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Old 03-12-2012, 03:44 PM   #31
Pugman
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Doing the math it's about 171 gallons. Maybe a little less because of the thickness of the glass. I've seen this tank set up at Aqua Forest and I don't recall additional circulation. In the ADA show room there are several of them and again there are no pumps. I'm really going for a clean look and I really don't want to be looking at pumps. Am I wrong here?
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Old 03-12-2012, 04:03 PM   #32
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If you've seen them in person then they probably have multiple pumps setup to multiple lily pipes. If you've seen pics of them, then they take out the pipes and other stuff in the tank for pics. A Vortech wouldn't even take up much space. The MP10 or 20 would be enough.
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Old 03-12-2012, 05:17 PM   #33
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Doing the math it's about 171 gallons. Maybe a little less because of the thickness of the glass. I've seen this tank set up at Aqua Forest and I don't recall additional circulation. In the ADA show room there are several of them and again there are no pumps. I'm really going for a clean look and I really don't want to be looking at pumps. Am I wrong here?
I was going off the ADA website, and they said 155g. Most likely because of the glass.

I AM SO EXCITED!
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Old 03-12-2012, 09:49 PM   #34
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The ones at AFA use much more powerful canisters than the fluval g6's

If I were you, I'd return those and get a pair of fx5's or some rena xp-4's. The g6's only push 260gph, the xp4's do 450gph and the fx5 does 920 gph.
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Old 03-12-2012, 10:12 PM   #35
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this is one insane build! looking forward to how it comes along.
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Old 03-12-2012, 10:39 PM   #36
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Honestly, if it were me doing something this big with a tank this nice I'd run an overflow like Tom Barr is doing on his "dutch" tank and sump it. It would give you great surface movement which IMO is awesome with LED lighting because it bounces it all across the bottom of the tank like sunlight. If your adamant about canisters then... 2x Eheim 2262's for the win.

FX5's are good too but they supposedly slow down a lot with media in them.

Regardless, I think you're going to find that the G6's won't get it done. This is especially true if you want to steer clear of power heads in the tank, which I understand.

Let's go with what ADA says at 155g tank capacity. The 2 g6s will put out 528g/hr flow rate. So you'll be turning the tank over about 3.4 times per hour. However that's without anything like heaters, CO2 reactors, etc to slow things down. PLUS as the filter does its job the flow will slowly reduce between filter maintenance.

To compare, I have 2x Ehiem 2215 canisters on my 75g putting out 328g/hr. I have the 2217 impellers in them also so that boosts the flow some but I'm not sure how much. Doing the math that means I'm turning my tank over roughly 4.4 times per hour and I STILL needed to put a Koralia 750 in there to get enough flow. I actually just bought a 2262 to replace both of my 2215's with in order to boost that number to roughly 10x per hour.

I have 2 ETH heaters (one on each filter) a CO2 reactor and Turbo Twist UV after them which is probably at LEAST what you'll have running on this 180-P monster.

Most people I see are putting something like a 2215 or 2217 (or equivalent) on their ADA 60-Ps which give them 9-14x turn over per hour before they add equipment.

Just wanted to throw all that out there.
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Old 03-12-2012, 11:15 PM   #37
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If your worried about flow just use a vortech mp40w (1000Gph-3200Gph) and it will sync with the uber cool radion lighting you have already to simulate storms and tidal swells, thats if you are set on keeping the G6's just for bio load. also the mp40 wet side is only 3"x2.25" (thats tiny for a power head of its capabilities) the dry side is the same size.
Like i said i use an Mp10 on lagoon mode at 50% power on a 40G and its more than enough flow.
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:17 AM   #38
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Awesome build! Subscribed
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Old 03-13-2012, 01:21 AM   #39
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Hum....This is all new news to to me. This seems to be close to the same flow of reef tanks. I was under the assumption that Lilly pipes cut the unessassary flow that canisters create. Overflow boxes are nice to skim the protein from the surface but it seems to me they would decrease the CO2 levels. Vortech pumps are awesome but that's the last thing I want hanging on the side of my tank. Unless they make them out of glass lol. I just found out my stands been delayed another week. Ugh!! The guy I'm having building it is a perfectionist so I'm sure it'lll be worth the wait. On a side note Fluval rate their flow rates on there canisters when they are full of media, most others rate them empty so it's hard to compare flow rates.
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Old 03-13-2012, 01:56 AM   #40
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I'm pretty sure the two G6's will do just fine. If you went with FX5's you would have to split the 1" tubing into two 5/8" so you could attach the heaters and lily pipes without losing flow, but that would mean 4 inlet pipes and 4 outlet...lots of glass pipes in the tank.
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Old 03-13-2012, 02:26 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pugman View Post
Hum....This is all new news to to me. This seems to be close to the same flow of reef tanks. I was under the assumption that Lilly pipes cut the unessassary flow that canisters create. Overflow boxes are nice to skim the protein from the surface but it seems to me they would decrease the CO2 levels. Vortech pumps are awesome but that's the last thing I want hanging on the side of my tank. Unless they make them out of glass lol. I just found out my stands been delayed another week. Ugh!! The guy I'm having building it is a perfectionist so I'm sure it'lll be worth the wait. On a side note Fluval rate their flow rates on there canisters when they are full of media, most others rate them empty so it's hard to compare flow rates.
Not nearly as much flow as reefs (the magic number seems to be between 5x and 10x turnover) the lilly pipes spead out the flow in a vortex type swirl and are less direct (like a spray bar is) and help eliminate dead spots. if you choose to go iwagumi it would be fine but if you plant densly then that was the reason for recomending the vortech to you (wide soft adjustable flow). i totally understand the clean look approach i personally dont like pipes over the rim of a tank, lucky for me my tank is backed on three sides and drilled for the pipe work ,so i dont see the outside of the vortech when viewing.
I have to say what ever you choose to use it is still going to be an amazing tank.
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Last edited by robbowal; 03-13-2012 at 06:25 AM..
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:21 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by IWANNAGOFAST View Post
dude this is so nuts!! I think there's less than 10 actual ADA 180-p's in America.
I think that's because we have a lot of US based options available to us for large builds. Once you go past 75 gallons or so, ADA tanks aren't very competitive price-wise. Tom Barr has mentioned this many times. After getting quotes, I can confirm he's right.
Just for comparison, A.G.E. quoted a custom 180 gallon Starphire tank shipped for about half the cost.

