Brazilian Micro Sword Proper Name: Lilaeopsis brasiliensis
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:18 AM   #1
iwagumikun
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Brazilian Micro Sword Proper Name: Lilaeopsis brasiliensis


Introduction/Objective:
New member member here with my iwagumi style tank needing some advice.

Scenario:
Its almost 4 weeks since I planted and I don't see the foreground looking too good (see attachment).

Question:
  1. How can I get the grass to look healthier?
  2. How long in time will the foreground establish the carpet look?
Set-Up:
  • 144 watts of Life-Glo Bulbs
  • ADA 60-P
  • Eheim 2213
  • Fluval substrate
  • CO2 (3bubbles per second)
  • Flourish excel from seachem
  • Seiryu Rock
  • Brasiliensis foreground
Inhabitants:
  • Neon Tetras
  • SAEs
  • Otocinclus
  • Apistogramma

Appreciate any advisement(s).
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:00 AM   #2
aweeby
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Hm, IME any lilaeopsis grows REALLY slowly. Regardless, you may want to start fertilizing this. You're not dosing anything but excel? Excel is just kind of like co2 in a little bottle. (and you already have pressurized... so really, there's no point in dosing excel) You'll need some real nutrients in that. I'm not too familiar with the size of ADA tanks, but it sounds like you have too much light, as well. This may be why you have algae.

For info on fertilizers, I've always found these links helpful:
http://theplantedtank.co.uk/dosing-methods.htm
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/fe...-regimes_.html
http://calc.petalphile.com

For future ref, there's a plant subforum too, that would be another appropriate place to post questions about plant issues and such. Since this is your journal, you might want to post some stuff about the tank as a whole? Just a suggestion. You can edit your original post too, there's a button at the bottom of each post you make.
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:21 PM   #3
Kathyy
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^+1
And you are running a whole lot of light. Cut back the amount and length of your lighting period quite a bit. Most seem to run 6-8 hour days here and it is unlikely you need more than 1 or 2 bulbs lit up. You can also put a layer or two of plain ordinary window screen on top of the tank as shade cloth.
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Old 06-08-2012, 07:53 AM   #4
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Update_06072012:


Problem:
The 'brasiliensis / lilaeopsis' planted almost 4 weeks ago with lots of algae from heavy lighting (from what I've learned from others).


Alternative WorkAround:
Today, I stopped by lfs and bought 3 stem plants and some floater lily pads to help soak up the nutrients in the water.


Prior Set Up:
13 hours a day of 144 watts (6x24 watt Life-Glo bulbs) and 10 hours a day of CO2 (carbon dioxide turns on same time when lights go on and turn off 1 hour before light goes off)


New Set Up:
8 hours a day of 72 watts (3x24 watt Life-Glo bulbs) and 11 hours of CO2 (2 hours before light turns on for full photosynthesis when lights come on and turn off 1 hour before lights go off)


Drop Checker Status:
I have no drop checker and not sure if I need one; attached is the starting picture.


Lesson Learned:
Because the grass is slow growing and not much planted; too much nutrients in the water along with the daily drops of flourish excel seachem, 13hours of 144 watts (6x24 watt Life-Glo bulbs) and no stem plants to soak up the nutrients in the water caused the state of my foreground choice of substrate.


Goal:
I hope in 3 months there will be something to look forward to yielding improvement.

Follow Up:
Will update as I have more to add from additional appreciated advice(s).
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:09 AM   #5
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Forgot to mention I moved up the bps from 3 to 5. Thinking of adding more pots of lilaeopsis over the weekend too or will the stem plants be sufficient in the recovery of the foreground?

The Archaea regulator is still at 59 on the meter from 4 months ago on the 10 lb tank (well above the zero red area for empty).

I placed the diffuser right under the Eheim surface tube that agitates the water to help move the bubbles around the tank.
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:12 AM   #6
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I have a glass lid up top as well to hopefully help not evaporate as much water and prevent any chances of my small fish from jumping out.

50% water changes every weekend. Looking forward to see how the changes will be 2-3 months from now.
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:02 AM   #7
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I didn't see anything mentioned about fertilizer. Are you fertilizing? I believe you still have high light. Fertilizing is a must you need Npk and micros I would recommend ei dosing with dry ferts if you look around in the fertilizing section you should be able to find all the info you need
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:10 AM   #8
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I have 12 really small neon tetras, 2 SAEs, and a apistogramma providing the fertilizer.

