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Old 09-25-2013, 07:25 PM   #31
roadmaster
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Supposed weight gain could have been from the lead in azomite.(say's with chuckle).
Fish pictured on control feed before azomite,looked emaciated, and would indeed in my view be more suceptible to disease,parasites.
Enter miracle grow feed, (or any other feed)fatten em up,,and stronger immune system. less disease.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:34 PM   #32
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Lets not turn this into one of those threads. I'm sure there is some benefit to using this in aquaculture the same way kelp meal is used or why would these fish/shrimp farms use it. I agree with Tom in the fact that these minor trace elements are not that important but for me it's all about trying to find a cheaper alternative for dosing and the fact that it's natural is a bonus for me.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:12 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by plantbrain View Post
Ni is proven results in planted tanks? Really? Forget light intensity and CO2, it's all about some hyper minor trace? I agree with what Zapins stated. This would be incredibly difficult to demonstrate for a researcher, let alone a hobbyists.

CMS does fine, I think finding another product or source is fine also, particularly if it is cheaper and more available. If it has these other minor minor traces just to be sexy, well hunky dory.

I've yet to find any plant species that I cannot grow quite well using CMS.
In fact, I have long offered challenges to others making such claims for various nutrients, ppm's and I've never lost yet after 20 years now. Name the plant that has trouble specific to these traces and is improved by this?
You need to be able to state this, otherwise it's pie in the sky and you have no clear hypothesis to test.

So the real issue is one that offers another product that is similar, does the same type of job and is cheap/more available etc. I'm on board there. The rest is speculation/wishful thinking I would argue.
Tom i have never claimed that we need to have those Traces, CSM+B works fine i have already stated it in my post, if things can improve it further why not try it, if Nickel have no effect on plant growth then why does Seachem Flourish Trace uses it? i have seen other traces don't use it beside seachem, could this be because seachem uses Urea in their Nitrogen? Nickel is beneficial when you use NH4/Urea Nitrogen. i could be wrong on whatever i have said but Kekon at APC have added it and he claim it does help the plant.

i cannot confirm his claim because i haven't tried it yet, until then we should wait.
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Old 09-25-2013, 09:01 PM   #34
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I have much respect for kekon. He used to make his own micros from the ground up rather than using premade products. Can you link the thread where he talks about adding Ni?
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Old 09-25-2013, 11:01 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Zapins View Post
I have much respect for kekon. He used to make his own micros from the ground up rather than using premade products. Can you link the thread where he talks about adding Ni?
Quote from Kekon

Quote:
Together with my friend we decided to dose plain urea in our tanks as a source of nitrogen. Personally i dosed about 0.5 ppm of N from urea. After a week new leaves were about 2 times bigger than normal ones. No algae appeared. Nitrates level stayed almost unchanged during the experiment (i didn't dose NO3 but only urea). It showed that plants preferred urea over NO3. No other parameters were changed (micros, PO4, Ca, Mg etc. weren't changed). We also added some nickel into water (NiCl2 * 6H2O) as it seemed plants needed nickel to produce urease to convert urea. I don't have any photos yet but i'll run the experiment once again to confirm my experiences and take some photos of my plants.
he talks about benefits of using Nickel when dosing with Urea or Seachem nitrogen, in my case this is important because i dose heavy Urea in my tank, you can look at my thread in my signature. he never said we have to use Nickel, but its useful while dosing Urea, here is the link:

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...cro-ferts.html
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Old 09-26-2013, 10:53 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ua hua View Post
Lets not turn this into one of those threads. I'm sure there is some benefit to using this in aquaculture the same way kelp meal is used or why would these fish/shrimp farms use it. I agree with Tom in the fact that these minor trace elements are not that important but for me it's all about trying to find a cheaper alternative for dosing and the fact that it's natural is a bonus for me.

Azomite that they used as feed supplement according to ingredient list on video, made no mention of lead,mercury,arsenic, that appear's on list of ingredient's if you just google content of the azomite.
I think this makes sense,not many folk's want to eat fish/shrimp that have ingested the lead,mercury,arsenic.
Maybe is different formula for plant's,crops,than what is used in video as feed supplement or...they convienently left out the lead,mercury,arsenic.
My brother has some of the azomite left, and while I might give it a go in plant only tank in the future,,I don't think I will risk trying it with my fishes,shrimp's no matter how miniscule the proportion of offending ingredient's.
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