---

Back to the OP, that pair of Fluval G6's may work alright for you. It really depends on how you plan to scape and plant the tank. I skimmed through the thread, so I didn't notice if you already mentioned the plan. Obviously if it's thicker you may have some pockets where circulation isn't so good.

If you are aiming for a sleek look you might want to skip the glass (and soon to be brown) pipes in favor of having the intakes and returns plumbed through the bottom. Hiding them behind decor wouldn't be too difficult. And if the scape changes you could use locline or tubing buried under the substrate to route them to new hidden locations.

Definitely looking forward to seeing this one develop!
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:59 PM   #43
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I've got 100 gph on a 5 gallon tank, for such a large tank id probably sump instead of using canisters
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:30 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by prototyp3 View Post
I think that's because we have a lot of US based options available to us for large builds. Once you go past 75 gallons or so, ADA tanks aren't very competitive price-wise. Tom Barr has mentioned this many times. After getting quotes, I can confirm he's right.
Just for comparison, A.G.E. quoted a custom 180 gallon Starphire tank shipped for about half the cost.

---

Back to the OP, that pair of Fluval G6's may work alright for you. It really depends on how you plan to scape and plant the tank. I skimmed through the thread, so I didn't notice if you already mentioned the plan. Obviously if it's thicker you may have some pockets where circulation isn't so good.

If you are aiming for a sleek look you might want to skip the glass (and soon to be brown) pipes in favor of having the intakes and returns plumbed through the bottom. Hiding them behind decor wouldn't be too difficult. And if the scape changes you could use locline or tubing buried under the substrate to route them to new hidden locations.

Definitely looking forward to seeing this one develop!
I guess I'm alone in my perspective here. I view ADA style aquariums as art. Although I've seen better layouts then Amanos tanks, I believe his over all appearance of the aquarium it self it beautiful artwork. The the low iron rimless glass, the simplistic stands, the hand blown Co2 glassware, to the naturalistic landscapes, and the modern hanging lighting systems. It's all part of a "look" that separates his aquariums from anyone else (that I have seen). Hanging an overflow box or drilling holes in a $4000.00 aquarium is not an option.
One Fluval G6 can handle an aquarium up to 160 gallons. I have two of these on a "155 gallon". So biologically, chemically, and mechanically I'm more then set. I understand that flow is important as well and if I do need it then Vortechs it is. ADA sells a little surface skimmer which I might try first.
As far as a layout is concerned I'm not sold on any style yet. The current Unzan stone video thats floating around looks appealing to me. I don't want to paint the tank nor do I want to put a background on it so Hiding the back wall with a mountain like seen seems like a good idea.
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Old 03-13-2012, 11:43 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pugman View Post
I guess I'm alone in my perspective here. I view ADA style aquariums as art. Although I've seen better layouts then Amanos tanks, I believe his over all appearance of the aquarium it self it beautiful artwork. The the low iron rimless glass, the simplistic stands, the hand blown Co2 glassware, to the naturalistic landscapes, and the modern hanging lighting systems. It's all part of a "look" that separates his aquariums from anyone else (that I have seen). Hanging an overflow box or drilling holes in a $4000.00 aquarium is not an option.
One Fluval G6 can handle an aquarium up to 160 gallons. I have two of these on a "155 gallon". So biologically, chemically, and mechanically I'm more then set. I understand that flow is important as well and if I do need it then Vortechs it is. ADA sells a little surface skimmer which I might try first.
As far as a layout is concerned I'm not sold on any style yet. The current Unzan stone video thats floating around looks appealing to me. I don't want to paint the tank nor do I want to put a background on it so Hiding the back wall with a mountain like seen seems like a good idea.
I agree that ADA makes attractive equipment and aquariums. I've ran 60P, 90P, and 120H setups, down to ADA filters, CO2, lighting, etc. And I'm all for aesthetics being an artist by profession. But having seen both an ADA 180P and custom tanks, the silicone work is pretty even once you go over that 100 gallon barrier. They share the same nicely polished/beveled edges, and clear Starphire glass. Something to keep in mind is the seams on the big ADA tanks aren't nearly as invisible as their smaller tanks.

This is pure personal preference, but a single low profile overflow is less intrusive than 4 hoses and connected equipment. (Anything hanging on a rimless tank breaks the ultra clean look.) And if you haven't used glass pipes before, they are amazing fast at attracting gunk. They're also tricky to adjust for circulation/aeration given how quickly the water level fluctuates. The intake pipes have killed plenty of fish/shrimp as well, those minimal openings have surprisingly strong suction with a strong canister filter behind them..

I also used a Fluval G6 and can say that rating is more telling of the biological filtration capabilities, not the flow. I had it on a 46 gallon tank, worked perfect for that application. Like you said, nothing a vortech can't fix if you need more flow.
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