Asking for Substrate choices for a 8 foot by 2 foot tank

[Moody636]

Don't discus darken up and show peppering with dark substrates? I've always heard they're best kept with a white substrate or none at all.
I'm not sure if that really matters to you or not, but I thought I'd mention it.

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[DogFish]

I alway smile when I read Discus keeping comments. Here they are in the wild in Brazil. Look how fragile they are and how pristine the habitat is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwDCseB-D0Y

I was fortunate to meet & hear Jack Watley speak in the 90's. One thing he said that stuck with me is, "You don't really think that water is 84 degrees 2' below the surface, do you?"

[Aswain]

Thanks for all the help guys. I decided on bare bottom for now. And in the spring or summer I am gonna switch over to mts. Seem like I am gonna have to make alot of mts to cover my tank. So I wanna make more than enough so I don't need to make more. I might put the cap/top layer of the mts in the tank for now. I like the look of a tank with substrate.

Ok a few more questions i have is roughly how much mts am I gonna need for 1 inch layer?
Can I use one inch layer of mts and one inch layer of cap?
And can i use Any type of rock for a cap/top layer? I understand that it has to be small enough for roots to grow and move. But can I use substrate as large as 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch pea gravel?

[Hilde]

Originally Posted by Aswain

Roughly how much mts am I gonna need for 1 inch layer?

Can I use one inch layer of mts and one inch layer of cap?

And can i use Any type of rock for a cap/top layer?

Perhaps this substrate calc.

How thick depends on what you use. If use sand a fingers width is enough.

Rock needs to be 3ml. Walsted used pool filter gravel which I couldn't find. I have tried the play sand, pool filter and river sand. River sand is the easiest to keep clean. It doesn't need rinsing as the other sands do. I just sift out the small pieces of gravel. When I didn't I had little pieces float up to the top of the water. The color is brown. After a year the top is turning black. Some use red bag kitty litter and leveling gravel. In some states they have impurities in them, such as coal. Here in Georgia no problems with either of them.

[nonconductive]

Originally Posted by DogFish

I alway smile when I read Discus keeping comments. Here they are in the wild in Brazil. Look how fragile they are and how pristine the habitat is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwDCseB-D0Y

I was fortunate to meet & hear Jack Watley speak in the 90's. One thing he said that stuck with me is, "You don't really think that water is 84 degrees 2' below the surface, do you?"

i have to laugh about the discus mumbo too. they do fine with soil. but some moron will come in and preach about how its bad for them and they need 50% WC's every other day.
oh yea, they'll also tell you they wont live below 80F. which is a joke.

[DogFish]

I remember when the choices were brown discus or brown discus. Once in a blue moon you would see a Heckle.

Wild caught are always fragile due to traveling across the globe not because they are fragile in nature.

Maybe back when Schimdt-Frocke started pushing the DNA with those designer colors is were all that "most delicate" fish in the hobby business started???

I can see how mutating the fish to such a man made extreme could affect the hardiness. Look at the man influenced evolution of the carp to the fancy gold fish. Todays Oranda might survive a a few days in the wild vs a carp which are nearly impossible to eradicate.

[Robert H]

have to laugh about the discus mumbo too. they do fine with soil. but some moron will come in and preach about how its bad for them and they need 50% WC's every other day.
oh yea, they'll also tell you they wont live below 80F. which is a joke.

OK.. I hope thats not me. I am sure Discus would be fine in soil if everything is stable, but for a newbie who has never done this before, and the fact that soil does leach ammonia I wouldn't think that would be the best choice. Thats my opinion. Discus are sensitive to ammonia and nitrate, and water quality. That is a pretty much uncontested fact in any discus forum and any book. I have never heard anyone who has kept Discus suggest they are not sensitive. It is what makes the fish considered difficult to keep for beginners. Do a google search on proper discus care. Basic Discus 101.

Thanks for all the help guys. I decided on bare bottom for now.

That is pretty common in the Discus world as well. Many Discus purists refuse to keep them in anything but bare bottom

[nonconductive]

no not you, just the fascists. i have kept discus off an on for years, more recently in soil based tanks. its really no different than keeping them with ADA or something similar.

[Robert H]

Cool. In the discus community there are two opposing sides... pro plant and pro bare bottom. C02 scare a lot of these people too.

With discus is fluorite onyx sand ok for discus? Package say will not alter water, but I have read it dose. Any thoughs of using this with discus?

Onyx in inert. I don't know how it affects pH. As far as I know other than that it should be fine.

That video is pretty cool too. If you read in the comments, the guy states the water parameters in the river and lake:

the water temperature in the igarapé is 26c , the ph is 5,5 in the open lake is 6,0 , conductivity is 20 us/cm , i'm think in the rain season is very different ....

Ammonia or nitrate does not build up in open water.

[Aswain]

Here are pics of my tank set up. I put onyx sand from seachem in it for now.