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Cerges' Reactor - DIY Inline CO2 Reactor

438K views 906 replies 222 participants last post by  iltwort 
#1 ·
Have to thank our Russian friends for this one. After playing with the Rex Griggs reactor I wanted to try something else. Principal and cost are about the same design is different.

http://translate.google.com/transla...yjj_reaktor_so2.html&sl=ru&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8

What you will need:

Omni OB1 Series A House Filter
2- 1/2" Male Threaded Adaptors with Barb end
2- 3/4" 90 degree Street fitting
2- 3/4" PVC Male Adaptor
2- 3/4" x 1/2" PVC Bushing
1- 3/4" CPVC Coupling - Note this has to be CPVC not PVC as the PVC fittings are too big
1- 6 3/4" x 3/4" CPVC Pipe - Again has to be CPVC and not PVC
PVC Primer and Cement
CO2 Tubing
Teflon Thread Tape
Scissors
Needle Nose Pliers
Filter Tubing
Drill and Drill bit for your CO2 Tubing

Total cost as ~ $23 each about the same as the Rex Griggs inline reactor if you don't use clear pvc.

Filter Housing:





Start by removing the Priming Button via the screw on the inside of the lid for the housing:




Drill out the hole to accept your CO2 tubing this hole shpould be smaller then your CO2 Tubing so it creates its' own seal.



Cut the CO2 tubing at a sharp angle so you can stick it through and pull it with the needle nose pliers. This should be slightly tough to pull through as it will create a seal as you pull the tubing through.





Cut the CPVC pipe off at 6 3/4", if you are using a different filter you may have to adjust the cut off length. I cut mine so it was about 3/4" off the bottom. Push the CPVC coupler over the nipple in the lid, should fit really snug. Then push the CPVC pipe into the coupler. I didn't glue this together as it was a snug fit and should be under little pressure.




Lay out and glue the fittings together, with the fitting I chose you won't need any extra 3/4" pipe as all the fittings go together.





Attach the fittings to each side jsut make sure you hook them up according to the Flow marking on the lid. Finished Product.



I will update tomorrow once I install these as to how effective they are, but based on looks they should function really well. According to the article I linked to about he got a .5 PH change in a matter of minutes.

Craig
 
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#500 ·
Hi again,

OK, so I've scoured various threads and other sites and can't find a clear answer to another (rather obvious) question from a credible source. If you have a big old canister filter, why not feed the co2 into the inbound hose? Wouldn't the impeller and all the travel through the hoses and media etc. mix it up nicely with the water so when it comes out into the tank it is dispersed? I'm guessing one possible answer is that the co2 level in the filter might muck with the bacteria. Maybe there is something even more obvious. I read something about voiding warranties but that doesn't really pass the "so what?" test... Thanks for any answers!
 
#501 ·
Most people have or, will try it at some point. It will work as you would expect but, the CO2 will also accumulate into large bubbles inside the filter and then belch out the bubbles every once in awhile. It becomes annoying to see and makes you think you are wasting CO2. Maybe not the best solution but, will work until you put together a better solution.
 
#502 ·
Your intuition is correct. The thought is that the inbound CO2 acdifies the water and creates a less than an ideal environment for the bacteria. There is also the reality that the CO2 won't dissolve entirely and will create pockets in the filter, making noise and other problems, especially if your pump is in the top of the canister. There are plenty of people who do inject right into the canister and I'm sure have good results. I know I used to, and although the accumulated CO2 was an annoyance, beyond that I can't think of anyone or any "study" that concluded that it was a bad thing. Trouble with my setup is that I run an FX5 which moves about 5 gallons per minute real world, and not a lot of CO2 was getting dissolved before either making a bubble on the underside of the lid, or getting blasted into the tank due to pressure (both actually - the bubble would get big enough and the filter would shotgun it into the tank rather dramatically). That also meant that to get to desired levels of CO2 in the water, I wasted a lot of it. With the Cerges, I halved my bubble count and get better solution.

