an HOB as long as you keep the water level up so the water from the outflow doesn't fall downward and create a ton of surface agitation. It might depend on what HOB you have, but Aquaclears work great and cause minimal surface agitation as long as you keep your water level up.

[leonardcarlson]

I'm sorry I meant a 2213 for $80, a 2215 for $100,

[leonardcarlson]

Absolutely, I agree, that's why I stated not to go to a co2 system. Why are you running your bubbles so high? Do you have a ph monitor? I have a 90g planted discus tank run 1 bubble per second, keep my ph at 7, my co2 lasts like 8 months, and I have huge growth, pearling, etc. the only thing I can't beat is that bba, drives me crazy

[AUvet14]

Originally Posted by leonardcarlson

Absolutely, I agree, that's why I stated not to go to a co2 system. Why are you running your bubbles so high? Do you have a ph monitor? I have a 90g planted discus tank run 1 bubble per second, keep my ph at 7, my co2 lasts like 8 months, and I have huge growth, pearling, etc. the only thing I can't beat is that bba, drives me crazy

What is your lighting like on that 90 gallon and what types of plants do you keep? Bubble rate would vary greatly depending on how much light you have and after that, which plants you are keeping and how many. You can check out my 30 gallon journal if you want to see the specs on my lighting, CO2, etc. I'm not going to take over this thread in the Low Tech Forum to bring up a high tech setup. With that said, Do you have a drop checker? Just because your pH stays at 7 doesn't mean your CO2 levels are at the ideal 30ppm. BBA could be a result of inadequate CO2 levels.

- Not intending to be rude. Just don't want to hijack this thread to talk about something completely different