The 60-P is 18 gallons so if it's 3 watts per gallon @54; my 72 watts is only over 18watts. Otherwise 48watts with two 24w bulbs would put me under the ratio of 3w per gallon.
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:37 AM   #9
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Good start, but you'll still need to have fertilizer if you want growth. Contrary to popular belief, you probably don't have excess nutrients. excel is NOT causing your algae. when your plants aren't terribly healthy, and you're putting a lot of light into the system, you're going to get algae, pretty much guaranteed, regardless of nutrients.

Many people here will tell you that the WPG rule is VERY outdated. you have T5HO, which are WAY more efficient than the relics of the days when WPG was still relevant. You can measure light in these newer devices more accurately with something called PAR. Thankfully, there are some awesome members here, so you won't have to go out and buy a PAR meter. There's some extremely valuable info here. I recommend you read that entire thing. It's that useful. A quick look at that tells me you have an obscene amount of light, even with just one bulb. But I still recommend you read it, i haven't had to worry about this in a while, so i might be off.

With high light and co2, you are going to need fertilizers beyond what your fish excrete, especially if you're looking for anything lush. if it continues like this without ferts, in 2-3 months, you'll probably have dead plants, algae, and frustration. (trust me, been there, done that )check out the links i posted above. like i said, excel isn't a 'nutrient'- it's just a chemical that breaks things down to make carbon, aka co2 substitute. After co2, which you already have, plants need macros (nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus) and micros.

the drop checker is not critical but is important. you don't want to gas your fish. you should know how much co2 is dissolved in your water on a continual basis, the drop checker will tell you this, bubble rate will not. Bubble counter just tells you how much is coming out the the reg. It's a slight, albeit very vital, difference.

You have a very nice system here. it'd be a shame to let it go downhill. If it's the price that's turning you off, these things can be pretty cheap. there's a user here whose screen name is nilocg. send him a pm and he can ship you ferts and a drop checker for pretty cheap.
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Old 06-08-2012, 11:38 AM   #10
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Yes looked at those links and was overwhelmed. Just want the laymans terms on the following:

01. Guess I'll call for a price quote @ Aquascapes | Aeia on a drop checker and study how to use / install it.

02. Same deal with the fertilizer and how to use or drop in tank to avoid dissapointment in 2-3 months.

03. That lighting link as well 1:30am I was like "ok maybe next time" since i got work in the morning lol. At least i cut down to three bulbs instead of six? bah im tired..

Just trying to keep this simple as possible to have that lush carpet, low maintenance, slow growth lilaeopsis foreground with my rocks. In a nutshell, hope after getting a drop checker and the fertilizer, I can look forward to something nice in 4 months total from the day i planted the foreground.

Afterwards, curious to know how the prices are with the user 'nilocg' if I can get a good price and w/o shipping...ok time for bed tired...tx again Aweeby :P
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:11 PM   #11
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yeah, i hear you. it's overwhelming to read walls of text after a hard day of work. I did kind of spam you with links. Sorry about that. But I swear, that's some of the best info out there.

and for the stuff to buy, np, i'll post you a link. it's much cheaper to get it online.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sp...ml#post1761232

you'll want the first package, probably, but that's up to you. I don't think you'll need the iron chelate. anyway, that's going to be probably the cheapest way to do ferts. i know aquascapes sells the liquid pfertz line which is awesome but rather expensive. like 60$ for the all the necessary ferts.

"NPK + CSM+B Package- $20 shipped
1lb KNO3, 1/2lb KH2PO4, 1lb K2SO4, and 1/2lb CSM+B"

he also sells drop checkers, not sure how much but you'll save on shipping if you buy it from that same guy. you're probably looking at something like 25$ total for ferts and a drop checker.

if you click on the username links, a menu will pop up giving you the option to 'send private message to X'. just pm him and he'll help you out.

sorry if i'm being a bit abrasive, btw. posting when tired leads to facepalm moments in the morning.
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Old 06-09-2012, 07:11 AM   #12
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no response yet from him. For the time being I'm thinking of siphoning the wastes from other fish in other tank to use as fertilizer and drop it in the planted tank lol
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Old 06-09-2012, 09:43 AM   #13
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this is what i sent him....
=======
"Drop Checker and fertilizer customer"

Hello,

I was referred to you by user id: aweeby. I have a 18gallgon ada 60-p rimless and am growing a few bunches of lilaeopsis.

I was told you would be the best resource on getting some supply of fertilizer and drop checker. Never really used either one and thought the nutrients were enough from the fluval bags i used for my substrate.

The whole details of my foreground plant dying details with picture of my tank is on my 12 threads when you click my name.

Please help.
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Old 06-12-2012, 04:23 PM   #14
Hilde
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Have you checked you nitrates. Should be 10 - 20 ppm. If not at this level dose with KNO3 (potassium nitrate). Liquid form Seachem Potassium. Dry form here in order section fastest. Info on dosing here.
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