I have never heard of a warranty being denied for CO2 injection. I suppose it could happen but I would be really interested in hearing the manufacturer explain why ;)

sjb1987: 500 gph "real flow" would probably be way too much. I have a Mag 5 which is in that range and I have to throttle it back with a ball valve on the output side, even with the scrubbies in there. Trouble is that manufacturers LIE about their true flow rates so trying to figure out what will or won't work is daunting. I would go for more than you think you need and then design in a way to restrict flow to a useable rate either with a gate or ball valve of some kind. Also think about removing/cleaning these things a bit ahead of time. Priming them is a pain so putting valves/unions on the piping is going to make R and R a lot easier.
 
#503 ·
thanks for the response moose.... i have a cerges reactor on my 75 gal with a 750gph pump but i "y"ed off the pump so it probably only has about 300gph goin through it... im setting up a new 40b and will be using the cfs500 from aquatraders.com and they are rated for 500gph and push every bit of it too..i did not want to "y" off this setup due to lack of space.. ill do some playin around with my 75 and see if i can get close to around 500gph on the reactor side
thanks
 
#504 ·
Thank you for the responses. I'm thinking of a 70 gallon and will probably put an FX7 or comparable on it. Clearly, I need to avoid running the co2 into the filter. BTW, you are correct regarding the fabricated throughput numbers: I recently saw this referenced in the small print in a mfg's literature -- they said the throughput was measured without any media or trays in the filter and with no tubing. Nice touch! The only good news is they probably all do it so you have an apples to apples situation when comparing filters. Thank you all again.
 
#505 ·
I don't know if you've checked out some of the mods people do to the CFS500, but they're pretty interesting. I have one as a backup. Used it for about a year before I upgraded to the FX5 which is like it's big brother. The CFS500 doesn't have any media baskets in it so modding it made sense. Check out the thread(s) by CWO4GUNNER here and on APC. Informative. Be aware that they've updated their lids and improved the filter as time went on so that the problems people were complaining about early in these threads were more or less all addressed. I bought mine off of TopDogSellers on e-bay. They were quick to make me happy when I had issues (I broke the down-tube on my first one - not the filter's fault. I was being a derpy derp).



http://goo.gl/joDM4

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=123496#post1235512

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=117191
 
#507 ·
I tried adding the 2 scrubbers and it didn't really help. The small microbubbles get sucked right through.

Even when I turn the flow down low enough that the large bubbles only make it a few inches down the housing, the microbubbles still make it all the way to the bottom. I'm surprised I'm having this problem with the 20" housing. I must have been getting down to 200gph or so.

Any other suggestions? I'm about to give up and use a separate small pump to drive the reactor, which is disappointing since I would never have built a 20" Cerges if I knew was going to have to run a separate pump for it anyway.
 
#508 ·
I'm not sure how to answer you. The point of a CO2 reactor is to get CO2 into the water. It's not a filter. GPH shouldn't even be factored here, within reason. If it takes 80 or 100 GPH or less and dissolves the desired amount of CO2 into the water, what's the problem? Circulating that water is the job of the main filter, and whatever else you have in the tank to facilitate movement.
 
#509 ·
I was trying to minimize equipment and also minimize the amount of stuff in my tank. I had read that people were using 20 inch Cerges with larger flows than I planned for so I thought it would work.

Having to run it on a separate line isn't killer but its less than desirable.
 
#512 ·
:) Got mine built with the 20" Housing.

First i went with the Mag 5 for the easy setup, but ending up don't like the noise from the pump. So i switched to QuietOne pump (a little more $$$ but it's definitely stop the noise but of course the durability might not be comparable to the Mag 5). Also i went ahead and put in two value at the intake, return hose for easy access if need services the filter.

Thanks for the help m00se n write up.
 
