Various algae taking over my tank, please help! "EI dosing & Co2" - Page 2
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Old 02-02-2014, 12:23 PM   #16
Raymond S.
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Yes and from your answer I know that you know why I asked. That one wasn't about the algae. I was thinking about when you said your luck/w fish was not so good.
This time(the first was in the 60's) when I started back into tanks I had one ten G tank/w a cardboard box on top housing a CFL bulb for a light. Had broken shale for a sub/w tan detrius filling in between. Grew great native(guppy grass)plants. Had green spot algae on the rocks but not much other algae. Everything was fine untill I bought regular fine gravel and put two flourescent strip lights on it. It's taken me the following 2.5 years to learn how to control it but I only started using this forum for info for a year now. Learning to handle the causes of it works slower but in the long it works much better. I now (due to lease limits) have two ten G tanks...one/w two T8 bulbs on it and one/w two T5 bulbs on it and very little algae that I didn't grow intentionally.
The one/w the T5 has Excel daily/ferts weekly but the other has no Excel and very light ferts. Getting info from here will make that learning process much shorter.
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Old 02-04-2014, 08:00 PM   #17
Jafooli
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Thanks Raymond

I just want to give a update on my situation, and I'm hoping someone can help me out or advise me on what to do next.

So today I did a re-count on my CO2, and to my surprise my CO2 was running at 3bps so I now know its somehow changed from the 2.6 I had it at, therefor I now know my regulator needle valve can not handle the pressure around 2.6 +.....

Before I had algae problems my co2 was at 1.8bps and I know it stayed stable there, and like I said I upped it to try get faster growths, anyway as of now I've turned it all the way to 1.5 and it's staying nice and stable but will keep an eye on it.

So what should people look out for when they adjust CO2, whether it be up or down, should it be done slowly toward your goal? or can you turn it up or down as much as you want, obviously people want to achieve 30ppm but should this be done slowly or what?

Also as Raymond pointed out in one of his tanks he doses Excel which when I hear about Excel its normally for low tech tanks to provide the co2... or to treat BBA etc, and in his other small tank no CO2 but light ferts...... So when should you use CO2?

Which leads me to this if you didn't already notice lol....I've set my CO2 to 1.5bps and not back to 1.8bps, I said to my self.... my plants are low light/demanding? so why should I aim for 2.6bps and add all the extra CO2, I guess I can only put it up so much before the algae benefits all the excess as the plants can't grow as fast and why would they take up all the co2, if there low demanding? in my case.

I also do use a drop checker so will keep an eye out tomorrow to see if it stays lime green throughout, I would also guess my co2 will now be at around 20ppm.... which leads me to my main question....should all tanks aim for 30ppm? if so why?

If I was blessed with high lights and plants that require high lighting and more nutrient demand, surely this tank would benefit from the higher CO2 levels (30ppm) and the system overall will work much better (Tank1). but in my case I went to around 2.6bps, which I now know wasn't stable... but most of my plants are low light, slow growers, mainly crypts, echindorus, so surely if I was at 30ppm my tank would not benefit as much as tank 1 would? Hope that make's sense. I've probably got this all wrong but hey.....

So my tank a 200g is pretty to large to start dosing Excel, I've got low light, low demanding plants, should I even use CO2? I'm nearly overstocked with fish, so the CO2 could come from here?... I wish I had more demanding plants but I don't, Yes I have purchased some plants that require more lighting around 0.5wpg, and in my tank there growth is pretty poor and it takes months, example Lileopsis has done nothing since I planted it, my glosso has not done much.

Will my tank benefit just as much, if I keep the co2 around 20ppm? I can only presume its around there tomorrow, or will I see problems? Should I even use CO2???? for my plants? and just dose my ferts instead? my girlfriends fluval EBI, has no ferts, no co2, but yet her plants still grow, slow but they grow, and mostly stay algae free, before I knew about CO2, my plants grew in my 90g... but like everyone on this site, I want to grow plants!!! and give them the good stuff they need.

So maybe because of my lights, its best for me to keep it lower on the CO2? or stop it all together? I really want a tank that Tropica would be proud of, or even a tank Tom would be impressed with lol, but I just don't think my tank has the correct set-up, aka the heart, the light power to drive my plants.

So any advice on this would be great.... and most importantly what you would do with my tank?

