Collected lots of bacopa and others

**rainbuilder** · 07-02-2012, 08:37 PM

I found lots of bacopa and 2 other species at a creek near my cousins' house. These plants have popped up this summer because I have never seen them before. The two that were found growing in clumps with the bacopa will be used as a riparium plant and the bacopa is going in my 75. Just thought I would share my discovery! I may introduce fissidens fontanus to the creek, as it is a native moss and would be fun to collect it from the creek. The only fish living there are tons of mosquito fish. Maybe I should introduce some predators from the lake near my house?

steven p · 07-02-2012, 09:32 PM

Dont toy with nature... The local fisherman probly have enough trouble with introduced invasive species...

**rainbuilder** · 07-02-2012, 09:45 PM

This is a suburban creek, so no worries there. I understand the effects of toying with nature and definitely do not plan on introducing anything that is not native to the area around the creek.

steven p · 07-02-2012, 09:50 PM

That creek is connected to larger waterways? If the big fish wanted to be there, they would.

pucksr · 07-02-2012, 09:59 PM

So, you guys are worried that he is introducing native species to man-made creek against the wishes of the "creek gods"? Why? You put fish inside of glass boxes in your house?

Look, the one thing I would warn you about is that moss species are difficult to ID(the local variety may actually be a special sub-species) and you don't want to be the guy responsible for introducing an invasive species. I would probably recommend that if you are introducing species of either flora or fauna that you harvest from a local source.

Besides that minor recommendation I think that all sounds awesome. Any interesting invertebrates living in the creek?

**rainbuilder** · 07-02-2012, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pucksr

So, you guys are worried that he is introducing native species to man-made creek against the wishes of the "creek gods"? Why? You put fish inside of glass boxes in your house?

Look, the one thing I would warn you about is that moss species are difficult to ID(the local variety may actually be a special sub-species) and you don't want to be the guy responsible for introducing an invasive species. I would probably recommend that if you are introducing species of either flora or fauna that you harvest from a local source.

Besides that minor recommendation I think that all sounds awesome. Any interesting invertebrates living in the creek?

Thank you! I am not planning to introduce any species that are not collected within an hour or two from the location (with the exception of moss, which may or may not be a good idea). I actually live on a lake an hour away from the location, and that is where the fish would come from. It is only a drainage creek that leads nowhere except for a few private ponds as far as I can tell. Or so google earth tells me. There aren't any invertebrates there, but there are many many many mosquito fish. The biodiversity of the creek has been going up though, and I am happy to see that.

As far as species I want to bring there, there is a native species of pennywort in my lake and a species of blacksomething topminnow. Looks like this. I think this little creek is going to be neat to watch progress.

pucksr · 07-02-2012, 10:40 PM

The moss thing just has me worried. That moss wasn't even popular until the last decade. I have no idea when it was classified, and most references I find to it mention it being from "the USA". I see you are from Texas, and given the diverse number of ecosystems that the Texas river systems play into and the number of invasive aquatic species that they have had issue with I would refrain from taking any living material out of an aquarium and putting it into "the wild".

Sorry, as a Texan myself who has seen some of the rivers around San Antonio get choked by invasive weeds, I would be somewhat nervous about an unwelcome guest being in your moss. Then again, thanks to some of the worst efforts in the world to protect the waterways I think most of the damage has already been done.

**gordonrichards** · 07-02-2012, 11:06 PM

Adding predators to an area where there aren't any?

Thinking that you won't introduce anything invasive from a lake an "hour away"

Parasites, bacteria, algae introductions ever come to your mind?

If its not in the local water way then it shouldn't be introduced there.

You want to decimate a population of fish that hinders the progressive growth of mosquito populations in your area?

Check the black lists to see what plants aren't supposed to be in Texas.

You realize you can get fined by your state? Consult with your local fish and wildlife to see the repercussions.

Want to donate your time making the waterways look nice in your area?
Contact your county and you may be able to get some funding to do so.

Just my 2 cents. I haven't introduced any plants or fish to any local waters.

