On the verge of giving up on a planted tank - Page 4
Planted Tank Forums
Your Tanks Image Hosting *Tank Tracker * Plant Profiles Fish Profiles Planted Tank Guide Photo Gallery Articles

Go Back   The Planted Tank Forum > General Planted Tank Forums > Low Tech Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-16-2012, 11:19 AM   #46
jccaclimber
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
PTrader: (5/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 753
Default

I personally don't feel that high light is sustainable with low tech. Others may pull it off, but I've never personally seen a tank that doesn't explode into an algae farm one day, or just has a slow (several month) decay of the plants.
__________________
Always curious.
jccaclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 05-16-2012, 01:52 PM   #47
PaulG
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: England
Posts: 356
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jccaclimber View Post
I personally don't feel that high light is sustainable with low tech. Others may pull it off, but I've never personally seen a tank that doesn't explode into an algae farm one day, or just has a slow (several month) decay of the plants.
No it isn't. I challenge anyone to find me ten successful high light tanks on this forum using low tech methods. Bonus points if it's someone who has previously been struggling.
__________________
Fraternity of dirt no. 60.

Got a tank? Doing it filterless? Add it here!

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=221729
PaulG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2012, 02:54 PM   #48
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulG View Post
No it isn't. I challenge anyone to find me ten successful high light tanks on this forum using low tech methods. Bonus points if it's someone who has previously been struggling.
I'm guessing here..... but worse case scenario, I just diffuse the light if the high light becomes a problem?

Regards

ps.... My next nightmare is making a choice on the size and colour of gravel

Been out and about and have taken a load of pictures of stuff and I might just force you guys to assist me .

also... out of curiosity, what backgrounds do most of you have?
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2012, 03:14 PM   #49
PaulG
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: England
Posts: 356
Default

High light WILL be a problem if you're not providing co2 and regular ferts. If you're having problems and on the verge of giving up the very last thing you want to do is make everything more difficult. High light reduces your margin for error dramatically.
__________________
Fraternity of dirt no. 60.

Got a tank? Doing it filterless? Add it here!

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=221729
PaulG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2012, 04:52 PM   #50
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

I've just found some old paperwork that came with my tank (just started moving the life forms out into my small tank whilst I start over).

My lights are as follows:

2 x 45w (895mm)
T5-technology High-lite.

Does that change anything for me?

Regards

Lee
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2012, 08:18 PM   #51
nosebleed
Planted Member
 
nosebleed's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 239
Default

There was a post in this forum where they talked about what is consider low, medium, and high light and someone on the forum measured it. I would suggest reading it if you haven't done so. It will help you out. Sorry I don't remember the link but I'm sure someone on here can link you it.
nosebleed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2012, 07:49 AM   #52
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

Right........ I'm planning on starting this soon.

I have a small tank with my remaining fish.... sadly, some of which, I lost in the move. So there is no rush for me.

I'm going to have to ask you chaps to offer some advice in relation to the basics again as it been a long time since I started a new tank from scratch.

I'm going to get the dirt/soil today and am opting for the UK's John Innes no.3.

I have the following questions:

1. Should I opt for a sand or gravel cap? At this stage I don't have a preference on the aesthetics, but would gladly take some recomendations on what to have and why (most important).

2. Should I fill just just enough water to cover the dirt first and allow it to do..... well, whatever it does with just a little water? I thought I read somewhere that this was a good idea. And then cap with the sand/gravel.

3. What measurement of each should I use?

4. As I am in no rush to get fish back into the tank, how should I deal with the following:
4a) Ammonia/Nitrites/Nitrates - I read somewhere that overloading the ammonia if you do NOT have fish by adding it from a bottle was a good idea (NO fish).
4b) Nutrients for the plants whilst there is no fish.

5. I plan on getting Tetra's, Mollies and Rainbow fish, therefore what other (not fish) fauna would be safe with these (thinking snails and shrimp).

6. (Mainly for UK people here) What is a good source of plants in the UK?

Once again, thank you all for your assistance.

Regards

Lee
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 02:05 AM   #53
Jaguar
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
Jaguar's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Kelowna BC, Canada
Posts: 834
Send a message via Skype™ to Jaguar
Default

1. Sand or very fine gravel like 3M color quartz (I think that stuff is discontinued though). Dirt will float through regular sized gravel and you'll have a dirty disaster.

2. I added a bit of water to my dirt when I did it to make it a pliable mud consistency. You don't want to add too much though, or you'll be trying to dump sand on top of a mud puddle and it gets splashy and messy.

3. I like deeper substrates and did about 2 inches of dirt with 1.5 inches of sand on top in the shallowest part. More sand in the back to make a slope effect. Up to 5 inches in some parts. Deeper rooting plants like swords went back there.
Jaguar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 04:43 AM   #54
Hoppy
Planted Tank Guru
 
Hoppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (74/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 18,734
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by leemonk View Post
I've just found some old paperwork that came with my tank (just started moving the life forms out into my small tank whilst I start over).

