BN spawn - little help please
Planted Tank Forums
Your Tanks Image Hosting *Tank Tracker * Plant Profiles Fish Profiles Planted Tank Guide Photo Gallery Articles

Go Back   The Planted Tank Forum > Specific Aspects of a Planted Tank > Fish


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-28-2013, 05:39 PM   #1
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

BN spawn - little help please


Looks like my latest pair of BNs have had a fun time together in the 20L - the male is currently fanning a big pile of eggs stuck to the cave-like roof of a piece of mopani wood.

Tank currently houses 2 BNs (1 male, 1 female), 1 opal gourami and 4 random corydoras catfish. Oh, and a giant mess of assassin snails.

I noted that the gourami is sticking to one area lately, and that I've only seen the female BN attached to the zucchini I provide. Normally the male would let her eat for a while and then shoo her off so he can enjoy.

Sure enough, there's a tail sticking out from underneath the log, and there's plenty of orange eggs inside. Caring for the fry isn't difficult, but here's where I need some direction:

I know the gourami would happily munch any free-swimming fry that get past daddy. It ignores the catfish, but would eat the fry. Of all my tanks, I don't really have one he could be moved to, safely. I have a feeling he'd tear up my black neon and otto tank, I obviously can't put him in the betta tank, and if I put him in with the convict, he'd turn into a fishy chew toy.

I have a spare 5 gallon tank that I could clean out and bare bottom for fry. I'd have to get a filter for it and a more reliable heater, but I could do it. The issue becomes this: do I try to remove the log and the male and put them in the smaller tank until the fry hatch, or do I wait until the fry hatch and then scoop them out and put them in the grow-out tank?
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 09-28-2013, 05:50 PM   #2
starfire12
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
starfire12's Avatar
 
PTrader: (34/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Burlington, Washington
Posts: 559
Default

I have successfully moved a cave with the male and eggs inside to another tank. Unfortunately you would have to let the tank cycle before moving them unless you have a seeded filter and use water from the tank they are in now. I have also waited till they hatched and then washed the fry out into another tank.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free
__________________
I used to keep an open mind but my brains kept falling out.
starfire12 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-28-2013, 06:17 PM   #3
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

I pack the hang on backs with so much sponge that I could easily remove a large portion and install that into the filter for the 5 gallon, and I could probably move some substrate as well, but I'd prefer the grow out be bare bottom.

The 5 gallon is currently a dirt and sand tank with no filtration that's just slow growing some bacopa. It's in the basement, so bugs like to fall in and become plant food. The 20L was due for a water change today anyway, so I could easily move water from it into the 5.

I'd say the eggs are probably 3-5 days old, so I'm trying to get my ducks in a row quickly.



Moving the log and male seems risky, and the male clearly has the gourami under control (read, afraid).

Edit: Hookay...I've noticed that the eggs have tails. I suspect I'll have free swimming fry with yolk sacs this weekend.

Last edited by Virto; 09-28-2013 at 06:23 PM.. Reason: Update
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-10-2013, 05:15 AM   #4
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

Short update - I've moved the gourami and the cory cats to the 46. Mom and dad pleco will join them in a week or so, after dad is all done protecting fry. I haven't been able to get a count, but there are dozens of fry, which are now free-swimming and feeding on veggies.

The cool thing is, since mom and dad are just LFS mutts, half of the brood is albino and half is brown, with a few scattered in that are bronze or almost entirely clear. I'll be keeping one or two from the brood and moving them to the bowfront with the parents after they're large enough - the rest will either be sold or traded to an LFS or two.

I've really enjoyed this experience so far. Thanks much for the help both in this thread and those I found while searching.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-11-2013, 04:53 AM   #5
Luminescent
Planted Member
 
Luminescent's Avatar
 
PTrader: (3/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: US
Posts: 233
Default

Love to see some pictures.
Luminescent is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-11-2013, 06:22 PM   #6
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

I'll see if I can get any tonight. I've been keeping the lights off so they're more likely to come out and feed.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-11-2013, 11:15 PM   #7
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

Here are a few of the little scamps. The brood is about 50/50 mottled/albino, are now all free-swimming and enjoying green vegetables.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	brownplecos.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	137.9 KB
ID:	220337  

Click image for larger version

Name:	albplecos.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	59.0 KB
ID:	220345  

__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-12-2013, 04:43 AM   #8
SueD
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Franklin, MA
Posts: 205
Default

Congrats! I have just over a dozen BN fry that are a month old from my male albino and female brown BN. Not one came out albino! But they are so cute - about an inch long now. They are dark brown with white speckles and their fins are edged in white, something the female doesn't have.