Sorry If I've got it all totally wrong, and that the lowest light plant demanding tanks need the same CO2, as the high end tanks. I just am not sure and I've read many articles in the past and don't recall any of this being mentioned, sorry if it has.

Also one last question to throw in, how do I lower green spot algae on the glass? I pretty much guess everyone gets it??? it does my head in, and makes my arm ache! I do it every week, but it still gets there.

Think I've about covered it lol, and one day I will buy a rimless tank, and purchase the highest, most brightest lights out there, then get the distance correct as I don't want algae on that future tank and then purchase the fastest growing plants in the hobby , but for now I cant I have to make do with my new 200gallon and Eco Complete, that didn't come cheap either lol.

Thanks to anyone if they can help or offer there advice, I'm also considering on removing my carpeting plants, I tried my best with what I had, but there never going to grow at the speed I want or give me the carpeting effect, so maybe I should try some more crypts, stems or find some plants I've yet to try.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:17 PM   #18
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You can use both Excel and CO2 at the same time. Many people use Excel as an algacide, though it's not advertised as such. Some plants other than algae may also be sensitive, so find out about your plants before trying Excel.

You can either treat the whole tank, I think some people double-dose, though I've never done that.

You can also turn off pumps, filters, bubblers -- anything that creates water flow, and use a syringe or pipette to spray directly on a problem spot, and wait a few minutes (I don't know how many... 10?) before turning everything back on, and the spot treated algae should be dead or dying within a day or so.

I'm not recommending you use excel, these are just bit and pieces I've picked up from reading the forum.
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Old 02-05-2014, 11:34 AM   #19
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Ok I'm looking at your ph and KH it looks to me that you have to much co2 in your tank, t8 are not a best bulb for growing plant t5 work better so the demand on your plant is low it's all based on the lights focus on the kelvin of the bulb not the watts 6,500k is the best for growing plant it gives you the heights PAR her is a chart that will help you with your co2 levels
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Old 02-05-2014, 12:04 PM   #20
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Thanks for replies jrh & fishliyorker

Jrh what you said about Excel is pretty much what I've read as-well, so I guess I can say there is hardly no point in me going down that route.

To Fishliyorker thanks for the chart,

PH 7.4 - KH 12 would give me 15ppm co2 if I used that chart, I would say that my ph is prob around 7 and not 7.4, that would then give me 38ppm of co2, Its hard to be accurate on the api ph kit, the blue shades are quite similar.

Thanks for helping and the input, but I am still no more the wise if I should even use CO2 for my tank? what should I aim for? if 30ppm? then why? my plants would just benefit as much at 20ppm? since there low demanding, like mentioned in my past post, and with my stocking of fish, and low demanding plants, my fish may provide sufficient co2 for my low end tank?

I hope someone can help, also to add quick if my CO2 was at 3bps a day ago, which I didn't realize, that would of drove my CO2 down even more, not sure what effects it would have on my KH, but that means my CO2 could of been at around 96ppm lol, I did see some of my fish gasping, hence why I decided to count, and I realized it increased from the 2.6 I set it at, fish seem better today.

Thanks again.
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Old 02-05-2014, 12:32 PM   #21
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From what your are saying the only thing you change was you increased you co2 and then you algae problem started if the bulb are older than 6 month is possible that it's past it life and your plant are not take up the nutrient as they were in the past, I had the same thing happen with my tank, I had to add two 6500 LED flood lights and a hydro 425 for more water flow, I'm going to add another hydro on the other side my fluval's work for surface agitation but I need more water flow in the tank on the bottom.
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Old 02-05-2014, 12:46 PM   #22
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I use my milwaukee mc 122 controller to see where my PH is at all time it helps me read my PH I know how frustrating it is to use the API test kits, but your PH is what you use to control your co2 once you have your KH with that you increase or decrease your co2 to reach a target of around 25ppm of co2, the KH should not change unless your are changing it with your dosing I dose the aquavitro liquid firts so I don't know if your dosing changes your KH maybe some els here can help you with that I target a KH of 6ppm.
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Old 02-05-2014, 02:47 PM   #23
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You have what amounts to low light and ifd you follow roadmaster's suggested ferts you would have a fairly high amount of that. Thus the weekly water changes of 50% so there is no build up. Because you don't have med or high lights you don't need
large amounts of CO2. 2PS would be ine and you can lower it later till you see a
drop in growth and then you will have pinpointed where it works best.
But give it about three weeks for the plants to get growing fully at whatever rate they will from the new ferts. Remanber you can't repair old leaves. Any good growth/appearence will be in the new growth. After about three days to get the plants taking up the ferts fully you can cut off things like that one perticular bad leaf on the sword for example. No need to be complete or anything radical. Just being rid of a few of the worst ones. 2 months from now yu won't recognize the sword plant.
Be patient/w any algae as the new/better growth will eventually remove most of it.
Like I said before that sword was cannibalizing it's self(the old leaves) for nutrients.
The Wisteria is actually hard to grow clean. It is a fast grower and needs more Potassium than other plants do. So keeping it without holes in the leaves lets you know you have enough of that since it will show signs quicker than most plants will.
Don't be surprised if it gets new sprouts at or near the bottom soon either. They will help hide the missing leaves that will eventually fall off because they were damaged.
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Old 02-05-2014, 04:08 PM   #24
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Cheers for the help guys,

