How would fishkeeping be related to math?
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11-01-2013, 02:36 AM   #1
Warbler
Algae Grower

Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Oregon
Posts: 43

# How would fishkeeping be related to math?

Hello!
I'm in the IB program at my school, and we must do a project involving something we're passionate about and linking it to higher level math (hopefully something around calculus, but more likely some pre-calc) and then sort of "creating" new math.
I was thinking of relating it to fish keeping...but I'm not sure how. I thought maybe I could set up a formula that linked how many fish in the tank + size of the tank = amount of water changes per week (assuming the amount changed is that same and this is an established tank with no extreme parameters).
But how would that potentially be set up?
Anybody have any other ideas? Maybe ones with dosing ferts, or the like? Any mathematicians on the board? :P

 11-01-2013, 02:47 AM #2 got me a guppy Algae Grower     PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Decatur, AL Posts: 75 Isn't there a formula for determining what's visually pleasing to the eye. A lot of people use it for designing their tank layout. "Symmetry makes the take look too structured and neat, in the wild would you see a large rock directly in the centre of the river? Of course not, the central focus should not be in the middle but slightly off centre, for optimum focal point it should be around 1 : 1.62, it was calculated long ago that this point is most pleasing to the eye." http://aquariuminfo.org/ Here is a site that talks about the math behind the "golden ratio" http://www.mathsisfun.com/numbers/golden-ratio.html I hope this helps. __________________ What do you think? http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/yo...user&id=107209
 11-01-2013, 03:31 AM #3 Warbler Algae Grower     PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Oregon Posts: 43 That's actually really fascinating and I learned something new. The problem would be creating the "new" math out of it. I mean, I could put it over some designs, talk about how it's related to Fibonacci, but it feels like it still needs something more technical. I'll definitely talk to my teacher about it, because this is really fascinating.
 11-01-2013, 04:25 AM #4 Legot Planted Member     PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Gilbert, Arizona Posts: 249 In an attempt to make the Golden ratio thing less complicated, you could write it as something like an equation that finds the focal point of a tank of any given Length*height presented as a related rates problem. To make it more complicated and extra calculusey you could factor in the Depth (front to back) of the tank and make it a 3D related rates thing, all working to find the possible "perfect" focal points in any sized tank. You could even make a model of a revised(useable) inch/gallon rule! It could use the estimated waste produced by the average length of some common fish, factoring in waste removed by WCs and plants and such. Lots of possibilities, some are just more obscure than others. __________________ People are too often merely stating an assumed truth from flawed observation.
 11-01-2013, 05:26 AM #5 Warbler Algae Grower     PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Oregon Posts: 43 I like the 3D idea, but what would you mean by factoring in the 3D? Like would, for example, some driftwood in the perfect location look better at x distance from the front or y distance from the front? And I've been having trouble finding this...what section of math is the Golden Rule categorized in? Statistics, averages (like means) or what? I like the second idea as well, it's only the measuring part that would be difficult. Would I measure nitrates or collect their poo. XD Either way my shrimp is almost eerily efficient and cleans everything up...that might be a side project. Thanks for all these ideas, by the way!
11-01-2013, 03:19 PM   #6
Legot
Planted Member

Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Posts: 249

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Warbler I like the 3D idea, but what would you mean by factoring in the 3D? Like would, for example, some driftwood in the perfect location look better at x distance from the front or y distance from the front? And I've been having trouble finding this...what section of math is the Golden Rule categorized in? Statistics, averages (like means) or what?
Yes, that's what I meant by 3D.

The golden ratio is a constant, so I think it would fall into general calc/trig, but I'm sure there's some obscure math term that someone else knows.
__________________
People are too often merely stating an assumed truth from flawed observation.