Mine are all in just a 10 gal with several guppies and I suspect pop is now caring for a new batch. I caught ma in the man-cave about a week ago for a short time and pop hasn't been out since. Time to visit my LFS and see how old they need to be to make a deal. Catching them will be a challenge, especially if there is a new batch to contend with.
SueD is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-21-2013, 10:40 PM   #9
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

Well...sh--

I noticed over the weekend that I wasn't seeing as many fry stuck to the glass of the tank as I was before. Some investigation led me to realize that most of the hatch is simply...gone.

I floated some zucchini in the tank and netted out a couple of the albinos. There were still a few albinos and two darker fry that I could find left in the 20L. I moved the pair I netted to the tetra/otto tank, where they spent the night nomming away on veggies with the ottos. All seems well there.

Now, the very serious question is: what happened to the bulk of my fry? The only tank inhabitants are the fry themselves, dad fish and mom fish, as well as far too many assassin snails.

I baited and culled probably 20 assassins this weekend, just because they never seem to stop reproducing. Now I'm concerned that they were able to jab the healthy fry and then consume them. The fry are not more than 1.5cm long at this stage. I have found no corpses.

I also wasn't able to find any documentation stating that either assassins or adult plecos would hunt or consume fry.

This is really pretty depressing for the wife and I. Although I wasn't looking forward to re-homing a few dozen plecos, they were my little charges and I've obviously failed them. We weren't expecting or prepared for this kind of thing, but I didn't honestly expect to run into any issues with the inhabitants of the tank, once the gourami was removed.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-22-2013, 12:17 AM   #10
Grah the great
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
Grah the great's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Maine
Posts: 811
Default

...maybe dad and mom happened? Non-cichlids which show parental care (I.E bettas) are infamous for turning on their spawn after they are free swimming. I wouldn't be surprised if the parents are responsible.
Grah the great is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-22-2013, 12:44 AM   #11
wicca27
Planted Tank Guru
 
wicca27's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Dewey
Posts: 4,817
Send a message via Yahoo to wicca27
Default

dont feel bad the same thing happened to me. it was probably lack of food. babies need lots of food and its best for them to be in bare bottom tanks cause as much as they need will foul tank water fast if not cleaned often. a friend of mine would feed hers all kinds of food up to 5 times a day. i had maybe 20 eggs (i scared the male and he kicked at least half the eggs out) and only ended up with 6 when they got older.
wicca27 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-22-2013, 02:52 AM   #12
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

I've been cleaning the tank regularly and feeding daily - I had monster zucs this year, so there's been tons of food in the tank for them and the parents. The fry seem to have no issue getting to or eating the zucchini.

If they did starve off, I could see the assassins playing cleanup, but I'm still not sure that's what we're dealing with. I'll keep an eye on the remainder.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-22-2013, 09:53 PM   #13
steven p
Wannabe Guru
 
steven p's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: columbus, ne
Posts: 1,521
Default

I just snatch eggs from daddy, which can be really fun.... If you like going shoulder deep in water to fight a 4 inch angry father.

Canned green beans, blanched mulberry leaves that have been left in a bucket of water change water, spinach, many squashes and much more are all taken by the fry with vigor. I have random losses in my tanks too, I try to keep floaters and Guppy grass in the tank, along with this big chunk of a random philodendron looking plant growing out of the water to help control free nutrients in the fry tank.
__________________
steven p is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-22-2013, 10:10 PM   #14
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

Well, I'm assuming that most of the clutch has been or will be lost at this point. By moving some out to another tank I hope to have saved at least a couple, but time will tell. I really wasn't prepared for such an event, so as much as I hate to think of the fish as little victims, it's been a learning experience.

Should mom and pop go at it again, I think I'll pull the log (or other cave) out of the tank once I've confirmed that he's protecting eggs. Last time I became aware, the eggs had already started to hatch. I'll just pull the cave and quickly transplant it in a bare bottom tank, and then net out pop and deposit him there, as well.

The only real upside to all this is that I can break down the tank more quickly. Mom and pop will go into the 46 and then I can empty out and bleach bomb the 20L. It's been a big source of problems over the ages.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-24-2013, 02:00 AM   #15
Virto
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 397
Default

Well, somewhat predictably, I came home to find mom and pop enjoying a bit of the ol' touchy-feely. There's zero doubt that they're spawning again as I type.

This time I'm better prepared, but this screws up my break down tank, move snails to 5gal plan. Instead, I'll be moving the log cave and Mr. Manfish over there, which will be easier to clean and easier to keep an eye on. I'm going to have to figure out a quick snail plan.
__________________
SunSun Pimp #86
Virto is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Planted Tank LLC 2012