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Old 04-28-2005, 04:49 AM   #1
Jim
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Red Leaves Turning Green


There are several plant varieties in my 85G tank that started out with red colors, but the leaves are slowly turning green (Ludwigia Red, Rotala Indica, Rotala Macronda and a few others). The plants are healthy, it's just an issue with the colors. Is it an Iron deficiency? I'm running 3 wpg of lighting and plenty of CO2.

I'm dosing 15mls of Plantex CSM+B+Fe three times a week. I'm also dosing an extra 10mls of Flourish Iron three times a week. Current Fe level in the tank is 0.2 ppm. I'm dosing Potassium, but no Nitrate or PO4 at all because of existing amounts in my water.

I'm also still have a bad green algae problem and can't figure out why, but that's another issue

Here are the water params:

GH: 11
KH: 7
Nitrate: 10
PO4: 1.0
pH: 6.7
CO2: 42 ppm
Fe: 0.2 ppm
Temp: 84
TDS: 245

Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks,

Jim
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Old 04-28-2005, 05:19 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim
I'm running 3 wpg of lighting and plenty of CO2.
My first question would be what kind of 3 wpg lighting?
All the other items seem in check, but not sure how you are measuring the iron and some other details, but not to worry...

What is your water change schedule like?
What is your substrate? Not that it effects stems as much...but just to add to the details...
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Old 04-28-2005, 06:54 PM   #3
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In terms of the lighting, it's a JBJ 260W CF system. It's on for 10 hours a day and I just started turning the lights off for two hours in the middle of the day in a effort to contain the algae. I have green and spot algae on tank surfaces. I also have BBA on plant leaves. Green algae on substrate, which is a mix of small gravel and Flourite. I'm using a Hagen test kit to test iron levels.

pH is maintained at 6.7 with a Milwaukee controller. I have a decent amount of plant pearling at the end of the photoperiod.

The output from my Fluval 404 is the only surface agitation. No other real currents going on in the tank.
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Old 04-28-2005, 06:55 PM   #4
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I'm also doing a 50% water change once a week.
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Old 04-28-2005, 07:31 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim
I have green and spot algae on tank surfaces.
You don't have enough PO4. I don't know/don't care/don't measurement how much PO4 1lb/week of frozen bloodworm contains, but I dose 2ppm PO4 3x per week, those are gone from glass. Haven't wiped the glass for months.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim
I also have BBA on plant leaves.
You might not have as much CO2 as you think you have.
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Old 04-28-2005, 11:28 PM   #6
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If you are using a controller, when was the last time you calibrated it, and only using the 7 solution...?

What KH test do you use? I have seen vast differences amongst the tests...
And while I am asking, which PO4 test?

In that 260 CF JBJ, which bulbs are you running?

Lastly, with the 2 hour siesta, are you still running a 10 hour photoperiod or down to 8?
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Old 04-28-2005, 11:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhoetzl
If you are using a controller, when was the last time you calibrated it, and only using the 7 solution...?

What KH test do you use? I have seen vast differences amongst the tests...
And while I am asking, which PO4 test?

In that 260 CF JBJ, which bulbs are you running?

Lastly, with the 2 hour siesta, are you still running a 10 hour photoperiod or down to 8?
The controller is five months old and has only been calibrated when I first set it up. I only used the 7 solution to do so.

I'm running 4-65watt white bulbs with the JBJ lighting. The lighting cycle is 10 hours (5 hours on, two off, then five more on).

Both the KH and PO4 tests are from Aquarium Pharmaceuticals -- are these generally regarded as accurate?
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Old 04-29-2005, 02:26 AM   #8
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Sha has brought up good points. IMO you do not have enough phospahtes and nitrates in your tank. You need to start dosing ferts. You have alot of light, alot of co2 and no food for you plants.

Lots of people dose their tanks via EI. The extra ferts in the water does not promote algae growth. 50% WWC's help reset the tank levels.

You can get a more accurate KH reading by using 10mls of water and divide the number of drops by 2. So 8 drops for example give you 4dkh.
calibrate the ph controller- even if its off a little, its a fairly large difference in co2 levels when you compare your ph and kh.
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Old 04-29-2005, 03:19 AM   #9
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Most red plants like nitrates. I bet you will see a great improvment if your nitrates were around 20ppm. In my case I like to keep the nites around 10ppm due to discus, and Im sure Shalu would agree the discus are the colors that matter the most.
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Old 04-29-2005, 06:28 PM   #10
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Actually the common consensus is that lower nitrate brings out more reds in most plants. However, I don't have a problem with red plants at high nitrate levels, up to 60ppm range when I slacked off on my water changes. They still stayed pretty red, especially the true red plants like rotala macrandra. The common rotala indica/rotundifolia will only turn pink when it gets close to light. It gets redder when NO3 is low. But I don't like that kind of red, that is from stressed plants.
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55gallon40w T6 ODNO4x, no CO2. Discus grow out.
10gallon Tonina tank, 2x15w T6 ODNO 4x
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I will do aquascapes after I collect all the plant species and grow them to perfection.
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Old 04-29-2005, 09:00 PM   #11
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It also depends on the plant that you're referring to. Certain plants are more redder with different conditions. Take Nesaea sp. red for example. It's a pinkish color when things are in balance, but blood red when the tank is lean on phosphates.
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Old 04-30-2005, 04:16 AM   #12
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Default Excessive CO2 - Aglae?

I just recalibrated my pH controller after five months of use and it was off quite a bit. After doing the math, I figured out that my CO2 levels were crazy high -- in the 80-90 ppm range. Fortunately, my fish are OK.

Would excess CO2 like this promote green algae growth or help supress it? I'm still wroking through my issues with green/spot algae and wondering it this was part of my problem...any thoughts?
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Old 04-30-2005, 05:09 AM   #13
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are you sure your ph is not off in the OPPOSITE direction?
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Truvu 100g Flourite, wet/dry, AHSupply 302w PC, PinPoint controller
10gallon15w T6+15w T8
55gallon40w T6 ODNO4x, no CO2. Discus grow out.
10gallon Tonina tank, 2x15w T6 ODNO 4x
---------------------
I will do aquascapes after I collect all the plant species and grow them to perfection.
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Old 04-30-2005, 05:53 AM   #14
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Sha,

Yeah, you're correct. I just realized that I figured it incorrectly -- went the wrong way on the numbers. The actual amount of CO2 was in the 20-25 ppm range.

I'm going to boost it into the 40's and hope that solves my algae issues (or at least helps).

Thanks!

Jim
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Old 04-30-2005, 10:16 AM   #15
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that's great. Your algae problem should get better with higher CO2. Also, don't trust your PO4 kit, add some PO4. Apart from glass algae, you can use some anubias as PO4 indicator. If the anubia is not completely free of green spot algae, you don't have enough PO4.
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Truvu 100g Flourite, wet/dry, AHSupply 302w PC, PinPoint controller
10gallon15w T6+15w T8
55gallon40w T6 ODNO4x, no CO2. Discus grow out.
10gallon Tonina tank, 2x15w T6 ODNO 4x
---------------------
I will do aquascapes after I collect all the plant species and grow them to perfection.
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