#514 ·
I had a Quiet One 1200. They use rubber O-rings on the intake and output barbs. They leaked from day one. It sounded like an old truck running. Luckily I only paid $20 I think. It was a clearance item at Petsmart. Not that the Supreme is silent. It rattles a bit too. Just quieter than the Quiet One LOL...oh, and it doesn't leak (yet). I'm looking at those screws that hold the impeller cover on and thinking "what were THEY thinking when they used these sheet metal screws screwed directly into the plastic motor housing, and how many times can I get away with cleaning this thing before these holes are stripped"....

Jus sayin..
 
#515 ·
Leros,
Yeah ? i thought Mag 9.5 would be loud so i didn't order plus it's little more $$ too. I got the QuietOne 4000 on amazon. I replaced the Mag 5 which reduced a lot noise so i am much happier. I'll give a try on the Mag 9.5 if this QuietOne break down.

M00se,
Yea they come with the rubber O-rings on both end, but i am ending up didn't use them. So far, my setup didn't have any leaks yet :hihi:
I think they designed the QO 4000 little different than the 1200, maybe? i haven't fully open the pump yet but i don't recall seeing any screws. Well it's a super deal on the $12 pump, :biggrin: you can't ask for more. Oh yea, i got the intake and return line reduced down to 1/2" to fit my eheim installation set 1-2.

This reactor is awesome, plus when coming to kill BBA. i'll just have to turn off the main filter and let this guy push the water.:proud:

My PH is at 6.4 now.
 
#516 ·
Good to hear. Yea the Mag 9 would be a little (lot) big for this reactor. Going in I thought I'd need to move a LOT more water than I ended up needing. In retrospect I think I could have gotten away with a Maxi Jet 1200. As it is I have the Mag throttled way back to keep bubbles out of the aquarium. My drop checker is lemon yellow.

Cheers
 
#518 ·
Is anyone here using these on larger tanks like 155gal or so? And would it be better to run this one on a separate line for a large tank or inline with a good canister filter?? Trying to weigh my options on a large tank I am about to start. Thanks!
 
#519 ·
I can only try to give you my experience with the 20" tall unit on a 40b. I run a Mag 7 through it with 3/4" lines, and have it choked back to probably half flow with a ball valve. I put a scrubby in the filter body to reduce the tiny bubbles in the tank, and I have the output going to a spray bar on the opposite side of the tank from the main filter intake, where I also monitor pH with a drop checker. On a 150g tank I would think it could work but I would definitely recommend that you NOT put it on your filter returns. That makes it difficult to control the flow through the unit and restricts your options accordingly. You might want to consider a sump for a tank that big. That would cut down or eliminate the Seven-Up bubbles in the tank issue. You would seal off the sump in a way that doesn't allow the CO2 to escape. If I'm not mistaken I think that's how Tom Barr does it (plantbrain).

Good luck!
 
#524 · (Edited)
Yes, thanks much, I was leaning more towards that one and hook a mag 5-12 to a separate line.I have tried to use a sump system and CO2, sealing off the sump and feeding it up the return line (like I have seen done many times) but I cannot get an efficient system on a sump system, I have tried and failed. It takes too long to achieve decent CO2 levels, lots of bubbles regardless if I use a glass diffuser or open line, and CO2 waste is at a high level to justify using that way. So I am just thinking of running a canister filter or two for a 150+ gal tank I will be doing soon, and just run a separate line.


I have a 20" long Cerge's with a Rio 2500HP running wide open in the sump [Rios come with handy dandy ball valves and it is on the pump] of my 6' long 180 gallon tank. The output comes up through the overflow box and ends with a loc line return with no nozzle on it that complements the output from the Laguna Max Flo 1500 pump. I see a few very small bubbles in the tank that might be from the reactor but not enough to be noticeable even looking through the long end of the tank.

It takes 10-15 minutes for the last of the gas to be dissolved after it turns off in the evening. Wouldn't choking back the pump just allow more gas to build up in the device as there is less tumbling of the gas bubbles?