My bulbs are around 4 months old so will have to see about purchasing some new one's in a couple of months, surely they should be giving out enough light to grow most of my plants , I'm more convinced its another issue, I've had my water lettuce cover the whole of my tank surface and was still getting growth below, and the tank had a nice dark tropical forest effect for my espei's.


Also about using PH and KH to control co2, my KH was once 8 a few months back and its now 12? so why has my KH increased? all I do is dose ferts ... :S

Thanks Raymond also the only issue with roadmaster's suggested ferts was KNO3, I don't use KNO3 as my nitrate is always off the scales, I guess it's my water area, it never goes lower then 40ish ppm, if that be my pond, my girlfriends tank, my tank...

I also do not dose dry, but I also do use KH2PO4 & MGSO4 and K2SO4, maybe I was just laying of the K2SO4 to much, I've upped my K2SO4 dosing anyway, so will see how it goes, and then I have my trace mix so hopefully I'm about covered for everything, + I've purchased some new root tabs, I can only hope it was because of the major increase in CO2, rather than my lights failing, the algae did happen all of a great sudden and I must admit things are looking better, but I've now had to lower the CO2 back down, so will give it time to adjust and keep an eye on things.

It's so stressful at times, especially when I'm less experienced and knowledgeable as you guys, but its good to know I don't need as much Co2.

Funny you mention my Wisteria as-well, that plant is another one of my fast growers and it normally reaches the surface in about 2 weeks, I normally then remove the whole plant, yeah the whole plant lol, and plant a cutting, and boom repeat again in another 2 weeks, but since the algae take over, its struggling, especially as it was a baby cutting as-well, hopefully it will get going!!!! Like I said its like the whole system has crashed =\ wish I never changed the CO2, I just wanted the carpeting effect =\

Thanks again, so if anyone can let me know why the KH has risen? because I don't understand that one, and I would like my KH & GH to be wayyyyyy lower, with out needing to add stuff and for now I cant invest in a PH controller so will have to make do... as I'm also sure its making it harder for me to breed fish, such as my tetra's and rasbora who prefer much softer water! :O
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Old 02-06-2014, 12:00 AM   #25
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Don'thave that much experience/w KH but I do suspect it to be seasonlly related
to the water supply. In some arias they also change back and fourth from lake/river to aquafilter supply locations at different times a year. This obviously CAN effect the Kh in your supply water. Bulbs are alleged to last 9 months as "they" say that the coating on the inside degenerates which changes the spectrum of light given off by the bulb.
Exactly to what extent this is a sales ploy, I have no clue.
I use KNO4/KH2PO4/K2So4 as my fert list(Macros) and the K2SO4 was added because of a recommendation from a trusted member on why my Wisteria wasn't doing well. He suggested aditional Potassium from that to be added.
I stoped short of saying that the bottom of the stem on the Wisteria would become bare of leaves as it grew(especially n this case as the damaged leaves would fall from that part of it)and that those new sprouts would help cover that. But what I didn't add was that at the time it got too big as it would in any less than 24" tall tank, you could always cut it off just about 3" down from the bottom most leaf and re plant it. But seems as you already do your own version of that one...LOL...
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Old 02-06-2014, 07:58 PM   #26
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I will just leave it alone then regarding GH & KH, I did a w/c today and will do another Sunday, the tank seems to be calming down now I lowered the CO2.

The only issue I have now came across is my regulator is changing its BPS, it seems to keep increasing very slowly, which I will need to somehow sort out, but I have no idea.

Thanks for everyone's help.
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