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A heads up on Eco-Complete Planted substrate

25K views 28 replies 13 participants last post by  easttech 
#1 ·
This stuff claims not to alter pH, KH or GH so I thought it was a safe bet for a good plant substrate.

I was told that several years back, this substrate had a few reports of altering the water but obviously the Eco-Complete Planted substrate still has an issue with raising pH. I say this because I have added a total of 100 lbs of this stuff to my tank since I've been rescaping things, and my pH went from 6.4 to 7.2 after completing the substrate transfer. I did this slowly over the course of a three-four weeks thank goodness otherwise my fish may not have had time to adjust. I have Mopani Driftwood and Manzanita Driftwood in the tank, and still the pH is 7.2. The KH raised from 1 to 3 and the GH is about the same at 5.

I just thought others should be aware that when adding this stuff to your tank, you might have some bags that will toy with your pH, KH and GH, so use caution if you have fish in the tank.

I have Angels and others that appreciate a lower pH so I am hoping it will gradually settle back down just below neutral at least.
 
#4 ·
I rinsed and rinsed and rinsed then soaked for 24 hours (got busy doing something else) then rinsed again and again until the water poured off crystal clear. So there wasn't a drop of the liquid left.

It does specify its important to rinse thoroughly if there is fish in the tank but no where on the bag...even the fine print I did not find it to say it would alter things.
 
#5 ·
I have had the same problem with ECO When I bought it 6 years ago. It claims to be inert but it isnt. I have had it alter my chem for about 6-9 months before it evened out and started to drop back down. I havent used any since and probably wont anymore. It isnt a bad substraight but when you try to keep softwater fish it isnt good. Just my 2 cents,

Curt
 
#7 ·
It is inert. That's based on experience from tons of Planted Tankers and from data provided by CaribSea.

It does have a high CEC, though, which means it can absorb things and release them slowly over time. Which seems to be what's happening.
Ok then how do you explaine having water that was 6.6 ph out of tap with a GH of 2, and a KH of 4. Going up to a ph of 7.4, Gh of 6 and Kh of 8 in 24 hours with a new bag of ECO rinsed about 2 hours till water was clear then soaked over night, and rinsed again? It happened to me on 2 seperate occasions with 2 seperate tanks, 6 years ago. And didnt even out for 6-9 months before I was able to get the numbers to drop again.

Im not saying this is a bad substraight an mabye I had a bad bag, but 2 times in 2 tanks that were built 6 months appart?

Just saying,

Curt
 
#9 ·
EC substrate uses volcanic rock as a base material.
RobertH and several others (including me) have had disagreements on it effecting water parameters and what is it they wet it with??? Claiming that it contains things needed by plants and 'active bacteria' regardless of how long it sits on a shelf is just plain weird (imo) but hey it sells right?

ad gab:
CaribSea's all-natural formula makes the perfect substrate to not only enhance the look of your aquarium, but to also maintain the health of your live plants and keep them well nourished. Unlike most synthetic aquarium rocks, CaribSea Eco Complete contains a live Heterotrophic Bacteria, which is beneficial for sustaining a healthy aquatic environment as it helps to convert organic waste into a natural plant food. This Eco Complete fish tank rock gravel comes in a range of large and small grain gravel sizes that makes for a porous foundation for plants, which stimulates for healthy root growth and optimal bacterial efficiency. This substrate helps to maintain a healthy aquatic environment as it will not increase pH or water hardness as it is free of any carbonates and nitrates. This beautiful dark substrate creates a stunning contrast, which not only brings out the brilliant colors of your fish and live plants, but also helps to reduce fish stress. Add CaribSea Eco Complete substrate to your aquarium today and watch your plants flourish and your fish thrive.

Anybody else wanna throw a flag on this?
Experienced here was about a 2dKH rise in readings that lasted about 3 water changes. Not being a man made material I think the mined mineral composition can vary, that, added to whatever else is in the packaging soup it's shipped in. That said,, anything with a high CEC can be charged and if it's used in a water system of less mineral content the mineral salts and carbonate buffers leach until equilibrium is reached. Once the stored charge of mineral ions has been depleted the remaining rock is inert.

not a fan of the bang for the buck
 
#18 ·
Not being a man made material I think the mined mineral composition can vary, that, added to whatever else is in the packaging soup it's shipped in. That said,, anything with a high CEC can be charged and if it's used in a water system of less mineral content the mineral salts and carbonate buffers leach until equilibrium is reached. Once the stored charge of mineral ions has been depleted the remaining rock is inert.
Makes perfect sense Petrus.
haha! yes it does.

(now I'm looking for your posts to see what the pic will be next LOL)
 
#10 ·
I use this stuff for years now and will tell you that it doesn't even raise kh or gh at all.....I did all the test on it..when i got a GH and KH kit.

The tap coming out of my sink has a GH of 15. and when test in the tank...same thing with a slighly different of +1 .... this changes because the more ferts you add in the tank..the more it changes..