-Gordon

**rainbuilder** · 07-02-2012, 11:45 PM

Thanks for the feedback guys. Don't think I'll take anything to introduce. What I was thinking though, is that it would be nice to have a more diverse ecosystem in the area, especially a suburban drainage ditch. I know all about the plants that are not allowed, my father is actually in TPWD and knows all the laws and information around this. I actually just asked him and he said that it's not legal to transport fish to other waterways... The feedback to introducing things is nice, it is good to know so many of you guys care so much about local ecosystems.

**ThatGuyWithTheFish** · 07-02-2012, 11:49 PM

Phew, I'm glad you didn't. I remember a thread where someone else was going to release "native" fish, and basically said "screw you" when he ignored us and went ahead with it anyways. NEVER put anything from a tank into local waters.

pucksr · 07-03-2012, 02:56 PM

Everyone, while I agree with you all about never putting things from tanks into local water...I think everyone needs to relax about him 'stocking' the small creek by his house with local fish.

1) Mosquito fish do NOT control mosquitos
2) Texas(particularly South Texas) has a 'flooded creek system'. These creeks vary between going bone dry and being partially wet. Some creeks become isolated temporarily or even dry up temporarily. It is not uncommon for one of these waterways to only have a few small fish. He will not hurt anything by introducing a slightly larger fish species from a local waterway into the creek. He should be careful and introduce them slowly, but it isn't as if he is messing with a delicate balance. This creek will most likely flood in September and dry up sometime in the next year.

@gordonrichards
This isn't Long Island. All of the rivers in Texas are interconnected waterways. The ecosystem is actually remarkably like the Amazon. At the very least, all waters meet in the bays before the Gulf of Mexico. These bays are only "brackish", and frequently allow freshwater organisms from one river to move to another. The frequent flooding and mixing means that it is almost impossible for him to introduce a species from one river that is not already present in another river. Even if he grabs an invasive species(like Tilapia) from a local lake and places it in his creek, the odds of it further invading local waters is nil because if it is in the local lake then it has already invaded local waters.

07-02-2012, 08:37 PM	#1
rainbuilder Planted Tank Enthusiast (View User Tanks) PTrader: (28/100%) Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 795	Collected lots of bacopa and others I found lots of bacopa and 2 other species at a creek near my cousins' house. These plants have popped up this summer because I have never seen them before. The two that were found growing in clumps with the bacopa will be used as a riparium plant and the bacopa is going in my 75. Just thought I would share my discovery! I may introduce fissidens fontanus to the creek, as it is a native moss and would be fun to collect it from the creek. The only fish living there are tons of mosquito fish. Maybe I should introduce some predators from the lake near my house? __________________ RAOK Club #38 Fraternity of Dirt #91 45 gallon hexagon 'Smooth Hillside'

07-02-2012, 09:45 PM	#3
rainbuilder Planted Tank Enthusiast (View User Tanks) PTrader: (28/100%) Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 795	This is a suburban creek, so no worries there. I understand the effects of toying with nature and definitely do not plan on introducing anything that is not native to the area around the creek. __________________ RAOK Club #38 Fraternity of Dirt #91 45 gallon hexagon 'Smooth Hillside'

07-02-2012, 11:45 PM	#9
rainbuilder Planted Tank Enthusiast (View User Tanks) PTrader: (28/100%) Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 795	Thanks for the feedback guys. Don't think I'll take anything to introduce. What I was thinking though, is that it would be nice to have a more diverse ecosystem in the area, especially a suburban drainage ditch. I know all about the plants that are not allowed, my father is actually in TPWD and knows all the laws and information around this. I actually just asked him and he said that it's not legal to transport fish to other waterways... The feedback to introducing things is nice, it is good to know so many of you guys care so much about local ecosystems. __________________ RAOK Club #38 Fraternity of Dirt #91 45 gallon hexagon 'Smooth Hillside'

07-02-2012, 11:49 PM	#10
ThatGuyWithTheFish Honeycomb Cats! (View User Tanks) PTrader: (18/100%) Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Boston Posts: 1,666	Phew, I'm glad you didn't. I remember a thread where someone else was going to release "native" fish, and basically said "screw you" when he ignored us and went ahead with it anyways. NEVER put anything from a tank into local waters. __________________ 20G Long Hi-Tech: My Golden Rule of planted tanks: WWTAD- "What would Takashi Amano do?" RAOK Club #69

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07-02-2012, 09:32 PM	#2
steven p Wannabe Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: columbus, ne Posts: 1,051	Dont toy with nature... The local fisherman probly have enough trouble with introduced invasive species...