 11-01-2013, 06:31 PM #7 Subtletanks91 Wannabe Guru     PTrader: (24/100%) Join Date: May 2013 Location: Redwood city, ca Posts: 1,674 I think ferts would be easier to do a math equation on. I'm no mathematician by any means but the number of equations for ferts co2 and lighting is definatly more so than aspect ratio and how to set up an eye pleasing aquarium __________________ 55g planted~~~Fluval spec 2.6g~~~10g shrimp
 11-01-2013, 08:07 PM #8 Soothing Shrimp Planted Tank Guru     PTrader: (117/100%) Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Illinois Posts: 6,012 Genetics uses percentages quite a bit. __________________ DBP Club!, RAOK Club and BBRR Club! My thinking has been invert-ed!
 11-01-2013, 09:13 PM #9 DaveK Planted Tank Enthusiast   PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Outside Philadelphia, PA Posts: 887 Here is an aquarium problem that occurs all the time - You have a tank containing X gallons of water, and a filtration system the can filter Y gallons per hour. Considering the the filtered water will immediately get mixed with unfiltered water, how long to you have to run the filtration system to filter 99% of the water? A similar problem but in steps - You have a tank with a GH of 400 ppm. You want to slowly reduce this to 30 ppm. Your replacement water is 10 ppm. How many partial water changes of 20% do you need to do? If you want to do this in 5 partial water changes how much water do you need to change each time? Of course there are variations on this problem. Good luck.
 11-01-2013, 10:07 PM #10 rininger85 Planted Member   PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Charlotte, MI Posts: 246 look up some of the PAR discussions on here and how its calculated, that's a good math problem, and the new math you can come up with a good calculator for determining PAR without a PAR meter =) __________________
11-01-2013, 11:46 PM   #11
Elli
Planted Member

Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 180

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Warbler And I've been having trouble finding this...what section of math is the Golden Rule categorized in? Statistics, averages (like means) or what?
The golden rule or ratio is a geometry concept. Look at the wiki page for "Mathematics and Art" for some historical background.

 11-02-2013, 03:52 AM #12 plantbrain Planted Tank Guru     PTrader: (248/100%) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: The swamp Posts: 13,050 % dilutions based on water changes are infinite series. You can graph these out using a computer program. Most dosing and CO2 calculators use these same formulas. A more interesting approach would be to use Fick's 1st and 2nd law and try and predict different oily substance's effects on the rates of degassing on a known surface area, say a fish tank's top surface. Then add something like rippling and how that would influence the rates of exchange and also change the surface area. Depends on how much you want to really chew on, or just get the assignment done Another is how CO2 production rates vary with pH and temperature for DIY CO2 users. You collect the gas with inverted test tubes to measure the differences. You get log type curves and you can create an area under the curves for the entire ranges of pH and temps, thus use some calculus. Fick's laws already have a good deal of calculus background, so that would be a goodie. __________________ Regards, Tom Barr Last edited by plantbrain; 11-02-2013 at 03:55 AM.. Reason: cuz
 11-02-2013, 04:45 AM #13 ThatGuyWithTheFish perugiae     PTrader: (23/100%) Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Boston Posts: 2,182 I think chemistry and population models (guppies would be the best) are the most advanced I can think of. __________________ "Boulders-Upon-Meadow" My Golden Rule of planted tanks: WWTAD- "What would Takashi Amano do?" RAOK Club #69
 11-03-2013, 01:38 PM #14 Synyster1337 Algae Grower   PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Charleston, WV Posts: 80 There is a lot of mathematical complexity in the estimative index. I would check that out. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2 __________________ I'm 22, and a Biology major. I like fish keeping because I can apply a lot of what I've learned in post-secondary education to my hobby I'll get a nice FTS to replace this crap eventually.
 11-03-2013, 03:12 PM #15 GraphicGr8s Banned     PTrader: (9/100%) Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: West coast of the east coast of the USA. Posts: 2,096 You could go with the cost of the equipment relative to the angst that always develops vs the wife factor and the lies told of said costs vs ongoing expenditures etc. I know what "Regents" classes are. I know what AP classes are. What is the latest and greatest term now for the same thing vis-à-vis "IB"? __________________ Quote me as saying I was misquoted. Once you get rid of integrity the rest is a piece of cake. The problem is you don't know what you don't know. Here's to our wives and sweethearts - may they never meet. If you agreed with me we'd both be right.

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