Before that I was dosing my tank heavly and the GH was well over 25. I stop dosing and limted it...now at GH 15 from the tap...woot!!
 
#12 ·
It is suppose to be inert, therefore expected to be so, but it is obviously not always the case. Seems half of us have had no change using the product while others have had the same experience as I did.

I just think that it is important for everyone to be aware of the chance that the bags they are getting may very well end up altering the pH,KH/GH. Be it from the liquid or the substrate itself is a mute point IMHO. I rinsed the crap out of this stuff because it said to do so right on the package. I rinsed this more than I have ever rinsed any tank product because it took quite a long time for the water to run clear. Once the water was clear, I still rinsed a few more times just for good measure. So in my case, it was not the liquid junk in the bag that caused the altering of my water, but the substrate itself.

By posting this I am not meaning to bash the product. I would use it again because I really like it. I just feel folks should be aware of the possible effects the product may have in their tanks. That's all. No more, no less.
 
#14 ·
It is suppose to be inert, therefore expected to be so, --- Seems half of us have had no change using the product while others have had the same experience as I did.

I just think that it is important for everyone to be aware of the chance that the bags they are getting may very well end up altering the pH,KH/GH.

By posting this I am not meaning to bash the product. I would use it again because I really like it. I just feel folks should be aware of the possible effects the product may have in their tanks. That's all. No more, no less.
point of view taken and respected.

nothing is perfect, never say never, never say always LOL
The heads up is valid and thanks for the effort.
(get a new cat? :smile:)
 
#16 ·
The thing to keep in mind is that eco complete, as well as other clay substrate products, are made from natural raw materials mined from the ground which can certainly experience batch-to-batch variations. While the majority may have quite consistent composition, there will be some batches which may contain impurities like carbonates or other substances. It is just simply too costly to QC the materials on that scale. They may take and analyze once every couple tons, but within that batch may also contain slight variations on a smaller scale as well.
 
#27 ·
Im wondering if people with soft tapwater are the only ones noticing a change. If you have hard water, you might not be able to see a difference. If I remember correctly, the scales for ph is logarithmic maybe, for KH as well.
That is an interesting theory...you might be on to something.
 
#22 ·
LMAO! it's a mined material not manufactured, so to have the mineral composition drift slightly from bag to bag shouldn't be so hard to believe. As I originally posted my experience was only a shift of 2dKH and the effect only lasted through a couple water changes. RO water and substrate only in the tank in question overnight before testing. The only reason the tank was flooded is that the stand is installed on thick carpet. I wanted the crush weight to settle into the padding for the final level adjustment.
I know the KH/pH shift was from the EC and nothing else.
Not concerned or bothered by it either,,, it was temporary.
 
#24 ·
Thank you for you suggestions everyone, but I do know it was from the substrate. I have had a tank for 2+ years and my pH has always been lower than neutral. For a bit I concidered raising it and learned of all the possibilities to do so.

For this tank, I decided to keep my pH right where it was at, or allow it to go a bit lower by adding driftwood.

The only thing that changed once the EC was in the tank was a huge piece of Mopani dw added after the last bag of EC was added. I can tell you this too. I am anal about checking my water parameters and do so daily. There was a noticable pH climb every time I added another bag. I did not do all the bags at once for the sake of avoiding a mini-cycle due to changing of substrates. Lucky that I did it this way so my fish could adjust. Thank goodness there is a 12 lb piece of Mopani in the tank as well as some Manzanita and a few other small peices of Mopani in the tank otherwise my Angelfish would be suffereing due to the EC.

Since posting this, I have not noticed any drop at all in pH or KH. I have added plants and some inert lake rocks to the tank. Everything is stable, and that is what matters now. Although, I do hope to see a slow drop at least to pH 6.8. I also have Kuhli Loach in the tank which will fair better below neutral. They are fine for now, but it's the long term effects that concern me.

Anyway! Thanks all of you for trying to help figure out this controversal issue. :icon_lol: I appreciate everyones input.

Amanda
 
#29 ·
High Ph Eco Complete

Just an update on my eco situation. I bought 20 20lb bags of this for my 300 gallon plan planted tank and it has been hell. My tap comes out at 7.0 and is extremely hard, dKH 6 and GH about 300. After having things up and running for a couple weeks and started cycling my ph went to 8.3 and stayed there. I have done massive water changes over the last 3 weeks and still its at 8.3. I have run multiple tests on water in and outsude the tank, I have removed a large piece of driftwood that was in an African tank for 3 months becuase I thought it my be leeching. Nothing left but the substrate. I am now 6 weeks in and no sign if this letting up. I am now planted with injected co2 (whole other issue with co2 on a large tank) and I bring the ph down to 7.3 during the day and it shoots back up to 8.3 at night. Small amounts of fish I do have dont seem to mind and apparently this is fairly normal in a co2 injected tank.
I do daily 10% water changes and still no sign of this settling down. I will not add more fish, planning on a large Discus group,intil this gets sorted out
 
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