07-02-2012, 09:50 PM	#4
steven p Wannabe Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: columbus, ne Posts: 1,051	That creek is connected to larger waterways? If the big fish wanted to be there, they would.

07-02-2012, 09:59 PM	#5
pucksr Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 40	So, you guys are worried that he is introducing native species to man-made creek against the wishes of the "creek gods"? Why? You put fish inside of glass boxes in your house? Look, the one thing I would warn you about is that moss species are difficult to ID(the local variety may actually be a special sub-species) and you don't want to be the guy responsible for introducing an invasive species. I would probably recommend that if you are introducing species of either flora or fauna that you harvest from a local source. Besides that minor recommendation I think that all sounds awesome. Any interesting invertebrates living in the creek?

07-02-2012, 10:40 PM	#7
pucksr Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 40	The moss thing just has me worried. That moss wasn't even popular until the last decade. I have no idea when it was classified, and most references I find to it mention it being from "the USA". I see you are from Texas, and given the diverse number of ecosystems that the Texas river systems play into and the number of invasive aquatic species that they have had issue with I would refrain from taking any living material out of an aquarium and putting it into "the wild". Sorry, as a Texan myself who has seen some of the rivers around San Antonio get choked by invasive weeds, I would be somewhat nervous about an unwelcome guest being in your moss. Then again, thanks to some of the worst efforts in the world to protect the waterways I think most of the damage has already been done.

07-02-2012, 11:06 PM	#8
gordonrichards Planted Tank Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (299/99%) Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Huntington Station, NY Posts: 4,417	Adding predators to an area where there aren't any? Thinking that you won't introduce anything invasive from a lake an "hour away" Parasites, bacteria, algae introductions ever come to your mind? If its not in the local water way then it shouldn't be introduced there. You want to decimate a population of fish that hinders the progressive growth of mosquito populations in your area? Check the black lists to see what plants aren't supposed to be in Texas. You realize you can get fined by your state? Consult with your local fish and wildlife to see the repercussions. Want to donate your time making the waterways look nice in your area? Contact your county and you may be able to get some funding to do so. Just my 2 cents. I haven't introduced any plants or fish to any local waters. -Gordon

07-03-2012, 02:56 PM	#11
pucksr Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 40	Everyone, while I agree with you all about never putting things from tanks into local water...I think everyone needs to relax about him 'stocking' the small creek by his house with local fish. 1) Mosquito fish do NOT control mosquitos 2) Texas(particularly South Texas) has a 'flooded creek system'. These creeks vary between going bone dry and being partially wet. Some creeks become isolated temporarily or even dry up temporarily. It is not uncommon for one of these waterways to only have a few small fish. He will not hurt anything by introducing a slightly larger fish species from a local waterway into the creek. He should be careful and introduce them slowly, but it isn't as if he is messing with a delicate balance. This creek will most likely flood in September and dry up sometime in the next year. @gordonrichards This isn't Long Island. All of the rivers in Texas are interconnected waterways. The ecosystem is actually remarkably like the Amazon. At the very least, all waters meet in the bays before the Gulf of Mexico. These bays are only "brackish", and frequently allow freshwater organisms from one river to move to another. The frequent flooding and mixing means that it is almost impossible for him to introduce a species from one river that is not already present in another river. Even if he grabs an invasive species(like Tilapia) from a local lake and places it in his creek, the odds of it further invading local waters is nil because if it is in the local lake then it has already invaded local waters.