I don't know if CO2 is circulating efficiently or not but the drop checkers are currently parked high and low on the end of the tank with the returns pointed away from them and overflow box and they do get yellow green. Not sure when they get yellow green though.

If you look through my current journal you can see photos of the sump set up and usually I post a photo of what the tank looks like from the end.
Thanks for the info, I tried using a reactor (in a sump system) with a little maxi jet before with little luck, so maybe it just needed more flow from a better pump. I will check the pix, I always like checking out sump systems in use with CO2 since I cannot get it to work right. But I tell ya I see pix of your tank and it looks great, but I dont see any pix of the actual sump.
 
#520 ·
I have a 20" long Cerge's with a Rio 2500HP running wide open in the sump [Rios come with handy dandy ball valves and it is on the pump] of my 6' long 180 gallon tank. The output comes up through the overflow box and ends with a loc line return with no nozzle on it that complements the output from the Laguna Max Flo 1500 pump. I see a few very small bubbles in the tank that might be from the reactor but not enough to be noticeable even looking through the long end of the tank.

It takes 10-15 minutes for the last of the gas to be dissolved after it turns off in the evening. Wouldn't choking back the pump just allow more gas to build up in the device as there is less tumbling of the gas bubbles?

I don't know if CO2 is circulating efficiently or not but the drop checkers are currently parked high and low on the end of the tank with the returns pointed away from them and overflow box and they do get yellow green. Not sure when they get yellow green though.

If you look through my current journal you can see photos of the sump set up and usually I post a photo of what the tank looks like from the end.
 
#521 ·
It takes 10-15 minutes for the last of the gas to be dissolved after it turns off in the evening. Wouldn't choking back the pump just allow more gas to build up in the device as there is less tumbling of the gas bubbles?

Yes, it has to be balanced via the bubble count. It seems about 4 BPS is the sweet spot fizz vs. CO2 buildup on my system. I get canary yellow in the DC.
 
#522 ·
After reading this thread i picked up a dupont whole house filter with a bypass switch and a see through housing on sale at menards for $25. I plan on using it on a 20g long diy project i am planning. My goal is to use it with diy co2 to get started and upgrade to pressurized as i go. I dont have a canister filter yet and i am curious if i can just put a mag2 pump on this reactor and some filter pad material in it and make a combo filter/reactor out of it? I plan on heavily planting the tank so my thinking is that it would provide enough filtration and water movement for the dozen tetras i am wanting to keep in there.
 
#523 ·
No reason why you couldn't. Just please pay attention to my admonishment regarding vaseline on the seals and cover threads. If you don't do that you're gonna have a hard time. Keep us posted!

*Oh and MAKE SURE you have a WORKING check valve on a setup like that!*
 
#525 ·
I saw the bit about the vaseline and a check valve will be included. I will be doing a build thread with this tank soon and it will be my first planted tank even though i have been keeping fish my whole life. My goal is to do as much diy as i can starting with a custom cfl light hood and upgrade plans for a custom led/heater as i learn more about wiring them up.

If the 20 long tinker project works well i will be redoing a 46g bowfront as well. It is in the living room and my wife is picky so any diy there will have to be refined.
 
#527 ·
OK, so I’ve done some more research, re-read the threads and I have another question:

On the basic set up, water exits tank, runs through the filter, gets injected with C02 either immediately before entering the reactor or Co2 is fed into the reactor through a hole in the top. Water and Co2 mix in the reactor and are then returned to the tank.

Some people have problems with this system in that bubbles still appear. This seems to happen when the gph volume is over +/- 150gph but there seem to be other reasons too.

Why not put an “inline” diffuser (Eg: Atomic) before the reactor?

One benefit to this is that the diffuser arrives as a kit (eg: ready to install on 16/22mm pipe if use Eheimand (I think) two other sizes) and it is probably easier to put it inline than it is to find the parts and make up a “T” that fits.

Wouldn’t this make the reactor even more effective at eliminating visible bubbles?
 
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