sick of ICH!
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Old 11-23-2004, 02:57 PM   #1
DJ.net
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sick of ICH!


ive been treating my 55g comunity for about 8 days now with malachite green and formalyn.

my comunity consists of
2x dwarf guorami
1x perl guorami
10x neon tetras
3x khuli loaches
1x hillstream loach
3x otos
7x guppies (moved to 10gal for treatment)
and countless guppy fry

i have used the last of the meds this morning and the tetras, 4week fry, and 1 dwarf are showing spots and the otos are scratching.
the guppies i moved have almost cleard up 100% but thats only after loading the aquarium with salt/ich meds.

the problem i have been having is trying to keep everyone happ while treating.
salt in the 55 is a bad idea becuse of the scaleless fish in there (otos, hillstream, tetras, and khulis) also the temp has to stay low (no more than 79)for the hillstream. also i have to treat the comunity with a lower dose of the ich meds so it seems like its not affecting the ich at all in the 55.

so heres my plan

first off im tearing down the 55 soon and removeing the substrait. the comunity will be housed in a 30gal bucket for a fue hours with heat filtration and all my plant. the tank will be hosed out and wiped clean with isoproyal alcihol (if that wont harm my fish).
im replaceing the substrait with play sand since it looks so much beter and the khulis need it. im also replacing my filter media and bleaching filter/heater/airlines to kill any leftover paracites. im going for a 100% water change and along with a substrait change i shold be able to take a bite out of this ich outbreak by doing that.
after the teardown i plan on leaving the plants in the rubermaid and treating them with malachitegreen for 3-4 days just to be on the safe side (after much reserch i found out it sholdnt harm any of my plants). and im also going to contiue treating the comunity with a stronger dose of meds (about 75% of what they suggest for fullsize fish).

im defantly going to get a 40watt uv steralizer on a 5 hour a day timer just to make shure this dosnt happen agan. but i cant afford one ATM.

the khulis started this whole mess! they didnt take to the assimalation even tho i driped tankwater for over an hour and made shure the temps where perfect. i think they didnt like the gravel and that stressed them out soo much they broke out in ich.

is there anything ive missed? anything els i shold or can do?? i cant enjoy my fish at all like this and they cant enjoy life like this ither.
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Old 11-23-2004, 05:04 PM   #2
Inzeos
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3-4 day treatment period is shorter than the lifecycle of ich, that may be one of your problems.
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Old 11-23-2004, 05:13 PM   #3
DJ.net
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inzeos
3-4 day treatment period is shorter than the lifecycle of ich, that may be one of your problems.
its been 8 days since i started. the 3-4 days is for the plants, if theres any ich on the plants it has to be free swiming. the only time malachite green is affective is while the paracite is in its freeswiming form so realy on my plants it shold only take 12 hours or so to kill... but 3-4 days will be a forshure way to kill anything that may be hanging out on my plants
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Old 11-23-2004, 08:54 PM   #4
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Ich will take a while to treat, It took me 3 weeks to get rid of it and my fish had it bad! Every one of my Cardinals were covered with it. I didn't add any chemicals to the water, I turned the temp up to 80 did and 50% water changes every day or two. You will want to make sure your fish keep eating to help them fight the disease. I fed mine mostly freeze dried bloodworms. I had 2 hillstream loaches and they got through everything fine. I didn't lose a single fish during the whole ordeal.
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Old 11-23-2004, 09:02 PM   #5
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I used the heat/salt method in my 55G tank when I had ich and it worked great, with no plant or fish loss. To let you know my tank has Tetras, loaches & Ottos. Here is the link I used... http://aquaden.com/phpBB2/articles2.php?type=fishwhat

Remember you need to continue treatment for about a week after the last white spot disappears.
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Old 11-23-2004, 10:12 PM   #6
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Hang in there!
Here's somethings I learned after battling many ich cases.

Doing a substrate change with your fish sick with ich is asking for disaster. It will increase the stress and lower their immune defenses. You should check your water parameters first. OFten the fish are weakened due to soemthing wrong with the water. healthy fish in a good tank won't develop ich even if a sick fish is introduced.
Eliminate any sources of stress and your fish will recover faster adn resist reinfection.

Malachite and fomalyn for me takes at least 2 weeks to get rid of ich. Its taken me 1 month with stronger infestations (this is for a heat resistant strain, stil alive at 92F).
I would recommend coppersafe or using another copper salt based drug such aquarisol. Coppersafe is the best by far and contrary to the label it does not harm plants. One treatment lasts 1 month. Also vacuuming the substrate will get rid of the ich cysts before tehy turn into free swimming parasites.
Here is a good link
http://aquaden.com/phpBB2/articles.php?type=four


I tried aquarisol after 2 weeks of malachite and formalin. Daily dosing of aquarisol cleared it up in a week. Ich didnt come back either. It also seems to invigorate teh fish and stimulate appetite.
Don't use UV if you are using malachite. It will break down your malachite green.
Oh and use plenty of aeration. These drugs can lower the oxygen content of water.
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Old 11-24-2004, 12:01 AM   #7
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Not really a problem with plants while using copper, but rather with invertebrates.
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Old 11-24-2004, 04:04 PM   #8
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thanks alot every one.
un fortunatly i already started the tear down and I'm half way done... so there's no turning back. but the good news is, all teh fish with major infections are in my 10 gall med tank so i think it might be ok to go threw with the tear down anyhow. also after i inspected all teh fish closer i noticed the tetras have cleared up allot, so it might not be so bad to drain and switch substrate to rid the tank of the free swimming ich. I'm getting more meds tonight and i think i might go with either coper safe or 75%pure malachite instead of the formalin/malachite mix with that i might be able to dose more acuratly and not have to worry about killing the tetras. the bottle i have currently doesn't tell you what the % of malachite green is at all so i have to conform to the bottles guidelines.....

i use my test kit on a bi weekly basis and all results came up 0 except nitrite witch was at 10-15ppm the last time i checked. i think the reason it got so out of had was the fact that i didnt see any signs in my khuli loches till it was a full blown outbreak. also i believe the khulis had ICH when i purchased them but there where no cysts on them yet.

(i went to the pet shop last night and forgot to post this)

so now I'm done. i changed out the gravel with sand without removing any fish and didn't lose a single one. there was a bit of stress but i added the sand over 2-3 hours to keep the silt down and also to keep the fish happy.
after i refilled the tank and had my sand in, i use my python to ad water slowly while i pumped water out my window from the other side of the tank. i did this for about 2 hours while keeping the temp between 75-80 and adding declhorinator as it flushed.

i think i did the major water change at the right time since i see very few cycst on any of my fish. i think the medications in combination with this major water change just might take car of the ich. i will continue medicating until i haven't seen any signs for a week and by then i should have the UV seralizer and can hopefully ditch anti parasitic meds forever.
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Old 12-09-2004, 11:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trenac
I used the heat/salt method in my 55G tank when I had ich and it worked great, with no plant or fish loss. To let you know my tank has Tetras, loaches & Ottos. Here is the link I used... http://aquaden.com/phpBB2/articles2.php?type=fishwhat

Remember you need to continue treatment for about a week after the last white spot disappears.
great site! very clearly written.
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