My lights are as follows:

2 x 45w (895mm)
T5-technology High-lite.

Does that change anything for me?

Regards

Lee
The lights are 36 inches long, or what we refer to as 36 inch lights. But, our 36 inch T5HO lights are 39 watt lights, so yours are certainly high output lights (HO) or more. Two of those with good reflectors would have to be around 80 cm above the substrate in order to have low enough light to use low tech methods.
__________________
Hoppy
Hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 12:07 PM   #55
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

Thanks for the replies.

The lights are only about 450mm off the substrate!

What options do I have? I was simply planning on covering most of the waters surface with plants.

I'm worried by the conflicting information in this thread.

I can't afford to mess this up again, both financially and interest levels. If this fails I'll just have to switch to Cichlids in a non planted tank

Is covering the waters surface going to be sufficient, or will those plants suffering a similar fate with all the light and no nutrients?

Is the alternative to cover the lights?

Regards
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 04:18 PM   #56
Hoppy
Planted Tank Guru
 
Hoppy's Avatar
 
PTrader: (74/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 18,734
Default

If you use floating plants, they will soon cover the entire water surface, and the plants below them will be shaded so they can't grow. Also, those floating plants will use up all of the nutrients in the water, further harming the plants below.

You can use window screen to reduce the light intensity. That would be far better, in my opinion, than trying to use floating plants to do so. I think you really have to decide if you want to go "low tech" (non-CO2) or use CO2, EI dosing of fertilizers, and the increased tank maintenance needed to keep a high light tank from becoming an algae jungle. Then, you can follow which ever of those methods you want, and have a good chance of enjoying the tank.
__________________
Hoppy
Hoppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 07:26 PM   #57
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

Do you mean windowscreens like this: http://www.windowscreensuk.co.uk/cat...FUIOfAod6VK_8Q

Regards
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2012, 09:55 AM   #58
leemonk
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 34
Default

Someone has suggested using reflectors in reverse or disabling one of the bulbs.

What are your thoughts on either method.

Regards
__________________
Switching to low tech - high light dirt tank..... coming soon to a forum near you!
leemonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2012, 04:03 AM   #59
Surgeon
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 48
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoppy View Post
If you use floating plants, they will soon cover the entire water surface, and the plants below them will be shaded so they can't grow. Also, those floating plants will use up all of the nutrients in the water, further harming the plants below.

You can use window screen to reduce the light intensity. That would be far better, in my opinion, than trying to use floating plants to do so. I think you really have to decide if you want to go "low tech" (non-CO2) or use CO2, EI dosing of fertilizers, and the increased tank maintenance needed to keep a high light tank from becoming an algae jungle. Then, you can follow which ever of those methods you want, and have a good chance of enjoying the tank.
I agree that a shade is better but its not that hard to control floating plats such as frogbit (duckweed on the other hand is ssent by the devil!). I just pull out a handful or two a week and adjust fert doses accordingly.

Plus I really like the frogbit roots
Surgeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2012, 01:09 PM   #60
outcast
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 284
Default

My opinion is to listen to hoppy and tone out the rest. He has posted some very informative guides to lighting and has experimented a lot for others benefits. Your issue is too much light, and it is a common issue for many people with stock t5ho tank set ups. The best solution is the screen, it reduces overall light to the tank without reducing light coverage. Other ways people go around this is with glass, more for topless tanks though, or through reducing the bulbs. Because all my tanks at topless i raised my lights.

Just an example 1x4 foot strip of t5ho lighting about 650 mm off the substrate was enough to growout hc with no algae. The key is to balance your lighting to your tank needs.

The solution is not buying better substrates, not investing in high tech gear, not changing your light fixture, it is totally to do with cutting the outpu of the light to your substrate.

Your plants are low demand and dont need co2. or ferts beyond fish food. Maybe trace twice a week but that is all. I keep java fern in most of my tanks as an indicator. If it starts to turn brown, i have too much light or not enough nitrate. If daily feedings are not enough to keep up with the java fern demands, then i have too much light.

Just a point about how i keep fish tanks. Cheap diy and simple is my approach. I have been through high tech, expensive substrates abd loys of ei dosing and i find things alwaya crash because i have kids and work that often wear me out and causes me to be lazy with the tanks from time to time. What works for me is sand, balanced lighting and root tabs. Fish waste are normally enough for my rhizome based plants. As long as i get growth witjout trimming headaches im ahead of the game

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I896 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2
__________________
Filstar pimp #116! aka Neven elsewhere
Tanks: 29Gv2 planted community; 10G guppies; 5G nano; 2.5G Betta
old scapes: 29Gv1; 10Gv3; 10Gv2
outcast is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Planted Tank LLC 2012